Joe B. All-22 vs Cowboys: Ford may have sealed his fate as a Guard in 2020

[RocCityRoller]

3 hours ago, PetermansRedemption said:

I wanted Metcalf

 

Metcalf had a game turning fumble and can't block DEs either.

 

You protect your franchise, then get him weapons.

 

2020 I see:

 

Dawkins, Ford, Morse, Feliciano, Unknown

[GregPersons]

3 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

I've taken some heat for mocking his pass pro lately.     It's just been a fact that.   He's not good in pass pro.

 

But two of his worst plays Thursday did lead to TD's.......Allen bolting from the pocket and throwing the TD pass to Beasley and running the other one in for a TD.

 

As I've said........the good things are that Ford is on Allen's front side so he can keep an eye on his whiffs and that Allen can get away and make big plays out of the pocket.

 

 

Good point. Moving him to LG might be a net negative if he doesn't improve his technique.

[RocCityRoller]

21 minutes ago, FeelingOnYouboty said:

Ford is a Pro Bowl RG. An average or above average RT.

 

Do you move Feliciano from RG? He is the lifeblood of the OL.

 

I move Ford to LG. Maybe resign Spain for a year or two if you can and let them fight it out. Draft or FA a true RT. Maybe Cordy Glenn will be available

[NoSaint]

3 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

It's not unheard of for OL players to improve a lot with a good offseason.

 

I personally am not in favor of moving on from Spain.

Technique, footwork, hand placement, strength- often see jumps 
 

quickness worries me a bit more with a guard/tackle tweener. It’s possible and could be technique driven- but it just strikes me as the harder fix (or you’d see more opportunities to kick raw guards outside as you fix their feet)

 

 

 

[YoloinOhio]

15 minutes ago, BuffaloBaumer said:

Why did i think Tye was pretty much done for the season? Day to day is great news...

He was Week to week... upgraded yesterday to day to day. McD never gave specifics but appears to be a bad sprain. 

[Richard Noggin]

29 minutes ago, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

Ford to LT is the part of that that makes no sense. He hasn't got the mobility for RT, much less LT.

 

We've got no problem at LT anyway. There's a guy there doing a good job. Expect Ford to be either at guard or maybe at RT if we can't get anyone better (Nsekhe?).

I'm pretty sure the poster meant L-Gee there, rather than L-Tee, and just messed up. 

 

Like if you isolate many of Steve Tasker's rapid/rambling statements on OBL, you'll note a variety of juxtaposed or conflated or just mistaken stats/details...but at the same time you probably understand what he intended to say. 

 

You're a really sharp poster, so I'll bet you can see that upon further review. He (the poster you're quoting) did it with the right side, too.

[Doc]

25 minutes ago, RocCityRoller said:

Metcalf had a game turning fumble and can't block DEs either.

 

You protect your franchise, then get him weapons.

 

2020 I see:

 

Dawkins, Ford, Morse, Feliciano, Unknown

 

Unknown=Bates.

[Thurman#1]

3 hours ago, Dablitzkrieg said:

Why do people take what Joe B says as Gospel?  He is just stating an opinion.  He is not some film guru. 

 

 

Watching film doesn't require a guru. It's really pretty easy to tell what's going on.

 

The tough part of watching film is putting in the time. If you're going to watch every play, as Joe does, you will end up spending an awful lot of time. And if you're going to watch every snap for every player, the time requirement becomes massive. And no, you can't understand what a guy was supposed to do on every single play. Occasionally it's not clear. For example, when a DL runs free between two unengaged OLs and gets a sack, whose fault was it? Which guy had the assignment. You don't know. But those situations don't come up all that often.

 

Mostly it's easy to see, because though you don't have the play or the assignment, you have the benefit of hindsight. Right around 90% of plays are really pretty easy to understand with that hindsight. If you're not sure, you need to not blame anyone, and that is the way that PFF, Joe B., and any film-watcher worth his salt operates.

[RocCityRoller]

2020 FA OT

 

Discuss amongst yourselves

 

Name                    POS AGE               2019 SALARY

Andrew Whitworth	LT	38	LAR	TBD	$11,250,000	UFA	-
Anthony Castonzo	LT	32	IND	TBD	$10,953,000	UFA	-
Kelvin Beachum	LT	30	NYJ	TBD	$8,000,000	UFA	-
Bryan Bulaga	RT	31	GB	TBD	$6,750,000	UFA	-
Greg Robinson	LT	27	CLE	TBD	$6,400,000	UFA	-
Marcus Gilbert	RT	32	ARI	TBD	$6,163,000	UFA	-
Jason Peters	LT	38	PHI	TBD	$6,000,000	UFA	-
Daryl Williams	RT	28	CAR	TBD	$6,000,000	UFA	-
Demar Dotson	RT	34	TB	TBD	$5,500,000	UFA	-
Jack Conklin	RT	26	TEN	TBD	$3,974,415	UFA	-
Cameron Fleming	T	27	DAL	-	$3,750,000	CO	-
Jared Veldheer	RT	33	GB	TBD	$3,500,000	UFA	-
George Fant	T	28	SEA	TBD	$3,095,000	UFA	-
Mike Remmers	RT	31	NYG	TBD	$2,500,000	UFA	-
D.J. Humphries	LT	26	ARI	TBD	$2,228,028	UFA	-
Germain Ifedi	RT	26	SEA	TBD	$2,066,276	UFA	-
Donald Penn	RT	37	WAS	TBD	$2,030,000	UFA	-
LaAdrian Waddle	RT	29	BUF	TBD	$2,000,000	UFA	-
Denzelle Good	RT	29	OAK	TBD	$1,800,000	UFA	-
Dennis Kelly	RT	30	TEN	TBD	$1,525,000	UFA	-
Brent Qvale	RT	29	NYJ	TBD	$1,400,000	UFA	-
Jason Spriggs	T	26	GB	TBD	$1,251,073	UFA	-
Oday Aboushi	T	29	DET	TBD	$1,250,000	UFA	-
Jordan Mills	RT	29	ARI	TBD	$1,250,000	UFA

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

3 hours ago, TH3 said:

Not for nothing....but other than enthusiasm.....does Joe B have any qualifications to be breaking down film?

I’ve sort of written off these all-22 takes By the amateurs because they all seem to be completely conflicted. 

[BADOLBILZ]

31 minutes ago, NoSaint said:

Technique, footwork, hand placement, strength- often see jumps 
 

quickness worries me a bit more with a guard/tackle tweener. It’s possible and could be technique driven- but it just strikes me as the harder fix (or you’d see more opportunities to kick raw guards outside as you fix their feet)

 

 

 

 

Yeah Ford is an athlete in motion but his feet are not nimble.

 

I could see Mitch Morse ending up at RT next year.  He might be the most athletic guy on their line.   Tackle in college........concussion issues are a huge concern at center.........somewhat less at RT.    

 

Feliciano and Bates might be able to handle the C1 and C2 spots.

[John from Riverside]

1 hour ago, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

Ford to LT is the part of that that makes no sense. He hasn't got the mobility for RT, much less LT.

 

We've got no problem at LT anyway. There's a guy there doing a good job. Expect Ford to be either at guard or maybe at RT if we can't get anyone better (Nsekhe?).

Sorry....Ford to LG

[Hapless Bills Fan]

1 hour ago, scuba guy said:

There was one play during the game where Romo said something like omg he has got all day back there

 

I looked at the tv (st loius We where eating) AND THOUGHT where is ford and he was all by himself handling the de

 

Know it was just one play and Josh went to his left but he did have 5 sec (we tevo it)

 

I know what play you're talking about.  

 

There have been occasions where  Ford was beat or almost beat and Allen was able to move about to avoid the sack, but that stuff's gonna happen.  In the most recent games, it was often happening three-onethousand after the snap.  Denver and Dallas both very good pass Ds.

 

And frankly the Ford-just-can't-cut-it-in-pass-pro thing doesn't pass the "sniff test" for me.  Allen was giving plays a lot of time to develop in Dallas at times.  That just doesn't happen if the RT blows chunks in pass pro.

 

OK, I got to share this, one of my favorite funny plays vs Denver.  Third and 12 at the Buf 32.  This is three-onethousand after the snap.  Ford has just lost Attaochu, who has a nice bead drawn up on Allen (helmet just to the r of the hash marks).  Morse has lost his guy too:

Wait?  Where's Waldo - I mean, Allen?  Allen jukes right and makes two Broncos miss (that's the feet of a sprawling Bronco just above Allen's back).  Attaochu runs smack into the back of Dawkins!   "Damn, where is that QB guy?  He was just here!"

And he's on his way!

(Memo to Bills Defense: if you try to tackle Lamar Jackson this way, don't expect it to work.  He'll fly past ya.)

[Thurman#1]

1 hour ago, Richard Noggin said:

I'm pretty sure the poster meant L-Gee there, rather than L-Tee, and just messed up. 

 

Like if you isolate many of Steve Tasker's rapid/rambling statements on OBL, you'll note a variety of juxtaposed or conflated or just mistaken stats/details...but at the same time you probably understand what he intended to say. 

 

You're a really sharp poster, so I'll bet you can see that upon further review. He (the poster you're quoting) did it with the right side, too.

 

 

LG? Ah, OK, fair enough. If that's what he meant, it makes a lot of sense to me, though I'm not sure between LG and RG for Ford.

 

28 minutes ago, John from Riverside said:

Sorry....Ford to LG

 

Ah, you did mean that. Sorry. Makes sense then.

 

I don't see anyone talking about Nsekhe at RT. I think they might just keep him. Roc City Roller posted a list of FAs. That's where our next RT will likely come from, if it's not Nsekhe, IMO. I've always like Bulaga. Bulaga's last contract was a 5 year deal for $33.75 mill. If they like him, that's a kind of deal the Bills might consider.

Edited December 4, 2019 by Thurman#1

[Thurman#1]

2 hours ago, whatdrought said:

 

 

Nah, he was complementing his pass protection. 

 

https://mobile.twitter.com/BaldyNFL/status/1200910082655084544

 

 

"@BuffaloBills @dallascowboys @DDawkins @CodyFord  had another outstanding performance on Thanksgiving. They are reaching a level of consistency in Pass Protection whereby they don't believe they need help and the results are more options for @JoshAllenQB  #BaldysBreakdowns."

 

I don't see anything there specific to Ford's pass protection. He's complementing the Bills OL's pass protection as a whole. He says some nice things about Ford in the audio, but again as Allen is forced by Ford's guy to step up.

 

More, Baldinger clearly isn't claiming to have gone play-by-play there. He's giving his overall impression, though that's valuable, Baldy's smart. And it's pretty funny that he says that and then as an example shows a video of a different play where Ford is beaten around the edge, and Baldy says, "but the quarterback has a great feel ... when to step up," as Allen avoids the guy who got around Ford by stepping up and heading for the sideline.

 

I like Baldinger, he's good with his video and his breakdowns.

Edited December 4, 2019 by Thurman#1

[Thurman#1]

2 hours ago, scuba guy said:

There was one play during the game where Romo said something like omg he has got all day back there

 

I looked at the tv (st loius We where eating) AND THOUGHT where is ford and he was all by himself handling the de

 

Know it was just one play and Josh went to his left but he did have 5 sec (we tevo it)

 

 

Yeah, Josh had all day on that play. Ford's guy starts to bull-rush, then backs way off and runs into the middle of the field as if he's in pass protection the middle short zone. Ford collapses in and helps by doubling the DT on that side.

Edited December 4, 2019 by Thurman#1

[Warcodered]

 

[Buffalo Junction]

5 hours ago, whatdrought said:

 

Same. I think Spain has been one of the unsung heroes of this team and I don't see any reason not to sign him. I would keep Dawkins, Spain, More, and Feliciano and then figure RT out - whether or not that can be Ford. 

I’ve liked how Spain has played for the most part. He’s had a few bad plays in pass pro though, particularly picking up stunts and blitzes. The flipside is that he’s a mauler. I would like to see him return if the value is there. I honestly have no clue what the FA guard market looks like this off-season aside from Scherff being available. There’s certainly value in consistency, and returning the entire O-line has serious benefits. 

[Thurman#1]

6 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

According to Erik Turner's piece in The Athletic on the play concepts behind the Beasley TD, it's less bolting from the pocket than the designed roll-out and secondary routes concepts from Mouse Davis run-and-shoot that Beasley ran at SMU under June Jones.

 

It's not just pass protection that's a weakness for Ford.  There have been too many good Allen runs called back by holding against Ford.  None vs. Dallas, but before that 1 each vs Cle, Mia, Den.  The Cle was particularly killer as it negated a nice Singletary run and turned 1st and 15 into 1st and 25 in the 3Q with a 9-9 tie game. (the 1st and 15 was due to a false start penalty, guess who?).  We made it 3rd and 3 then had to punt.

 

 

I have to disagree with you here.

 

There's not one single other play in all that video where the QB rolls out. And in the written explanation, Turner specifically says that the pressure on Allen prevents the original intended throw. That's not a rollout, it's an escape underneath a rusher who made it around the outside well enough to pressure Allen.

 

"Allen is slightly under pressure just as Beasley makes eye contact with his QB, so he isn’t able to pull the trigger just yet. Due to the slight pressure from defensive end Michael Bennett and linebacker Jaylon Smith, Allen and Beasley activate the secondary route. The deep safety has his hips open to the wide side of the field because Allen appears to go into scramble mode. Allen sees Beasley working down the seam, the weakness in Cover 3, so Beasley works over the middle and creates a window for his QB."

 

There's nothing in the whole article about rolling out. And all the SMU throws are from the pocket.

Edited December 4, 2019 by Thurman#1

[Thurman#1]

43 minutes ago, Warcodered said:

 

 

 

Yeah, but again, Baldy never specifically says much about Ford's pass pro. He says a lot about the Bills doing well, a lot about Allen knowing when to step up away from pressure and get outside (in these videos both times it happens he's been forced off the spot by Ford's man getting pressure by going around the edge).

 

He's right that in the Dallas game, Ford got little help, but in the Denver game he did. And there's nothing wrong with that, but Baldy's complementing the Bills here. And when he say that the tackles were going mano-a-mano, toe to toe, that's Ford's strength. Nobody's had much success against Ford going toe to toe and bullrushing.

 

We'll see down the line, but it sure looks to me like Ford's got a specific weakness concerning fast guys who can get around him. Turn down the sound on Baldy and just watch the video, and see if you don't agree.