Tcali Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 1 hour ago, MAJBobby said: QB Protect the QB Rush the QB Weapons for QB good way to look at it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 QB LT Pass Rusher Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAJBobby Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 1 minute ago, John from Riverside said: QB LT Pass Rusher I would say RT if QB was a lefty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bring it Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 7 hours ago, T master said: It all starts in the trenches !! On both sides of the ball !! That’s where I would start but if the chance to draft or acquire a special talent at a key position comes you have to take it imo! Those players are also key and probably what the current team needs. Qb is a special position that must be addressed! You need a good one to be a perennial contender! When that happens in a rebuild isn’t as important as making sure it at least does happen!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Joshin' Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 43 minutes ago, Giuseppe Tognarelli said: I'll reply to you and @BringBackOrton at the same time. In my mind, kicker is just something I'd take care of right off the bat to make sure I got a great one. It's not that I think a kicker is more valuable than a quarterback. I would just start with a kicker because that at least gives me some baseline of competence. Admittedly, I realize that the nuances in my thinking might not be obvious. ☺ I think you need to look up the definition of nuance. It does not mean a bad idea with no facts of common sense. Again, please tell me one team in history that made a K their priority when building a team over QB. Just one otherwise I am done with the trolling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 23 of the last 27 Super Bowls have been won by a QB in the HOF or one that will definitely be in the HOF. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giuseppe Tognarelli Posted November 13, 2019 Author Share Posted November 13, 2019 55 minutes ago, Just Joshin' said: I think you need to look up the definition of nuance. It does not mean a bad idea with no facts of common sense. Again, please tell me one team in history that made a K their priority when building a team over QB. Just one otherwise I am done with the trolling. I think you need to look up the definition of trolling! That term gets thrown around on here for anything people disagree with. It's okay to just disagree without calling the person a troll or insulting them (not saying you did the latter, btw). No trolling intended! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augie Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 1 hour ago, Ethan in Portland said: Gronkowski - HOF tight end Moss - HOF WR talent Welker/Edelman - yes Brady made them better than they are but they got open, made great catches, were durable despite their size, and made yac I agree they have been plug and play on OL for the most part. They have one of the best OL coaches in NFL. YES, they have probably the best OLine coach in the league, or VERY close to it. Still, the question was about Mahomes, and he told us about Brady. Trying for a little misdirection there, it seems. Mahomes would probably be better than Allen now (had he not had the year to sit and learn), I’m sure, but he wouldn’t be “Mahomes” on the current Bills. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAJBobby Posted November 14, 2019 Share Posted November 14, 2019 25 minutes ago, Augie said: YES, they have probably the best OLine coach in the league, or VERY close to it. Still, the question was about Mahomes, and he told us about Brady. Trying for a little misdirection there, it seems. Mahomes would probably be better than Allen now (had he not had the year to sit and learn), I’m sure, but he wouldn’t be “Mahomes” on the current Bills. there is zero way to Prove that. What you can Prove and show is teams that have elite QBs win more often than they lose. so anyone prioritizing Any Other position Over QB is stuck in 70’s football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augie Posted November 14, 2019 Share Posted November 14, 2019 7 minutes ago, MAJBobby said: there is zero way to Prove that. What you can Prove and show is teams that have elite QBs win more often than they lose. so anyone prioritizing Any Other position Over QB is stuck in 70’s football. Of course not. It’s inherently obvious that we can’t prove any “what if’s”. My point was, I think Mahomes would not be full “Mahomes” if he had been dealt Allen’s hand. You can disagree if you want. I haven’t seen anyone putting any single position ahead of QB. That’s also obvious. Some have said win the trenches, and that has merit, but that is MANY positions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vincec Posted November 14, 2019 Share Posted November 14, 2019 (edited) 1. QB 2. DE 3. CB 4. LT 5. DT 6. MLB It's no secret what the premium positions are. Edited November 14, 2019 by vincec 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
row_33 Posted November 14, 2019 Share Posted November 14, 2019 4 hours ago, Ethan in Portland said: Gronkowski - HOF tight end Moss - HOF WR talent Welker/Edelman - yes Brady made them better than they are but they got open, made great catches, were durable despite their size, and made yac I agree they have been plug and play on OL for the most part. They have one of the best OL coaches in NFL. That’s a pitiful set of skill player talent for Brady for nearly 20 years, not a single RB of upper echelon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
US Egg Posted November 14, 2019 Share Posted November 14, 2019 "If you were building a roster, what positions would you prioritize ?" First, I'd get a hen and a rooster. Then, I'd leave the position up to them. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boatdrinks Posted November 14, 2019 Share Posted November 14, 2019 14 hours ago, matter2003 said: Yes he would win 10 games. Conjecture. It would certainly be interesting to see what happened, but ten games seems to be a stretch. Since we can’t put him in that situation, its impossible to prove. I would guess 10 is too many. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted November 14, 2019 Share Posted November 14, 2019 7 hours ago, Kirby Jackson said: 23 of the last 27 Super Bowls have been won by a QB in the HOF or one that will definitely be in the HOF. The vast, vast majority of SBs have been won by HOF quarterbacks or those that will be. The non HOF quarterbacks are few and far between. I would bet less than 10 out of the 53 SB games played to date. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ethan in Cleveland Posted November 14, 2019 Share Posted November 14, 2019 8 hours ago, Kirby Jackson said: 23 of the last 27 Super Bowls have been won by a QB in the HOF or one that will definitely be in the HOF. Technically true but there is some context needed. Brady's first and hopefully last, Wilson, Roethlisberger's first, and Manning's second were all won by the defense. If you discount those wins, it is more like 18 of the last 27, or 66.7%. I agree, the best chance to win a SB is to have a truly great QB. But it can be done without a great QB or QB that is not quite ready for primetime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ethan in Cleveland Posted November 14, 2019 Share Posted November 14, 2019 5 hours ago, row_33 said: That’s a pitiful set of skill player talent for Brady for nearly 20 years, not a single RB of upper echelon What has Brees had? A very good TE. He now has an elite WR, but mostly he was playing with average guys What has Rodgers had? A few very good WR's and a handful of ok backs, not one will be in the HOF Peyton Manning had the most skill players around him - two elite WR's, an elite RB, a high quality C, a decent O-line, and a capable pass catching TE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Turk Posted November 14, 2019 Share Posted November 14, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Boatdrinks said: Conjecture. It would certainly be interesting to see what happened, but ten games seems to be a stretch. Since we can’t put him in that situation, its impossible to prove. I would guess 10 is too many. Andrew Luck won 10 games under similar circumstances Edited November 14, 2019 by matter2003 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Búfalo Blanco Posted November 14, 2019 Share Posted November 14, 2019 Both lines and QB would absolutely come first, imo... work on everything else after that. There should always be consideration for best player available as well, regardless of position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No_Matter_What Posted November 14, 2019 Share Posted November 14, 2019 15 hours ago, hjnick said: ok, let's change it up a bit... if you are building a team and how you would want to allocate *greatness* 24 Players on the field (both sides of ball): Offense: QB, RB, LT, RT, OG, OG, C, WR1, TE, WR2, (your option)last spot could be FB, WR3, RB2, TE2 Defense: DT1, DE1, DE2, MLB1, OLB1, OLB2, Safety1, Safety2, CB1, CB2, (your option 4/3 or 3/4 DEF)last spot DT2 or MLB2 Special Teams: K, P Using the Bell Curve: Elite (1) / All Pro (2) / Solid Starter (3) / Below Avg Player (4) / Barely NFL Caliber (5) / Not Good (6) (The number is just so you can tell if someone is that level, not how many of each for that position). Now, for Every Elite player you have, you have to match with Not Good, All Pro with Barely NFL and solid starter with Below avg player. Example: remember adds up to 24: 2/3/7/7/3/2 For me: Breakdown per position 2 / 3 / 7 / 7 / 3 / 2 QB 1 RB 4 LT 2 RT 3 OG 4 OG 5 C 3 WR1 2 WR2 3 *WR3 6 TE 4 K 4 P 4 4/3 DEF DT1 3 *DT2 5 DE1 1 DE2 3 MLB1 3 OLB1 4 OLB2 5 Safety1 4 Safety2 6 CB1 2 CB2 3 This was interesting... My OLine is the best, but I have an elite QB that hopefully will make some good decisions with an All Pro WR. And on defense I went with an elite DE to pressure the QB and an All pro CB to lock down other teams best WR.but my linebackers, safeties, and special teams suffered. This is the best post in the thread IMO and it is how this exercise makes most sense. It is much more useful to know how to construct complete winning team then just say that QB/DE/LT/whatever is most important. Thing is that you always have chance to have some elite players, some average and some clear weaknesses, and you have to realize this when constructing a roster. Good GM knows how to allocate resources. It is obviously more complicated than this, since you have 53 players on roster and not 24 (and having good CB3 might be for example more valuable than having good OLB2), but this is a good starting point. As for the model itself, I'd slightly change naming structure - you can't have 5 All-Pro players in this exercise. I would also avoid "Barely NFL Caliber" term when talking about starters. I'd say it should go like Elite/All Pro (2x), Pro Bowl (3x), Solid/Good Starter (7x), Avg Starter (7x), Borderline Starter/Backup Level (3x), Liability (2x). As a base your distribution 2/3/7/7/3/2 looks reasonable to me. I would also probably allow people to move players among groups, i.e. allow people to decide that they can upgrade one Liability to Borderline Starter in exchange for downgrading one Pro Bowl to Solid Starter etc. I don't pretend to be an expert but my initial thoughts are as follows: All Pros (2x): QB, LT Pro Bowl (3x): DE, CB, WR Good Starters (7x): C, RT, OG, MLB, DE2, DT, K (yes kicker here) Avg Starters (7x): OG, OLB, WR2, RB, TE, S, CB2 Backup Level (3x): DT2, OLB2, P Liability (2x): S, WR3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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