Daboll as an OC - Rankings for last 10 years

[frostbitmic]

1 hour ago, JR in Pittsburgh said:

True dat. Brady would have like Five 60-yard TDs to Robert Foster by now!! 
 

I do believe that while Daboll may not work out in the end, him being here has accelerated JA’s football IQ. 

You do realize that the receiver has to actually track and catch the ball don't you ??

[Phil The Thrill]

31 minutes ago, Virgil said:

And you could equally argue Daboll hasn’t proven anything at any level 

Sure it’s not like he ever won a national championship as an OC.  
 

If you want to argue that Daboll has only been an average to below average OC, then it’s a fair point.  But you just can’t discount his below average talent at QB either 
 

 

[C.Biscuit97]

Just now, Phil The Thrill said:

Sure it’s not like he ever won a national championship as an OC.  
 

If you want to argue that Daboll has only been an average to below average OC, then it’s a fair point.  But you just can’t discount his below average talent at QB either 
 

 

Who couldn’t win a national championship at Alabama?  

[Phil The Thrill]

21 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

The Pats keep hiring him back, and the best college coach in history hired him. I also think that in the coaching fraternity, there is a TON of respect for McDermott.  It could be the case that he thinks he'll make his name by developing a QB. Allen has incredible talent, and maybe he sees that. The thing is, he keeps getting hired. The pay for these coordinators is pretty much the same for most teams across the league. 

 

Look, I'll never forget the pile-on that occurred with Dan Henning, a bona fide good NFL mind. He failed in Buffalo because Todd Collins was his QB. He goes to the Jets, and Vinnie Testaverde has the season of his life. 

 

Finally, Daboll, for all of his flaws, is basically 1000 times better than Rick Dennison, who I thought was awful.

Dave I completely agree.  Daboll is not without his flaws.  But you have to consider the QB’s he has to work with

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

12 minutes ago, frostbitmic said:

You do realize that the receiver has to actually track and catch the ball don't you ??

plenty of blame to go around on those throws, for sure.

[Scott7975]

30 minutes ago, GG said:

 

Which 3rd & 4 are you referring to?

 

I think it was the one he threw to Beasley running down the field double covered.  The announcers said there was no short routes.  No digs, curls, etc.  I think I heard someone else say the closer receiver was 10 yards.  I haven't seen the replay but I don't remember there being a short outlet on that play.

[dave mcbride]

30 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

The Pats bring him back as a TEs coach.  And you might want to check their resumes again. Dennison has a much better one. https://www.pro-football-reference.com/coaches/DennRi0.htm. McDermott deserves a huge amount of blame for his season here because he traded away our best wr a week before the season; forced Tyrod to become a WCO passer (so dumb); and forced Peterman on him. 
 

and I do hate we blame coaches for player’s struggles all the time. But if you have years of evidence that a guy is a bottom 5 OC in the nfl, when do you admit maybe he just isn’t good enough?

No offense, but I'm starting to think it should be a house rule to post surrounding context (Who is the QB? Who is the head coach?) when evaluating coordinators. He was an OC in Denver under Shanahan and an OC in Texas under Kubiak. Basically, Curtis Modkins. 

 

Also, when he was the TE coach in NE, they had the most productive TE game in the league. Hmm ... I wonder why ... could it have anything to do with the players?

 

I saw what I saw with Dennison, and he couldn't adjust to what he had in Buffalo. At all. 

 

Edited November 11, 2019 by dave mcbride

[Phil The Thrill]

20 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Who couldn’t win a national championship at Alabama?  

Thanks for proving my point

[Scott7975]

1 minute ago, dave mcbride said:

No offense, but I'm starting to think it should be a house rule to post surrounding context (Who is the QB? Who is the head coach?) when evaluating coordinators. He was an OC in Denver under Shanahan and an OC in Texas under Kubiak. Basically, Curtis Modkins. 

 

I saw what I saw with Dennison, and he couldn't adjust to what he had in Buffalo. At all. 

 

 

Further context is that no one in the NFL wants to hire this guy.  It could be that Josh is just terrible.  It could be that Dabol is terrible.  It could be they are both terrible.  What I do know is that Dabol has never had success in the NFL.

[Phil The Thrill]

57 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Allen definitely is a big part of the problem too.  We are forcing a square peg into a round hole.  It’s like when we forced Tyrod into a WCO.

 

mcdermott is an awesome defensive coach who is clueless offensively.

 

Then what’s the right offense for Allen?  I don’t disagree that the QB he has become is not the one they wanted when they traded up for him.  But I think a lot of that had to do with his limitations.  

47 minutes ago, Scott7975 said:

You didn't see that 3rd and 4 did you?  There were no short routes.  Allen's option was deep, intermediate, run with the football.

Welcome to the NFL in 2019

[dave mcbride]

1 minute ago, Scott7975 said:

 

Further context is that no one in the NFL wants to hire this guy.  It could be that Josh is just terrible.  It could be that Dabol is terrible.  It could be they are both terrible.  What I do know is that Dabol has never had success in the NFL.

Again: What is the context of the teams he has coached for? Why did Nick Saban hire him? Why does Belichick keep hiring him? Who were his quarterbacks on the teams he coached for? 

[Phil The Thrill]

3 minutes ago, Scott7975 said:

 

Further context is that no one in the NFL wants to hire this guy.  It could be that Josh is just terrible.  It could be that Dabol is terrible.  It could be they are both terrible.  What I do know is that Dabol has never had success in the NFL.

You also know that Josh has also never had success at any level, right?

[Scott7975]

1 minute ago, Phil The Thrill said:

You also know that Josh has also never had success at any level, right?

 

Yes I do.  Is it a good marriage then?  Or would it be better to have someone that can tailor an offense to what the QB can do and actually train/groom him.

Edited November 11, 2019 by Scott7975

[Phil The Thrill]

17 minutes ago, JR in Pittsburgh said:

plenty of blame to go around on those throws, for sure.

Except the fact that most of Josh’s deep passes this year have been 10 yards in front of the receiver.  Tough to track a badly overthrown ball

Just now, Scott7975 said:

 

Yes I do.  Is it a good marriage then?

It just means that past results don’t always indicate future success or failure.  

1 hour ago, nedboy7 said:

Maybe it’s possible that Allen is the problem and not daboll.  But...if you have to change a part it’s the OC.  JA needs another shot with a different coach. 

Maybe but I see a lot of limitations with Josh’s game.  It’s tough to think that a new OC could come in and suddenly transform Josh into a different QB.  My guess is that he would be about the same.

[GG]

8 minutes ago, Scott7975 said:

 

I think it was the one he threw to Beasley running down the field double covered.  The announcers said there was no short routes.  No digs, curls, etc.  I think I heard someone else say the closer receiver was 10 yards.  I haven't seen the replay but I don't remember there being a short outlet on that play.

 

Beasley was his third option on that play.  My guess is that Knox was the primary, but he didn't sell the route too well and the LB followed him immediately.  I don't know why Josh trusted the long bomb to Beasley who was triple covered on that play.  Also an immediate fade to Brown on the left side would have worked because he was single covered.   But Josh can't make that throw yet.

[WideNine]

2 hours ago, Phil The Thrill said:

Flawed logic - Anderson was a Pro Bowl QB for 1 year and has struggled as a starter for years after Daboll was fired.  Seems to me that’s on outlier.

 

Why do bad teams hire Daboll?  Probably because he knows offense and has proven to know how to design an effective running game despite poor QB performance.  
 

If he’s so bad, why would one of the greatest college coaches ever hire him?  After all, it’s not like his offense ever won a national championship 

 

What QB has he developed then that's makes him qualified?

 

What offense has he taken and made it significantly better?

 

Below is a real resume builder:

 

As you forgot (cherry picked) QBs sans Cassel another pro-bowler. Let's set the wayback machine to Daboll's tenure at KC.

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/1298845-kansas-city-chiefs-matt-cassel-and-brian-daboll-will-thrive-with-new-offense

 

Points scored by Daboll's offense:

https://www.arrowheadpride.com/2012/11/30/3709930/kansas-city-chiefs-awful-bad-horrible

 

From USA Today about the 2012 Chiefs:

Here’s a look at what they had to say about that season for Kansas City:

 

"Easily the least-competitive team this proud franchise has ever fielded. Despite Jamaal Charles’ brilliance, the Matt Cassel era ended with a thud … which included 12 losses in the final 13 games — and a four-game skid to end the season when K.C. was thrashed 103-23 collectively."

 

2012 Chiefs were the worst Chief teams in their history, a complete tragic org failure...

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/chiefs/2012/12/26/kansas-city-chiefs-long-season/1791101/

 

 

What Daboll excels at is breaking down film and finding ways to exploit defenses, it is what he did for NE. What he has not done very well is putting those exploits into practice in games as an OC, or tailoring game plans to his players strengths, and fielding offenses that can score enough points.

 

 

 

Edited November 11, 2019 by WideNine

[bills11]

Like I said in another thread ...daboll is the wrong oc for this personnel..McDermott saw firsthand in Carolina how they were able to maximize cam Newton despite his limitations as a passer yet here he is as a hc trying to turn Josh Allen into tom Brady when he's more like cam Newton in playstyle 

[Dr.Sack]

Daboll is coaching the way McD wants him to. Limit turnovers, limit penalties, take check downs. 

[uticaclub]

The whole narrative that he wasn’t a good OC in the past because he didn’t have good QBs, will just lead him to be hired by another team in a few years & they will justify giving me another chance because the last QB he coached was Josh Allen

[Turk71]

  41 passes and 14 handoffs against one of the worst run defenses in the league in a game that was close throughout.

 34 passes and 12 handoff in a game played in howling 45 mph winds.

  Lack of short quick passing options to keep the pass rush off of Allen.

  Putting the offense completely on Allen's shoulders, even the running game. Singletary is averaging over 6 yds a carry but only gets the ball 8 times a game, Allen rushes 7.4 times per game.

  I've seen enough idiocy from Daboll.