Have You Started To Lose Faith in Josh Allen?

[CincyBillsFan]

11 minutes ago, jrober38 said:

 

NFL kickers are collectively 45 of 64 on field goals from 40 to 49 yards this year, or 70%. 

 

I assume that the percentages are lower for 49 yard field goals vs 42 yard field goals. 

 

With the number of upgrades we made, I don't understand how Allen hasn't been able to improve his passer efficiency. 

 

He was at 68 last year in QB Rating, and he's still under 70 right now. I was hoping that number would jump up to around 90, which is still about 20th best in the league. 

 

The pass game has miles to go before it's just average by NFL standards. I'm not sure how likely that is to happen based off what we've seen so far. 

 

He has improved his completion percentage.  And we can't judge the rest until later in the season or better yet until after the season.  For crying out loud are you really going to make the final judgement on Allen and the offensive improvements we made right after playing NE?  Talk about skewing the numbers!

[oldmanfan]

4 minutes ago, london_bills said:

You know what. The deep interceptions and throwing back against the body don't bother me so much. The throwing against the body has worked a few times for big gains.

 

What bothers me is not seeing open receivers (brown and Jones on the 3rd down he missed to beasley). They may have been touchdowns and that's the difference that we expect to see in the future right?

 

Basic intelligence would suggest that New England would think we would go to Beasley on 3rd down. 

Daboll and Dorsey need to keep drilling it into Allen’s head that he should look at those shorter routes, maybe even make those his first read.

[BUFFALOKIE]

No

[Teddy KGB]

44 minutes ago, jrober38 said:

 

People here usually refuse to look at things objectively. It's all emotional hope that what you see with your own eyes will get better, and it's not as bad as it seems.

 

People are projecting what they want to be reality. 

 

Can you keep your horse? to yourself ? 

 

You’re the one that’s been consistently wrong on all football takes for years and you’re gonna talk about “people here” 

 

We should bring Tyrod back to make you whole again ???

[dayman]

It's not a matter of losing faith just a matter of the performance has not been good enough. Not that he can't grow and learn but he should be better at this point. His performance is worse than EJ was through week 4 of season 2 and EJ was benched. 

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

1 minute ago, dayman said:

It's not a matter of losing faith just a matter of the performance has not been good enough. Not that he can't grow and learn but he should be better at this point. His performance is worse than EJ was through week 4 of season 2 and EJ was benched. 

 

Wrongly.

 

EJ NEVER should have been benched at that stage.

 

 

[london_bills]

3 minutes ago, Joe in Winslow said:

 

Wrongly.

 

EJ NEVER should have been benched at that stage.

 

 

Would be interested to see a comparison of stats between Allen and Manuel.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

Just now, london_bills said:

Would be interested to see a comparison of stats between Allen and Manuel.

 

Oh, it's here. Just look.

 

[london_bills]

1 minute ago, Joe in Winslow said:

 

Oh, it's here. Just look.

 

In this thread?

[dayman]

2 minutes ago, london_bills said:

Would be interested to see a comparison of stats between Allen and Manuel.

 

QB A: 248 - 451, 2,977 yards, 6.6 yard per attempt, 13 tds, 18 interceptions, 13 fumbles, 8-7 record

QB B: 256 - 437, 2,810 yards, 6.4 yards per attempt, 16 TDs, 12 interceptions, 7 fumbles, 6-8 record

QB A is Josh Allen to date (through game 4 of season 2). QB B is EJ Manuel through game 4 of his second season. Reminder, EJ Manuel was benched 4 games into his second season.

[jkeerie]

16 minutes ago, london_bills said:

You know what. The deep interceptions and throwing back against the body don't bother me so much. The throwing against the body has worked a few times for big gains.

 

What bothers me is not seeing open receivers (brown and Jones on the 3rd down he missed to beasley). They may have been touchdowns and that's the difference that we expect to see in the future right?

 

Basic intelligence would suggest that New England would think we would go to Beasley on 3rd down. 

I think this is a valid point.   I would agree with you here.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

Just now, london_bills said:

In this thread?

 

1 minute ago, london_bills said:

In this thread?

 

No, on this board.

 

But be aware the stats ARE incomplete, and don't account for Allen's contributed rush TD.

 

[london_bills]

1 minute ago, dayman said:

 

QB A: 248 - 451, 2,977 yards, 6.6 yard per attempt, 13 tds, 18 interceptions, 13 fumbles, 8-7 record

QB B: 256 - 437, 2,810 yards, 6.4 yards per attempt, 16 TDs, 12 interceptions, 7 fumbles, 6-8 record

QB A is Josh Allen to date (through game 4 of season 2). QB B is EJ Manuel through game 4 of his second season. Reminder, EJ Manuel was benched 4 games into his second season.

Hm. Allen definitely looks the better quarterback to me off paper

[jethro_tull]

21 minutes ago, london_bills said:

You know what. The deep interceptions and throwing back against the body don't bother me so much. The throwing against the body has worked a few times for big gains.

 

What bothers me is not seeing open receivers (brown and Jones on the 3rd down he missed to beasley). They may have been touchdowns and that's the difference that we expect to see in the future right?

 

Basic intelligence would suggest that New England would think we would go to Beasley on 3rd down. 

yesterday was the first game where he missed some blatantly open guys.   even with that he could have had the chance to win it at the end and just ay have done so.  

[dayman]

3 minutes ago, london_bills said:

Hm. Allen definitely looks the better quarterback to me off paper

 

The stats are what they are...I think everyone would agree that despite the stats Allen does show more promise with the explosive plays and willingness to go for it and having won us a few games with clutch performance. So that's miles above EJ ... on the same token the stats don't mean nothing and they certainly tell truth on the INTs which are terrible. 

Edited September 30, 2019 by dayman

[jkeerie]

40 minutes ago, jrober38 said:

 

I think this is an excuse because those guys aren't exactly throwing to house hold names. I also don't see them making stupid decisions with the football. 

 

Allen puts the ball in harms way too often. Too many fumbles and too many interceptions. 

 

The Bills rebuilt the offensive line, rebuild the running back depth chart, rebuilt the receiver depth chart, and the results in the pass game haven't been much better. That's a big concern in my eyes. 

First of all, they don't have to be household names.  They just have to be willing to come back to the ball and contest catches, not just let the defender make the INT.

 

And the reasons these QBs aren't seen as making stupid decisions is because they have receivers that do the above.

 

Brown and Beasley are better WRs, but the rest of the receiving corps are the same from a year ago.  The oline is excelling in the running game, but not in pass protection. 

 

You are correct in that Allen does put the ball into harm's way too often, but I think part of the reason he does that is he trusts his receivers and his abilities too much.  He needs to play smarter.  On that point we agree.

[billsfan89]

20 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

 

I don't know.... practice? We have a pretty good defense that could recreate that situation pretty easily.  Josh has a go-to reaction when pressured: backpedal and run to his right to find a receiver along the sideline.  He can't keep being so predictable. So yeah, a little practice working on doing things differently wouldn't hurt. Another benefit of doing it in practice rather than in-game? No film.

 

They can't hit you in practice and game speed and practice speed is vastly different. So I don't think practice effectively recreates game conditions in order to help with his decision making. Also Josh can still as a starter practice under those conditions. The film is already out on him and he isn’t going to show a dramatic improvement in practice due to the conditions not being similar enough to an actual game. 

 

If this was footwork or some other aspect of his game that he needs tremendous work on then I would understand the idea that he might be better served to be benched for a game. But I don’t see decision making improving in a significant way without getting live games in. 

 

I also don’t buy this idea that Barkley somehow gives the team a better chance to win. Josh has his issues but Barkley is a limited QB in his own right and the team spending snaps on Barkley is kind of wasting starting snaps that could simply go to Josh. I honestly think that Josh gives the team as good if not a better chance to win. Josh adds a dynamic with his legs and his power arm that Barkley simply doesn’t. Yes Allen might make some mistakes that Barkley might not but I would rather see what I have in Josh and take his positives than to just start Barkely for no other reason than to satisfy fans frustrations over one game. 

[london_bills]

15 minutes ago, jethro_tull said:

yesterday was the first game where he missed some blatantly open guys.   even with that he could have had the chance to win it at the end and just ay have done so.  

The first few plays of the pats game bothered me.

 

The wide throw to gore in the flats for example. It showed me that he was tight, totally understandable but I want him to hit that throw. Put New England on the back foot straight away. 

 

Jests game he did that straight away and was great. unlucky I thought to not start the season perfect and with a TD.

 

Sometimes he seems like the stage doesn't phase him, sometimes he seems like the stage phases him. Which is it

[Bangarang]

28 minutes ago, Joe in Winslow said:

 

Wrongly.

 

EJ NEVER should have been benched at that stage.

 

 

EJ absolutely sucked and it was painfully obvious. He wasn’t going to magically become what people hoped he would be simply because he was given more time.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

Just now, Bangarang said:

EJ absolutely sucked and it was painfully obvious. He wasn’t going to magically become what people hoped he would be simply because he was given more time.

 

Maybe not. But the alternative was Kyle "I Give Up" Orton.