FireChans Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 6 minutes ago, jrober38 said: I think the following QBs would all have equalled or out produced the points production we've produced this year in our offense with this defense and special teams supporting them. I think we'd be 10-4 if you swapped any of them with Allen into this 53 man roster. Jackson, Brees, Watson, Mahomes, Wilson, Rodgers, Garoppolo, Cousins, Prescott, Ryan, Stafford, Brady, Tannehill, Wentz, Murray, Roethlisberger, Brissett, Mayfield, Bridgewater, Rivers. I think Daniel Jones, Darnold and Jameis Winston (his turnovers wouldn't matter because our defense is so good) would all be close. Ben and Stafford would be excellent additions to the IR list this season, but I doubt they’d be all that helpful on the sideline. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrober38 Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 2 minutes ago, Stank_Nasty said: there are some names in here that are just flat out comical..... WOW. this speaks volumes about what we are dealing with when you decide to speak on the qb situation.... which sorta stinks because its basically all you decide to speak on. You guys are such homers. Our offense is horrible. You all act like Allen is setting the world on fire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 1 minute ago, Stank_Nasty said: Mayfield is a complete turnover machine with weapons to spare on offense. the guy has OBJ, Jarvis landry and nick chubb at his disposal.... and he claims he'd be better than allen in buffalo this year..... TRY AND WRAP YOUR BRAIN AROUND THAT. ….. good lord. The nuanced view is even more hilarious actually. We've got a guy that's claiming 20 other QBs would be more productive than Allen in this situation. Or in other words: this situation is so good for a QB that you can get better production--better than 6th in the NFL in TDs by a QB--from any of 20 guys...meanwhile he's claiming in another post on this board that the WRs don't catch the ball reliably and the OL doesn't block well. It's actually bordering on insane if you break it down. 2 minutes ago, jrober38 said: You guys are such homers. Our offense is horrible. You all act like Allen is setting the world on fire. 22 out of 32 is not good...but it's not horrible. Hyperbole is the enemy of rational thinking. You're simply out to lunch. 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrober38 Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 5 minutes ago, Stank_Nasty said: Mayfield is a complete turnover machine with weapons to spare on offense. the guy has OBJ, Jarvis landry and nick chubb at his disposal.... and he claims he'd be better than allen in buffalo this year..... TRY AND WRAP YOUR BRAIN AROUND THAT. ….. good lord. Coaching and defense matter. Contrary to popular belief, football is a team sport. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pokebball Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 27 minutes ago, jrober38 said: Yes. There are at least 20 QBs in the NFL right now who would be leading this offense to the same or better productivity than Allen has done so far. We all have belly buttons and you have the right to yours. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LABILLBACKER Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 Josh Allen's development was always going to be slow. He's on schedule and making progress but clearly has more to learn. If he hits 60% for the entire season (year 2), I would be ecstatic. Kelly didn't hit 60% till year 4. Wide receivers, rbs and fullbacks need to stop dropping catchable balls. And last but definitely not least, Daboll has to be better. Take the training wheels off Josh and let him attempt to put points up with 2 min before a half. This ultra conservative approach to the offense is ridiculous. Stop forcing the defense to always bail you out. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stank_Nasty Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 Just now, jrober38 said: You guys are such homers. Our offense is horrible. You all act like Allen is setting the world on fire. I act like Allen is still developing, has plenty to work on, has been working with limited resources around him...…. AND STILL HAS SCORED MORE TD'S THAN ALL BUT 5 FREAKING PEOPLE IN THE NFL!!!!! calling allen a bottom 10 qb is absurd. tomorrow and the next day different sites qb rankings will come out from the panels they have vote on it and allen will fall anywhere in between 12-16 most likely. just like he has for a month.... because most people have the mental compacity to use context and their eyeballs for evaluation. 3 minutes ago, jrober38 said: Coaching and defense matter. Contrary to popular belief, football is a team sport. ya... so mayfields 17 int in 14 games is on the defensive issues. same as rivers 18 picks.... or darnolds 12 int through 11 games. makes sense. 2 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pokebball Posted December 18, 2019 Share Posted December 18, 2019 3 minutes ago, jrober38 said: You guys are such homers. Our offense is horrible. You all act like Allen is setting the world on fire. I'm not sure you understand that the offense is as the coaching staff have crafted it. There was a reason that the offense has 9 new starters this year. The offense isn't Allen. The offense is McD and Daboll. Last year's offense was horrible. This year's offense is much improved. This year's offense needs to continue to grow and improve. Patience grasshopper! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted December 18, 2019 Share Posted December 18, 2019 I think where we are at is we have a young qb who plays with a really good defense who has become a solid game manager. He has big play ability, especially with his running right now. Allen isn’t being asked to win games but rather not lose them. And if we keep the game close, he has shown ability to led late drives to win them, which is big. i think where some people have questions is if he is truly a franchise guy who is young and playing to his team’s strengths (ala Brady, Big Ben, Wilson) and grow with more experience. And The other side are the Bortles, Mitch T, and Sanchez (he’s better than Sanchez). We probably won’t have an answer this year because I think the team is very comfortable with the current formula. As someone who has certainly had questions about Allen, I’m just going to enjoy the ride and hope for the best. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CincyBillsFan Posted December 18, 2019 Share Posted December 18, 2019 8 minutes ago, jrober38 said: You guys are such homers. Our offense is horrible. You all act like Allen is setting the world on fire. How many times must those of us who see real improvement and flashes of elite potential in Allen have to say HE STILL HAS A LOT OF AREAS HE NEEDS TO IMPROVE IN before you sour pusses quit setting up & knocking down this straw man? I can't think of a single 2BD post claiming that Allen is setting the world on fire. Where do you get this stuff? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meatloaf63 Posted December 18, 2019 Share Posted December 18, 2019 1 minute ago, CincyBillsFan said: How many times must those of us who see real improvement and flashes of elite potential in Allen have to say HE STILL HAS A LOT OF AREAS HE NEEDS TO IMPROVE IN before you sour pusses quit setting up & knocking down this straw man? I can't think of a single 2BD post claiming that Allen is setting the world on fire. Where do you get this stuff? He has to set it up that way or his argument becomes even more ridiculous.... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted December 18, 2019 Share Posted December 18, 2019 6 minutes ago, LABILLBACKER said: Josh Allen's development was always going to be slow. He's on schedule and making progress but clearly has more to learn. If he hits 60% for the entire season (year 2), I would be ecstatic. Kelly didn't hit 60% till year 4. Wide receivers, rbs and fullbacks need to stop dropping catchable balls. And last but definitely not least, Daboll has to be better. Take the training wheels off Josh and let him attempt to put points up with 2 min before a half. This ultra conservative approach to the offense is ridiculous. Stop forcing the defense to always bail you out. 1) the Kelly comparison is completely invalid because it’s a completely different nfl. This era is steroids to qb stats. 2) as much as I would love to see if Allen can carry this team, there is no way that is happening this year. We have won 10 games with Allen as a game manager. No way they are going to change things now. And I have a feeling that is from the head coach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LABILLBACKER Posted December 18, 2019 Share Posted December 18, 2019 (edited) 7 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said: I think where we are at is we have a young qb who plays with a really good defense who has become a solid game manager. He has big play ability, especially with his running right now. Allen isn’t being asked to win games but rather not lose them. And if we keep the game close, he has shown ability to led late drives to win them, which is big. i think where some people have questions is if he is truly a franchise guy who is young and playing to his team’s strengths (ala Brady, Big Ben, Wilson) and grow with more experience. And The other side are the Bortles, Mitch T, and Sanchez (he’s better than Sanchez). We probably won’t have an answer this year because I think the team is very comfortable with the current formula. As someone who has certainly had questions about Allen, I’m just going to enjoy the ride and hope for the best. He'll be fine and even better next year. Let's not kid ourselves, he needs a tall #1 WR, a reliable #1 TE, a true RB1( Jonathan Taylor), as I consider Devin a solid RB2. Add this next year to existing players and JA will take off. ( In spite of Daboll) Edited December 18, 2019 by LABILLBACKER 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CincyBillsFan Posted December 18, 2019 Share Posted December 18, 2019 1 minute ago, C.Biscuit97 said: I think where we are at is we have a young qb who plays with a really good defense who has become a solid game manager. He has big play ability, especially with his running right now. Allen isn’t being asked to win games but rather not lose them. And if we keep the game close, he has shown ability to led late drives to win them, which is big. i think where some people have questions is if he is truly a franchise guy who is young and playing to his team’s strengths (ala Brady, Big Ben, Wilson) and grow with more experience. And The other side are the Bortles, Mitch T, and Sanchez (he’s better than Sanchez). We probably won’t have an answer this year because I think the team is very comfortable with the current formula. As someone who has certainly had questions about Allen, I’m just going to enjoy the ride and hope for the best. We won't know your last question for another 2 - 3 years. It takes 4 to 5 years in total before you can really be sure if you have a franchise QB. But everything I've seen to date is trending in the right direction. But I do disagree to a point with your notion that Allen is only a game manager and is not being asked to win games only to not lose them. As you mention in your post, Allen has led 5 game winning drives which to me means that they really do ask him, in a limited way, to win some games for them. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChans Posted December 18, 2019 Share Posted December 18, 2019 1 minute ago, LABILLBACKER said: He'll be fine and even better next year. Let's not kid ourselves, he needs a tall #1 we, a reliable #1 te, a true RB1 as I consider Devin a solid RB2. Add this next year to existing players and JA will take off. ( In spite of Daboll) Daboll is good. 1 minute ago, CincyBillsFan said: We won't know your last question for another 2 - 3 years. It takes 4 to 5 years in total before you can really be sure if you have a franchise QB. But everything I've seen to date is trending in the right direction. But I do disagree to a point with your notion that Allen is only a game manager and is not being asked to win games only to not lose them. As you mention in your post, Allen has led 5 game winning drives which to me means that they really do ask him, in a limited way, to win some games for them. The difference is Allen isn’t asked to carry the team often. Your point is well taken, and he has delivered in big moments, but he and the offense aren’t tasked with putting up 25-30 points every game to win. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teddy KGB Posted December 18, 2019 Share Posted December 18, 2019 (edited) 30 minutes ago, Gugny said: Man, your crusade is so old and tired. Get some new material, dude. I thought crusades led to mutings and bans, this guy repeats the same posts every 14 days or just disappears after good games. Edited December 18, 2019 by Teddy KGB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meatloaf63 Posted December 18, 2019 Share Posted December 18, 2019 (edited) 8 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said: 1) the Kelly comparison is completely invalid because it’s a completely different nfl. This era is steroids to qb stats. 2) as much as I would love to see if Allen can carry this team, there is no way that is happening this year. We have won 10 games with Allen as a game manager. No way they are going to change things now. And I have a feeling that is from the head coach. Do you let him try over these next two games? We may need more out of him in the playoffs, would it hurt to loosen the reigns a bit? Edited December 18, 2019 by Meatloaf63 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CincyBillsFan Posted December 18, 2019 Share Posted December 18, 2019 1 minute ago, FireChans said: Daboll is good. The difference is Allen isn’t asked to carry the team often. Your point is well taken, and he has delivered in big moments, but he and the offense aren’t tasked with putting up 25-30 points every game to win. And that's why this coaching staff is very good. Knowing your limitations is probably more important then knowing your strengths! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teddy KGB Posted December 18, 2019 Share Posted December 18, 2019 28 minutes ago, jrober38 said: Brissett, Mayfield Daniel Jones, Darnold Lmao. Extra “reach” points for listing Rothlesberger and Stafford ?????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D. L. Hot-Flamethrower Posted December 18, 2019 Share Posted December 18, 2019 (edited) Many seem to forget that a couple weeks ago against Dallas he played a pretty big role in the win. Dallas did put up a lot of Yards(450+) and First downs(30+) even before we got the lead. The defense didn't win it alone. I don't know about you, but when he was eating the Turkey leg, I didn't hear anyone arguing he wasn't the MVP of the game. Edited December 18, 2019 by D. L. Hot-Flamethrower 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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