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Mayfield is << Allen

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I mean we’re comparing a qb with a 75 rating to one with a 68 but without a doubt, Baker and the Browns have been huge disappointments.  It seems like they made a bad head coaching hire because I still do like their roster.

 

i think the constant overreacting gets lame.  Everyone was ready to anoint Baker last year, now he’s the worst qb ever.  But when you run your mouth all the time, you look dumb when you don’t get the job done.  I think I’ve grown to appreciate about Allen is his attitude.  He just seems to handle his business. The Bills are kinda boring but in a good way.  They just show up and play.

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15 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

He's not Russ Wilson and hopefully no one savvy expected this.  But there was way more to Baker's college game than running around.  He had great field vision, and he showed great accuracy and decision making and just enough mobility to make it happen.

 

There are 2 things:

1) Football starts in the trenches.  And if a guy is playing "run for your life" he needs a special brand of discipline and the right players and play calling around him to get it done

And he'll still make more mistakes.  But few were willing to make allowance for Allen's poor OL last year in Wyo and last year here.

2) People confuse bluster and bravado with Heart.  Obviously Mayfield believed in himself in order to walk on 2x at D1 schools and start.  But his Heart is built on bluster and bravado and that's a fragile thing.  If you use negativity to motivate yourself, you walk a thin line between motivation and carrying the weight of it.  I think Mayfield is starting to feel the weight.

 

 

 

Not calling him trash, but do you really think it's just 16 games of film that's the issue here?

 

 

 

I think it's a combination of things:

16 games of film

A HC that's in waaaaaaay over his head 

An overmatched OL

A bit too much bravado on the part of the whole team 

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4 minutes ago, thebandit27 said:

 

I think it's a combination of things:

16 games of film

A HC that's in waaaaaaay over his head 

An overmatched OL

A bit too much bravado on the part of the whole team 

I really do believe in their talent.  But I don’t get why they couldn’t have just like FK be the OC. Was he that in demand? Also going into the season with Greg Robinson as your LT should get someone fired.  That’s a team that should be all over Trent Williams.  

 

Good news is if they keep losing, Bills fans will take over their field when we play them.

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Talent doesn't matter if the team is dysfunctional. Any bills fan should understand that after Doug Whaley's tenure.

 

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On 9/16/2019 at 11:52 PM, Buffalo716 said:

Yes. Besides the bravado and antics the dude TWICE WALKED ON at D1 programs and won starting jobs

 

You can say whatever u want about Baker and he may have regressed a little but his work ethic shouldn't be questioned

 

He obviously busts his butt in the film and weight room to get to where he is. Maybe he is losing it

Yeah, and Zay Jones set records at Division 1 level too, div 1means nothing at the pro level. BM is a smack talker douche , so he is being made an example of by his betters, this sort of thing happens in the adult world. BM may get his head out of his azs and become a good pro, time will tell, but right now he is stinking up the place.

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Just now, Don Otreply said:

Yeah, and Zay Jones set records at Division 1 level too, div 1means nothing at the pro level. BM is a smack talker douche , so he is being made an example of by his betters, this sort of thing happens in the adult world. BM may get his head out of his azs and become a good pro, time will tell, but right now he is stinking up the place.

 

Great commercials though. 

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24 minutes ago, thebandit27 said:

I think it's a combination of things:

16 games of film

A HC that's in waaaaaaay over his head 

An overmatched OL

A bit too much bravado on the part of the whole team 

 

Good assessment.

And possibly a bit too much belief in his own hype vs "humble, hard-working, and hungry" on the part of Baker

 

 

13 minutes ago, Joe in Winslow said:

Talent doesn't matter if the team is dysfunctional. Any bills fan should understand that after Doug Whaley's tenure.

 

 

Horse.  Dead.  Whacking.

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14 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

He is now.

 

In my opinion.

 

I think it's that "reputation" thing someone else quoted.  Wilson started out as more of a game manager and less of a brilliant passer.  But he's worked like hell, and his game has definitely taken a step and evolved.  Big jump happened between his 3rd and 4th seasons.  Before that he was a 200 ypg guy.

Absolutely spot on. Wilson has grown into an upper echelon QB; however, he was a QB averaging 195 - 220 YPG during their SB years. Interestingly enough, so many fans want to equate an elite QB with 300 YD passing games, yet in his 8 full seasons, Wilson averaged more than 250 YPG once, and averaged about one 300 YD game per season. Also, as his average per game has gone up, his playoff appearances have gone down. 

 

Wilson did not start out as an elite QB, yet, he was given that reputation, IMO, before he earned it.

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2 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

Horse.  Dead.  Whacking.

 

Is it really, though?
 

Pretty germane to the conversation about the browns who are, at best, a randomized collection of talent.

 

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1 minute ago, Joe in Winslow said:

Is it really, though?
Pretty germane to the conversation about the browns who are, at best, a randomized collection of talent.

 

Yes, it is really.

We truly don't need to rehash the whole Whaley was the worst GM ever/Whaley brought in talent/but was it a team?/Rex was the problem/Rex ruined Whaley's talent/Rex was treated unfairly    blahblah, 3 years after Whaley hit the road, *during a thread that is about 2 QB who weren't in the league nor even drafted the last time Whaley was*

 

Horse.  Dead.  Whacking.  Let it go.

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2 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Good assessment.

And possibly a bit too much belief in his own hype vs "humble, hard-working, and hungry" on the part of Baker

 

 

 

Horse.  Dead.  Whacking.

 

 

I think anyone who is as brash with rabbit ears for any bit of criticism as Baker is clearly overcompensating for something. I think Baker is hearing footsteps, but at this point it's tough to say if it's due to not preparing properly or having to overcome a nagging sense of self doubt.  He's bailing out of good pockets immediately and trying to make too much happen.

 

I believed prior to the draft and still believe to this day that if Allen were at Oklahoma with Lincoln Riley and that talent he would have been the #1 pick by a country mile and Baker at Wyoming is likely mid 1st territory. 

 

 

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Just now, Chuck Wagon said:

 

 

I think anyone who is as brash with rabbit ears for any bit of criticism as Baker is clearly overcompensating for something. I think Baker is hearing footsteps, but at this point it's tough to say if it's due to not preparing properly or having to overcome a nagging sense of self doubt.  He's bailing out of good pockets immediately and trying to make too much happen.

 

I believed prior to the draft and still believe to this day that if Allen were at Oklahoma with Lincoln Riley and that talent he would have been the #1 pick by a country mile and Baker at Wyoming is likely mid 1st territory. 

 

 

 

To be fair to Baker, when a QB knows well that his pocket could collapse like a Mumbai construction project at any time, it's hard to trust it and stay home.

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Baker went 8-22 last night.    that's not good.  

 

I seen that Tyrod taught him well!!!!  

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4 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

To be fair to Baker, when a QB knows well that his pocket could collapse like a Mumbai construction project at any time, it's hard to trust it and stay home.

There was a study done (isn’t there one for everything?) a couple of weeks ago that showed Mayfield led the league in leaving the pocket early.

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Posted (edited)
53 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

This is basically it IMHO.  The media annointed them and was all over their marvelous WR room and Baker.

They have a HC and OC who are over their heads and Mayfield would just about get better protection if he lined up behind 5 trash cans full of birdseed.

 

Again, normally I would be empathetic to the Brownies fans, and I'm not calling Baker trash by any means.  But I had a few too many earfuls with Baker being the darling of the analytics crowd, a sure-fire all-world Magical Franchise Man while Allen was trash and mocked and laughed at.

 

This is football.  It's a team game.  The other 10 guys and the coach make a huge difference.

 

 

You're a Bad Man, Promo.  Cleveland is already feeling ...the Agony of De Feet

I feel the same as you do. IMHO these folks root for the model to be correct. Silly me, but they should be finding a way to utilize all the information. And, allow for the fact that there are variables that are just plain random or are hard, if not impossible, to account for.  By all accounts, JA appears to have characteristics of a leader in spades, while inexperienced, his teammates and coaches want to play/work for him. Oh and BTW, the dude has some pretty good talent at his disposal. It's still early in his career, but I'm happy to say we took the correct Josh.

Edited by D. L. Hot-Flamethrower

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8 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Yes, it is really.

We truly don't need to rehash the whole Whaley was the worst GM ever/Whaley brought in talent/but was it a team?/Rex was the problem/Rex ruined Whaley's talent/Rex was treated unfairly    blahblah, 3 years after Whaley hit the road, *during a thread that is about 2 QB who weren't in the league nor even drafted the last time Whaley was*

 

Horse.  Dead.  Whacking.  Let it go.

You’re over blowing it, it’s merely a reference of doing team building the wrong way. No one was rehashing his entire tenure with the Bills. Just sayin...

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10 minutes ago, Chuck Wagon said:

I believed prior to the draft and still believe to this day that if Allen were at Oklahoma with Lincoln Riley and that talent he would have been the #1 pick by a country mile and Baker at Wyoming is likely mid 1st territory. 

 

 


Baker at Wyoming? If that had been the case, he would have been drafted after Mason Rudolph. 

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Posted (edited)
23 minutes ago, billsfan1959 said:

Absolutely spot on. Wilson has grown into an upper echelon QB; however, he was a QB averaging 195 - 220 YPG during their SB years. Interestingly enough, so many fans want to equate an elite QB with 300 YD passing games, yet in his 8 full seasons, Wilson averaged more than 250 YPG once, and averaged about one 300 YD game per season. Also, as his average per game has gone up, his playoff appearances have gone down. 

 

Wilson did not start out as an elite QB, yet, he was given that reputation, IMO, before he earned it.

Simply put, fantasy football, we  now have a crowd that roots for numbers and as you say equates it with being elite. The problem of course being context or lack of attention to the context by many.

Edited by D. L. Hot-Flamethrower
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1 hour ago, Chuck Wagon said:

I enjoy how the Baker apologists say it's not his fault he threw a ball in the dirt from 8 yards away that Callaway popped up, but if it were Allen they would be saying that lack of accuracy is why he'll never make it.


Allens pass to Beasley against the Jets was better then that and he got ridiculed for it. 

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On 9/17/2019 at 7:42 AM, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

 

...yup...just my personal preference, but I like Allen's humility, respect for the game, diligent work ethic and "WE" versus "ME" attitude......quote was, "OUR team and OUR family"....kid is never seeking the ME spotlight..........

We are building a class, character, and winning organization built on a team, not divas! It's a sign of the times that many on TBD want selfish superstars that provide a couple minutes of excitement rather than the boring climb to the top and longevity!

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2 minutes ago, vorpma said:

We are building a class, character, and winning organization built on a team, not divas! It's a sign of the times that many on TBD want selfish superstars that provide a couple minutes of excitement rather than the boring climb to the top and longevity!

 

...GREAT assessment......it has been a long, LONG time coming...............:thumbsup:.

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55 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

I really do believe in their talent.  But I don’t get why they couldn’t have just like FK be the OC. Was he that in demand? Also going into the season with Greg Robinson as your LT should get someone fired.  That’s a team that should be all over Trent Williams.  

 

Good news is if they keep losing, Bills fans will take over their field when we play them.


Freddie got the job because Baker loved him and John Dorsey was scared he’d leave if he gave the job to Greg Williams... I told my buddies last year it would come back to haunt them. 

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37 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

To be fair to Baker, when a QB knows well that his pocket could collapse like a Mumbai construction project at any time, it's hard to trust it and stay home.

 

One of my only concerns about Baker coming out of OU is that he routinely had 4+ seconds to throw the ball, and I had no clue how he'd respond to having less than 3 in the NFL.

 

That could end up being a problem for him in the short-term. 

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8 minutes ago, thebandit27 said:

 

One of my only concerns about Baker coming out of OU is that he routinely had 4+ seconds to throw the ball, and I had no clue how he'd respond to having less than 3 in the NFL.

 

That could end up being a problem for him in the short-term. 

 

This made me laugh....

 

 

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 Mayfield’s college numbers are the result of him being a “system“ quarterback. Specifically, he was in a one read system. He completed a zillion short passes skewing his statistics. His temperament is a potential negative issue. As the number one pick overall I predicted he had high bust potential.Admittedly, it’s early, but right now he looks like a decent back up to me. His skill set does not transfer well to the NFL

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