Week Two: Bills at Giants

[Golden*Wheels]

1 hour ago, Warcodered said:

 

Looks like Andre Roberts is out too.

Dang again? I want to see a nice kick return!

[Deranged Rhino]

Is it Sunday yet? 

[PromoTheRobot]

2 hours ago, reddogblitz said:

 

Please tell me where I said I didn't like him.  I do.  My point is he is (or has primarily been for 34 games) a conservative coach.  Nothing wrong with that as long as you win.

 

I believe in Coach McDermott's ability to build a team and motivate his players.  He has been able to coach us to wins that past Buffalo teams have figured out how to lose, like Sunday and the snow game for example.

 

But I don't expect him to become some super aggressive coach.   Just don't see it.  But time will tell.

 

Do you not think that he's conservative because he had garbage for talent for two seasons?

[Royale with Cheese]

1 hour ago, Protocal69 said:

Wow. A Wr with a calf issue even if he does play is bad. Giants got nobody left at WR

 

Yep...if there is any strain or pull...the calf is probably the worst muscle to do that to.

[MAJBobby]

If the Bills really are a playoff team the Bills should win this game going away. 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

46 minutes ago, Gugny said:

 

Definitely not a "heaping pile of praise."  Also definitely FAR from bulletin board material.  I have no idea what people (some Bills fans) are up in arms about.

 

It has to do with this kind of draft grading system (this is from nfl.com, but most sites have similar - scroll down to the bottom of the page to see the grading system). 

 

"Chance to become an NFL starter" is the 7th ranking, and the 4th or so of what is commonly seen.  So whereas Sam Darnold was graded 7.00, "Pro bowl caliber player" and QB Rosen and Mayfield were graded 6.19 and 6.02 respectively,  "should become instant starter", Josh Allen was given a grade for players more commonly seen in players drafted in the 2nd or 3rd rounds, maaaaaaaayyyybe late in the 1st to preserve the option year (as the Ravens did with Lamar Jackson)

 

Normally, once a player has NFL playing time under his belt, the conversation shifts to what he's done in the league.  Also, calling a QB a "big strong thrower" and "strong armed guy" is pretty much seen as a diss.  As Zierlein said, " (Allen's) ability to improve the mental part of his game will determine whether he's a good NFL starter or just another big, strong-armed guy."

 

So Shurmur is seen as saying "We saw him and still see him as a 2nd or 3rd round guy with a chance to play in the league"  instead of saying something diplomatic like "I'd rather talk about how he's played in the league - He's won some games for them.  He's shown improvement in his decision making.  Like most young players, he makes mistakes but he corrects them.  He's a tough competitor.  And of course, he's got that athletic ability, both the strong arm and the ability to run."

That's why it's seen as bulletin board material - 1) it seems to be discounting his league play to reiterate his draft profile 2) it's calling the Bills starting QB essentially a developmental guy who should have been drafted much later than he was

 

 

 

 

[Gugny]

5 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

It has to do with this kind of draft grading system (this is from nfl.com, but most sites have similar - scroll down to the bottom of the page to see the grading system). 

 

"Chance to become an NFL starter" is the 7th ranking, and the 4th or so of what is commonly seen.  So whereas Sam Darnold was graded 7.00, "Pro bowl caliber player" and QB Rosen and Mayfield were graded 6.19 and 6.02 respectively,  "should become instant starter", Josh Allen was given a grade for players more commonly seen in players drafted in the 2nd or 3rd rounds, maaaaaaaayyyybe late in the 1st to preserve the option year (as the Ravens did with Lamar Jackson)

 

Normally, once a player has NFL playing time under his belt, the conversation shifts to what he's done in the league.  Also, calling a QB a "big strong thrower" and "strong armed guy" is pretty much seen as a diss.  As Zierlein said, " (Allen's) ability to improve the mental part of his game will determine whether he's a good NFL starter or just another big, strong-armed guy."

 

So Shurmur is seen as saying "We saw him and still see him as a 2nd or 3rd round guy with a chance to play in the league"  instead of saying something diplomatic like "I'd rather talk about how he's played in the league - He's won some games for them.  He's shown improvement in his decision making.  Like most young players, he makes mistakes but he corrects them.  He's a tough competitor.  And of course, he's got that athletic ability, both the strong arm and the ability to run."

That's why it's seen as bulletin board material - 1) it seems to be discounting his league play to reiterate his draft profile 2) it's calling the Bills starting QB essentially a developmental guy who should have been drafted much later than he was

 

 

 

 

 

Wow.  Thanks for that explanation.  I take back what I said about this being bulletin board material.

[DaBillsFanSince1973]

 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

42 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

Do you not think that he's conservative because he had garbage for talent for two seasons?

 

McDermott's qualities as a coach are one of the puzzling open questions for the Bills ultimate success.

 

There have been times when it seems as though he coaches our team to play above their abilities, as in 2017 when we broke the drought and when we contained Fournette in the playoff game.  If we'd had just a few more hosspower on offense, it seems as though we would have done it. 

 

There have been times when it seems like he's playing checkers against chessmasters, and the Bills get totally totally blown out.    Then the question becomes, is that because the Bills have, as you say, "garbage for talent" and no one could devise a game plan where we'd match up?  Or is it because of poor game plan strategy?  Or is it a combination?

 

I tend to think McDermott is a conservative coach, perhaps an overly conservative coach.  But I also think he's a guy who is dedicated to improvement and to learning from mistakes.  It's one of those things time will tell.

[Bob in STL]

On 9/9/2019 at 6:25 PM, SCBills said:

Will be interested to see our OL with a game under their belt together. 

 

More Singletary.  

 

Does Kroft play?

 

Do we see more of the deep ball?  

 

Andre Roberts availability?  Would be nice to get some stops deep in Giants territory and give him a couple shots at returns. 

Yes indeed.  

 

I want ant to see the OL take a positive step.  The Jets DL and LBs were a tough match.  More Singletary for sure.  That should bring a safety up and help set up the deep ball.  

[RochesterLifer]

1 hour ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

McDermott's qualities as a coach are one of the puzzling open questions for the Bills ultimate success.

 

There have been times when it seems as though he coaches our team to play above their abilities, as in 2017 when we broke the drought and when we contained Fournette in the playoff game.  If we'd had just a few more hosspower on offense, it seems as though we would have done it. 

 

There have been times when it seems like he's playing checkers against chessmasters, and the Bills get totally totally blown out.    Then the question becomes, is that because the Bills have, as you say, "garbage for talent" and no one could devise a game plan where we'd match up?  Or is it because of poor game plan strategy?  Or is it a combination?

 

I tend to think McDermott is a conservative coach, perhaps an overly conservative coach.  But I also think he's a guy who is dedicated to improvement and to learning from mistakes.  It's one of those things time will tell.

I think you're living in the past. They HAD garbage for talent:

- 2017 We were projected to tank. We went to the playoffs.

- 2018 We fielded a team using ~65% of a salary cap, finishing 6-10.

 

This year, we are fielding a full team, with a project QB beginning to develop. McDermott has overachieved so far and can be held to a higher level of accountability beginning now. Um, in my humble opinion. 

[reddogblitz]

2 hours ago, PromoTheRobot said:

 

Do you not think that he's conservative because he had garbage for talent for two seasons?

 

No.

[DuckyBoys]

McDermott is the best coach we've had in a long time.  Guy was a miracle worker in 2017 and last year given what he had to work with I would call a big success.  I think we'll see him be able to dictate what he wants to do as the talent keeps improving vs just trying to survive with strategy

[twist_to_open]

The injury report from Pro Football Talk posted Friday evening, not looking good for Giants WR corps.

Bills at Giants

The Bills ruled out CB Taron Johnson (hamstring) and WR Andre Roberts (quadricep) for their second straight game at MetLife Stadium. TE Tyler Kroft (foot) is considered doubtful to play.

WR Sterling Shepard (concussion), TE Garrett Dickerson (quad) and WR Darius Slayton (hamstring) are out for the Giants. WR Cody Latimer (calf) is questionable, so the Giants may be awfully thin at wideout this weekend.

[LSHMEAB]

3 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

McDermott's qualities as a coach are one of the puzzling open questions for the Bills ultimate success.

 

There have been times when it seems as though he coaches our team to play above their abilities, as in 2017 when we broke the drought and when we contained Fournette in the playoff game.  If we'd had just a few more hosspower on offense, it seems as though we would have done it. 

 

There have been times when it seems like he's playing checkers against chessmasters, and the Bills get totally totally blown out.    Then the question becomes, is that because the Bills have, as you say, "garbage for talent" and no one could devise a game plan where we'd match up?  Or is it because of poor game plan strategy?  Or is it a combination?

 

I tend to think McDermott is a conservative coach, perhaps an overly conservative coach.  But I also think he's a guy who is dedicated to improvement and to learning from mistakes.  It's one of those things time will tell.

Very well said. The one thing I know about McDermott is that he CAN make chicken salad out of chicken....droppings. I think he's already proven to be an adequate coach. Certain conservative traits create skepticism as to whether or not he can be a well above average or even great coach. Certain TRENDS create some optimism that he has what it takes to reach the next level; mainly (for me anyways), his team's collective performance in late game situations. They never seem rattled and I'm SOMEWHAT less likely to expect catastrophe. I feel like in some ways I know what to expect from him, but no idea in other respects. Puzzling is a good word. 

[Dr. Who]

24 minutes ago, LSHMEAB said:

Very well said. The one thing I know about McDermott is that he CAN make chicken salad out of chicken....droppings. I think he's already proven to be an adequate coach. Certain conservative traits create skepticism as to whether or not he can be a well above average or even great coach. Certain TRENDS create some optimism that he has what it takes to reach the next level; mainly (for me anyways), his team's collective performance in late game situations. They never seem rattled and I'm SOMEWHAT less likely to expect catastrophe. I feel like in some ways I know what to expect from him, but no idea in other respects. Puzzling is a good word. 

If Allen is a franchise qb, he's got enough to end up a good to great coach, because he's got the D side covered.

[brianb386]

I think Allen gets his first 300+ yard day this Sunday.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

1 hour ago, brianb386 said:

I think Allen gets his first 300+ yard day this Sunday.

 

That might not be a good thing if it happens......often when QB have unusually high passing yards, it means they’re struggling to bring their team back from a deep hole.

I’d prefer Allen to have 178 passing yards and the Bills to take a 21-3 lead into the 4th quarter ....and keep it

[Dr. Who]

20 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

That might not be a good thing if it happens......often when QB have unusually high passing yards, it means they’re struggling to bring their team back from a deep hole.

I’d prefer Allen to have 178 passing yards and the Bills to take a 21-3 lead into the 4th quarter ....and keep it

Or maybe Allen has 350 yards, 5 TDs and we're up 42 - 10. Dream big, fella.

[PetermansRedemption]

Man I really want Andre Roberts to get healthy soon. So disappointing he hasn’t been able to play in two games. Been so long since the Bills has a true game breaking return man.