is Brown REALLY much better then Jones?

[die hard bills fan]

yes.

[Shaw66]

16 minutes ago, Reader said:

I'm not an expert, but I'll try to give you a helpful response. My guess is that even if their production looks similar, Brown tends to be able to produce against better corners than Zay. My guess is that Zay is more likely to disappear against a teams #1 corner than Brown.

I think this true.  It's because of Brown's speed.  He gets mote of a cushion, which allows him to separate more consistently.  Hard to be a one without speed.  

[Foxx]

until you (we) have a QB who is a proven commodity, evaluations at WR are going to be suspect. Allen needs to progress to a minimum level before we really know what we have here and subsequently, what we need here. 

 

 

[MJS]

It sounds like you didn't look at their stats at all. Brown, for starters, has a 1,000 yard season. Zay Jones has never come close.

[wppete]

Yes he is much better. Without question. 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

1 hour ago, macaroni said:

 

 

I can see your points but according to  https://www.pro-football-reference.com  last year Brown caught 43.2% of his targets, Jones caught 54.9% of his targets, soooo if you throw each one 100 times Brown equals 100 X 15 X 43.2% which is roughly equal to 648 yards, to Jones equals 100 X 11.7 X 54.9% is roughly 642.33 yards. I'm sorry I just don't see that much of a difference.

 

I think you need to separate Flacco to Brown from Jackson to Brown.  

 

Target not = to catchable ball

1 hour ago, Shaw66 said:

% of targets caught is different from drops.  Being targeted by Bridgewater doesn't mean you can catch it.  

 

What does Bridgewater have to do with Brown?

[Alphadawg7]

Very simple yes/no questions can answer this:

1. Is there a video thats over 5 min of drops (in 12 games) for Flacco/Lamar last year where Brown shows up at least 8 times?  NO
2. Has Zay ever had a 100 yard game?  NO
3. Has Zay ever reached 1000 yards?  NO
4. Has Zay even ever reached 700 yards?  NO
5. Has Brown ever nude wrestled his brother and tried to jump out of a window?  NO
6. Has Zay ever averaged more than 12 ypc?  NO
7. Has a defensive coordinator stayed up late to game plan on how to stop Zay?  NO

I think the answer is clear.  Case closed.  Brown >>>>>>> Zay and its not close.

Edited August 28, 2019 by Alphadawg7

[Forward Progress]

Preseason stats don’t tell us much of anything. The preseason games are little more televised practices with other teams.  If football was simply a mathematical optimization, all of the coaching and scouting staff would have degrees in actuarial science. 

 

The focus of game two was the quick passing game, which featured Josh and Beasley.  The focus of game three was the run game, which also does not feature Brown. 

 

The reports out of camp were that Josh and Brown were connecting well and that Brown was a better route runner than anticipated.  He can do more than just run fast downfield. 

 

[inkman]

2 hours ago, macaroni said:

 

 

I can see your points but according to  https://www.pro-football-reference.com  last year Brown caught 43.2% of his targets, Jones caught 54.9% of his targets, soooo if you throw each one 100 times Brown equals 100 X 15 X 43.2% which is roughly equal to 648 yards, to Jones equals 100 X 11.7 X 54.9% is roughly 642.33 yards. I'm sorry I just don't see that much of a difference.

Great post. I'll take the guy everyone in the league fears due to his speed vs a guy no one in the league even knows. 

[LSHMEAB]

Is John Brown better than Jordan Matthews? Because Zay is pretty much Jordan Matthews without the injury issues. The answer is yes.

[DJB]

This thread gonna be good and deserve a bump after week 1 id guess

[DrinkinBuddy]

While Brown or Zay may be our #1 WRs this year I don't believe either is a true #1WR. McDer-Beane have set in motion a long term plan to build this team from the ground up. They gutted the roster and their building through the draft. The 2020 draft is stacked with top end WRs, I think our future #1 comes from next year's class.

 

Some would argue you don't need a true #1 and a bunch of solid WRs can get it done in todays NFL. Maybe true. But I think having a true #1 will make the other WRs better because the attention that WR1 will take.

 

I think we've got a bunch of pretty good WRs and that could help lead to a playoff berth this season. I think our true #1 isn't on the roster yet.

[Reed83HOF]

2 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

What does Bridgewater have to do with Brown?

 

Ummmm....I can't say it

 

[DCofNC]

3 hours ago, macaroni said:

 

 

I can see your points but according to  https://www.pro-football-reference.com  last year Brown caught 43.2% of his targets, Jones caught 54.9% of his targets, soooo if you throw each one 100 times Brown equals 100 X 15 X 43.2% which is roughly equal to 648 yards, to Jones equals 100 X 11.7 X 54.9% is roughly 642.33 yards. I'm sorry I just don't see that much of a difference.

Anybody with Jackson throwing a long ball to them will be lucky to catch 50%. 

[Charles Romes]

Zay Jones just cannot make a play.  It’s frustrating to watch.   He will nearly make a play several times a game but is just not pull it off for some reason, usually a different reason, each time.  

[Rocket94]

5 hours ago, LSHMEAB said:

Is John Brown better than Jordan Matthews? Because Zay is pretty much Jordan Matthews without the injury issues. The answer is yes.

I forgot about Matthews, and look how that worked out...pretty accurate comparison. I don't "hate" Jones at all...there is just something missing. Too inconsistent. I understand occasional mistakes, but there is no continuity or flow going on.

Edited August 29, 2019 by Rocket94

[ColdFront_USAF]

I don't think our coaching staff thinks in terms of #1, #2 ect.  Modern day offenses are all about taking what the defense gives you, which is why teams can succeed without a true number one wr. We're not going to force feed Brown just because he's considered our most talented receiver. If teams scheme to take him away, that will open up other areas of the field that we will take advantage of. If they try to take away the short game/Beasley and the running game, we can look deep to speed guys like Brown and Foster. 

[Freddie's Dead]

Yes.

[BullBuchanan]

9 hours ago, macaroni said:

I'm a typical Kool-Aid drinking Pollyanna Bills fan. When we got Brown & Beasley I figured 2/3rds of our receiving corps problems had been solved. I have gone through the preseason figuring Brown our #1, Beasley our slot, and we only have to figure out who that "complementary" WR is going to be, and the room seemed full of guys none of whom would be a bad choice to fill that bill. Today, for the first time, I took a look at Browns stats and nothing really jumped out at me shouting #1 receiver. I figured I'd look at Zay Jones stats to see how much of an upgrade Brown would be. Much to my surprise (if you take away Zay's rookie year where he played with shoulder problems) they pretty much look like the same guy.

 

I'm not as down on Zay as most of you. While I don't think he's much of a #1 receiver, I think he could play the role as that "complementary guy" just fine, problem is Brown seems to have had HIS problems with missed catches too … have I deluded myself into thinking that Brown is a clear cut #1, I'm NOT talking Jerry Rice, Megatron, OBJ #1, just a sure handed, reliable, you can count on him MOST of the time receiver?

 

I get it that Brown is faster than Zay, but I don't want faster … I want catches the ball better.

 

Talk me off the cliff people … convince me we don't have a Zay, and a fast Zay on our hands here.

Brown is our #1, but he isn't really what you want in a #1 receiver. On a good team, you'd like him to be your 3rd option, with a legitimate #1 do it all superstar, and number 2 possession receiver who can block and brown as your #3 burner type. If you have a great pass catching TE, he can be your #2.

Edited August 29, 2019 by BullBuchanan

[TigerJ]

Brown is an outstanding route runner with speed to burn.  That means he gets open reliably, and once he's open, he tends to stay open unless the DB has help.  Add to that the fact that he has good hands and plays bigger than his listed size, and it's beyond debate that Brown is better.  Jones is a good route runner, but his speed is only OK and he's had a case of the dropsies at various times in his career.  I think he's still developing, and the final product could be pretty good, but he's not there yet.