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Shaw66

Receiver competition with two games left

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7 hours ago, LSHMEAB said:

I don't personally see any reason to keep Ray Ray. There's not really even a Ray Ray/McKenzie competition in my mind. Everything Ray Ray does, McKenzie does better. I'm not a Williams guy myself, but wouldn't have a problem if they found a way to keep him and see what happens. The one thing they could do to make me angry is to keep Ray Ray and dump McKenzie.

I hope McKenzie stays. It has been a very spirited effort by Mcloud, but we do we expect. There is probably a small core here that will remain in 2020...the rest are on borrowed time.  Providing Josh Allen with the best weapons to succeed is what this is all about. 

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On 8/18/2019 at 11:23 AM, Sammy Watkins' Rib said:

Yeldon is toast.

 

I sure hope they keep Wade on the 53. I think there is a reasonably good chance (50/50) Gore is cut or McCoy is traded or possibly cut. 

 

Where exactly has John Brown been? I believe he has two targets and 1 catch in two pre-season games with a goose egg in the last game. I'm sure his spot is safe, but he has seen very little action. I didn't think it was possible at first but I just don't see the value in keeping Zay Jones. He's being consistently outplayed or at least matched by guys drafted much lower than him. If he were not a high draft pick it wouldn't even be a debate about whether he would be cut or not. Maybe they try work a trade for him as it is likely another team could see value in him still and think they can get more out of him. Maybe Washington or the New York Giants? Send Washington Zay and a 2nd rounder for Trent Williams?

Its preseason.  I expect them to continue to utilize the vertical passing attack that was implemented last year. 

 

Brown and Foster will be huge peices of the offense.  To me Daboll is just running basic concepts that NE has used for years.  Working Beasley and the backs underneath to work Allen's consistency on those routes. 

 

I still think Zay will be a part of the offense.  You cant read too much into preseason.  They want to see imo if Roberts can be a legitimate Wr in rotation.  Those reps come from someone.  They are seeing if he can be the 5th Wr if not I expect them to keep 6 wrs.

 

For the running backs, the last 2 games will be crucial.  Yeldon has looked pretty good barring that fumble.  Beane likes Gore way too much to bring him in just to cut him. 

 

I dont expect anyone trading for Shady worth anything.  An expensive 30 yr old RB coming off the worst year of his career is bringing anything more than a late rd conditional pick.  

 

The wild card is still Wade.  He made the 2 best plays of the Bill's preseason thus far.  The whole mantra McDermott spouts that spots are earned in games, no one has made the most of their opportunities then Wade.  I think Wade earned the reps after Singletary.  Give him a larger role in preseason game 3.  See what he does vs better competition.

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2 hours ago, buffalo2218 said:

I don’t think the narrative “does nothing right” is accurate as opposed to inconsistency. I really can’t say I’d lose any sleep if Jones is dealt, at least at this point. The 3rd preseason game will tell the tale on that

Inconsistent is true, but not the narrative.  Read some of these posts over the past several months.  And if Jones is as bad as those people say why would anyone trade for him?  And If he's got enough value to trade him, why not keep him? 

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, purple haze said:

Inconsistent is true, but not the narrative.  Read some of these posts over the past several months.  And if Jones is as bad as those people say why would anyone trade for him?  And If he's got enough value to trade him, why not keep him? 

For me, it’d be hard to pass on McKenzie, I think he brings quite a bit to the table. With Jones, this is his 3rd year. While I can’t say what others have said to a certain extreme, I can say that I haven’t really seen enough to believe he’s made the kind of progress we all hoped he would.

 

I realize I may get flamed for saying this, but that drop against the Colts didn’t set well with me, primarily because he does carry a history of drops. That’s the only form of consistency he has up to this point. And when trying to bring along a franchise QB, that’s one thing that’s gonna kill a WR. I’m pretty sure it didn’t set well with McDermott either

Edited by buffalo2218

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Zay has had a good camp. He drops one ball and gets his head taken off and all of a sudden he is trash again. Duke Williams catches a couple of balls against a bunch of scrubs and he should be our new #1. People are funny. 😁 Zay will be on this roster. If Duke is too, it will be at Ray Ray/Mckensie's expense. 

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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, Shaw66 said:

 If Zay makes it it won't be for these reasons.  It's all about competition and the future.  Where he was drafted or what Kim Pegula may have thought about him won't matter.  No one "gets" anything.  They have to earn it.  

 

I think it's fair to assume that a 2nd round pick that this regime made may have a slightly longer leash than an UDFA, but whatever, I agree, and the exact same goes for Foster. My response was to somebody who said Foster was a "lock", so we may be going in circles a bit. Doesn't an UDFA that played himself out of the league early last season have to earn his role as well? Seems most are giving him a free pass now

Edited by Nelius

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4 hours ago, Shaw66 said:

 If Zay makes it it won't be for these reasons.  It's all about competition and the future.  Where he was drafted or what Kim Pegula may have thought about him won't matter.  No one "gets" anything.  They have to earn it.  

 

That is how it should work in a perfect world but I dont think most teams do that in reality.  I am confident the Pats operate that way.   Most teams though marry themselves to their high draft picks and will keep them even when the performance does not dictate that.

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Imo they are playing and designing plays for players on the bubble.  Wr is coming down to these couple of questions.   

 

1.  Can Roberts contribute as a regular wr?

 

If yes, then it's a real possibility Buffalo keeps 5 wrs opening day.  Brown, Beasley, Jones, Foster, and Roberts.  Than it's on one of the other players to make some plays to warrant the spot.  Right now I think they are fine keeping 5.

 

2.  Do you want to keep a back up return man on the roster at all times?

 

If you do, McKenzie is the next best punt returner behind Roberts.  This is not a necessity.  Hyde can field punts, and Singeltary could return kicks.  

 

3.  Has any wr outside the top 5 earned a roster spot?

 

I think McKenzie and Williams have both helped themselves the most thus far.  Williams brings a different dimension to the team.  McKenzie fits in to what they already do and can spell multiple positions on offense.  I dont think either has stamped their place on the 53 man roster.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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7 hours ago, Nelius said:

 

I think it's fair to assume that a 2nd round pick that this regime made may have a slightly longer leash than an UDFA, but whatever, I agree, and the exact same goes for Foster. My response was to somebody who said Foster was a "lock", so we may be going in circles a bit. Doesn't an UDFA that played himself out of the league early last season have to earn his role as well? Seems most are giving him a free pass now

I think there are very few guys who DON'T have to earn their spots.  As I've said, I think Beasley and Brown are locks on talent, Roberts as a kick returner.  No one else is a lock.  I think Foster, Duke and Zay may be tradeable.   I think its wide open.  I think it does NOT come down to who is the best.  I think it also depends on special teams play and potential.  I think Zay's problem is he played for two years and didn't stand out.  His potential may be limited. 

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9 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

I think there are very few guys who DON'T have to earn their spots.  As I've said, I think Beasley and Brown are locks on talent, Roberts as a kick returner.  No one else is a lock.  I think Foster, Duke and Zay may be tradeable.   I think its wide open.  I think it does NOT come down to who is the best.  I think it also depends on special teams play and potential.  I think Zay's problem is he played for two years and didn't stand out.  His potential may be limited. 

Duke has no trade value.

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Just now, without a drought said:

Duke has no trade value.

I think he probably does.  Other teams wanted him, and he was good enough to make the Bills before they got Beasley and Brown.  

 

If the Bills traded for a UDFA center who never played center in college, someone will trade for five-star recruit who started at Auburn and  led the CFL in receiving.  

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1 hour ago, Shaw66 said:

I think he probably does.  Other teams wanted him, and he was good enough to make the Bills before they got Beasley and Brown.  

 

If the Bills traded for a UDFA center who never played center in college, someone will trade for five-star recruit who started at Auburn and  led the CFL in receiving.  

I think Duke would fit nicely in Pittsburg.

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Posted (edited)
On 8/18/2019 at 11:01 PM, Patrick_Duffy said:

 

Yes, Duke has caught everything thrown to him for the most part, alllllll the way in those CFL days. In any event, yeah disagree, to me I think he will bring more to the table than Zay, hands down (no pun intended).

 

CFLor NFL, catching the ball is catching the ball and at least IMO he does it a lot better than Zay

Coming from someone who watches a lot of CFL, last year Edmonton Eskimos offence lived off of if was a broken play throw it in the general area of Duke and he went got it in traffic, through contact, etc. He is a catching machine and was relieved when I found out that he was leaving the CFL. And he will not make it to the practice roster. 

Edited by Engelwood

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Posted (edited)

I’m thinking Williams catches the pass that Jones dropped at the two yard line, and likely goes in for six, I think he would have caught most of the passes Jones dropped last season, Williams has much better hands, and is better with contested catches than Jones. That said I am not rooting against Jones, I would be very happy if he fixes the drops and becomes a serious weapon on the team. 

 

Go  Bills!!!

Edited by Don Otreply
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On 8/18/2019 at 10:22 AM, DJB said:

 

Personally I have McKenzie ahead of both Duke and Ray Ray. Of the 3 Ray appears 3rd in line for me after Duke and McKenzie.  

 

My guess is we keep 6 WR

 

Brown 

Beasley

Zay

Foster

Roberts 

McKenzie 

This...

 

Bills keep 6.  Foster, Roberts, McKenzie and now Zay are all working in on STs. Ray Ray has been less than impressive. If they keep Ray Ray it’s 100% all about because they drafted him. He’s done nothing in 2 years.

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On 8/20/2019 at 7:01 PM, Mat68 said:

The wild card is still Wade.  He made the 2 best plays of the Bill's preseason thus far.  The whole mantra McDermott spouts that spots are earned in games, no one has made the most of their opportunities then Wade.  I think Wade earned the reps after Singletary.  Give him a larger role in preseason game 3.  See what he does vs better competition.

I agree. Put Wade in with the 2nd stringers, may be even with the 1st team and see how he plays against  NFL starters/backups. I hope Wade starts the game #4 as others are likely to sit out.

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On 8/18/2019 at 11:23 AM, Sammy Watkins' Rib said:

Yeldon is toast.

 

I sure hope they keep Wade on the 53. I think there is a reasonably good chance (50/50) Gore is cut or McCoy is traded or possibly cut. 

 

Where exactly has John Brown been? I believe he has two targets and 1 catch in two pre-season games with a goose egg in the last game. I'm sure his spot is safe, but he has seen very little action. I didn't think it was possible at first but I just don't see the value in keeping Zay Jones. He's being consistently outplayed or at least matched by guys drafted much lower than him. If he were not a high draft pick it wouldn't even be a debate about whether he would be cut or not. Maybe they try work a trade for him as it is likely another team could see value in him still and think they can get more out of him. Maybe Washington or the New York Giants? Send Washington Zay and a 2nd rounder for Trent Williams?

I don’t think John Brown played in the last preseason game

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Wade is awesome, but his inexperience will ultimately be his downfall.

 

Its tough to give a roster spot to someone who hasn’t ever endured through 16 weeks of straight football, or anything close to it, like CFB or Canadian. 

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7 hours ago, Chandler#81 said:

 

Willingness my ass. He’s in danger of losing his job and it’s desperation time.

This team needs to move forward and put the best men on the field. The time is now for Jones to step it up. His 2nd round status is wearing rather thin.

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6 hours ago, GETTOTHE50 said:

Wade is awesome, but his inexperience will ultimately be his downfall.

 

Its tough to give a roster spot to someone who hasn’t ever endured through 16 weeks of straight football, or anything close to it, like CFB or Canadian. 

I dont think you consider rostering Wade with the expectation of an every down back.  If he continues to make plays, and shows that same ability vs better competition you have to consider it.  The 4th rb behind McCoy, Gore, and Singeltary is going to have slim pickings anyways.  Having a guy who can run a gadget play ie designed swing passes and toss sweeps with big play ability, could make sense.

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Posted (edited)
14 hours ago, BUNCH OF MULARKEY said:

Looks like Zay may be just eeking out a roster spot.   McDermott referenced his willingness to take on a special teams role 

https://wgr550.radio.com/articles/news/bills-mcdermott

 

Yep. On a similar note:

https://www.buffalobills.com/news/bills-today-sean-mcdermott-sees-advantage-to-different-offensive-line-combinatio

 

Excerpts:

Quote

Jones has been put into a spot where coaches are asking more of him on offense and even a role on special teams.

 

Quote

Jones said after practice on Wednesday that he hasn’t had game reps on special teams the way he’s had them this preseason. The biggest challenge for Jones has been learning a new set of skills.

 

Edited by WhoTom

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On 8/18/2019 at 8:26 AM, Mrbojanglezs said:

Am I crazy for wanting Duke on the team over Zay? Duke looks like he has way better hands for contested catches over the middle. 

 

No you're not. Duke would make a very good RZ threat. Zay is just too inconsistent. I also like McKenzie over McCloud. Beasley and Brown will get the lion's share of targets. Roberts on returns will be fun to watch. 

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