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Shaw66

Receiver competition with two games left

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4 minutes ago, Formerly Allan in MD said:

Is Foster truly a lock? 

 

 

I don't think so. He needs to start showing some thing. If Duke Williams shows something in preseason 3 I'd be worried if I was Foster

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Brown Jones Beasley Roberts seem to be locks.

Foster gets more time with 1s than anyone else so it really comes down to McKenzie vs Williams. And Williams probably ends up on the PS if I had to guess. He could conceivably sign elsewhere too but that's my guess. 

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2 hours ago, Logic said:


I'm not really sure why the Bills would want to trade away their leader in touchdown receptions from last year for a late round pick. Seems like bad business.

To make room for another worthy WR on the roster.

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McKenzie has popped so much during the games, not only in the preseason but also in the regular season last year. At this point it would seem rather foolish to let him go. He's a very dangerous weapon on offense AND special teams.

 

You have a primary X, a primary Y, and a primary slot, and you have backups for all three. Some teams will keep a 7th receiver as a specialist. This is what I would do if I were the Bills...

 

X: Brown, Foster
Y: Jones, Williams
Slot: Beasley, McKenzie

Specialist: Roberts

I actually think this is a position on the roster where the Bills need to keep an extra player. It is not unheard of to keep 7, especially when you have such a great specialist in Roberts and you have so many unique skill sets that you don't want to lose.

 

You might even see McCloud and Phillips on the practice squad, too!

 

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2 minutes ago, billykay said:

To make room for another worthy WR on the roster.


What makes any of the other receivers that he would be cut in favor of -- none of whom have ever caught a regular season touchdown -- worthy of booting him off the roster? The fact that they impressed in camp or a preseason game?

 

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Posted (edited)
25 minutes ago, FlaFitz1 said:

 

 

It’s not just about drops. It’s about the fact that when Allen targets Zay a negative play is the result far too much. Search receivers on Pro Football Reference with 100+ targets and sort by catch percentage. He comes up ranked 25th out of 28 WR’s and has a much lower YPC and YPT average than 90% of the receivers on the list. 

 

At the very least he needs to be targeted far less than he was last year unless him and Allen start to connect on the same page more often.

 

And of course we saw the same problems when Tyrod was QB too. And last year Foster managed to have a much higher ypc and catch percentage than Zay. The common denominator in Zay’s lack of production seems to be Zay himself thus far.

 

 

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/play-index/psl_finder.cgi?request=1&match=single&year_min=2018&year_max=2018&season_start=1&season_end=-1&pos[]=wr&draft_year_min=1936&draft_year_max=2019&draft_slot_min=1&draft_slot_max=500&draft_pick_in_round=pick_overall&conference=any&draft_pos[]=qb&draft_pos[]=rb&draft_pos[]=wr&draft_pos[]=te&draft_pos[]=e&draft_pos[]=t&draft_pos[]=g&draft_pos[]=c&draft_pos[]=ol&draft_pos[]=dt&draft_pos[]=de&draft_pos[]=dl&draft_pos[]=ilb&draft_pos[]=olb&draft_pos[]=lb&draft_pos[]=cb&draft_pos[]=s&draft_pos[]=db&draft_pos[]=k&draft_pos[]=p&c1stat=targets&c1comp=gt&c1val=100&c2stat=pass_sacked&c2comp=gt&c5val=1.0&order_by=catch_pct

 

Edited by Sammy Watkins' Rib

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3 hours ago, djp14150 said:

I look st it and say the team has 

 

2 qb

9 OL

13 WR/TE/RB

1 Returner 

 

on D

8 DL

6 LB

1 OLB/DE

10 DB

 

3 ST..k, p, ls

 

for recrivers

 

4 RB 

5 WR

3 TE

1 returner (WR)

1 best player left

 

i don’t see the bed to keep a FB. Use a TE in this role.

1 bext left

 

 

 

 

 

 

I think you are real close to what the team will look like position wise to start the season especially if Kroft starts out on PUP.

Roberts showing worth as a WR pretty much takes away any fantasy of 7 WR on the team.

DiMarco is a key unknown.

 

The only other wrench in the works is if McDermott doesn't go with a 25 balance on O and D.

I think there is a chance he goes 26-O and 24-D (it was that way for some time last year) especially if key STers are on O.

 

Lots of posters are saying a lot of the Bills cuts will get snatched up by other teams.

History shows that is usually not the case.

A couple surely may but I think more than a few good players will make it onto the PS.

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Formerly Allan in MD said:

Is Foster truly a lock? 

Tough to say, but I don't see the coaching staff giving up on him.

 

He had a horrible preseason last year too. Then later on he put it together and was playing very good in the second half of the season.

 

He might not be a lock, but I think he will make the final 53.

Edited by Mark Vader

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3 hours ago, MAJBobby said:

Taking 6. And after week two this is what I am thinking

 

Brown

Jones

Foster

Beasley

Roberts 

 

so comes down to size or shiftiness 

Williams - Size

McCloud - Shiftiness 

 

Also could very well keep and Extra WR to start season depending on Kroft

 

Kroft - PUP

Knox

Sweeney

 

so do you cut Lee Smith for an extra WR spot? 

 

McKenzie has to be ahead of Ray Ray right now.  He’s pulled away the last 2 weeks IMO

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Posted (edited)

The thing is,  no-one feels confident that Jones will catch what’s thrown to him, even his die hard fans don’t feel super confident. My feeling on this is that he is scared of the hit that’s inevitably coming in close quarters and this effects his catch in the clutch moments.  Saw eight drops in the five minutes of drops video, might have been more. That was only the games with JA at Qb.

 

Go Bills!!!

Edited by Don Otreply

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, FlaFitz1 said:

 

Jones was targeted 102 times last season and had 2 drops

Foster was targeted 44 times and had 2 drops

Beasley was targeted 87 times by Dallas last year and had 2 drops

Brown was targeted 97 times in Baltimore and dropped 6

McKenzie saw 30 targets with 1 drop

Roberts targeted 18 times dropped 1

 

Wrong.  Zay has way more drops and here is video evidence.  This is just the 10 games with Allen and doesn’t even include the 4 games with NP and DA. Zay is on this reel more than any other WR at 8 or 9 times.

 

 

The “dropped ball” stat that is tracked is highly inaccurate every year. 

Edited by Alphadawg7
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10 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Wrong.  Zay has way more drops and here is video evidence.  This is just the 10 games with Allen and doesn’t even include the 4 games with NP and DA. Zay is on this reel more than any other WR at 8 or 9 times.

 

 

The “dropped ball” stat that is tracked is highly inaccurate every year. 

 

Thank you for this. The throw at 47 seconds of this video is exactly why I'd rather have Duke Williams on this team. Zay disappoints far too often with his hands, and he is afraid of contact 

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3 hours ago, Mrbojanglezs said:

Am I crazy for wanting Duke on the team over Zay? Duke looks like he has way better hands for contested catches over the middle. 

 

 

How about Duke over Foster? I don't get the blind Foster love on here, especially when coupled with blind Zay Jones hate. Why is Foster so safe if Zay is presumably on the bubble?

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I don't think it's a crazy idea to keep 7 WR. This would include both Williams and McKenzie. Williams, I think, may be the only WR on the roster with the ball skills to high point contested catches. 

 

What other spot spot would you "short "?

 

i think either TE or LB. because Bills base offense is 11 personnel, and their base defense is a 4-2-5. I'm using base here to signify most common alignment. 

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3 minutes ago, Nelius said:

 

How about Duke over Foster? I don't get the blind Foster love on here, especially when coupled with blind Zay Jones hate. Why is Foster so safe if Zay is presumably on the bubble?

 

Foster at least contributes speed to the offense. Defenses have to worry about him over the top. I mean I'm disappointed with him this offseason but he still puts stress on the opposition. Zay is just a guy. He doesn't provide anything special. If we're picking between 2 receivers with hand problems I'll take the speedy guy.

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Posted (edited)
11 minutes ago, pennstate10 said:

I don't think it's a crazy idea to keep 7 WR. This would include both Williams and McKenzie. Williams, I think, may be the only WR on the roster with the ball skills to high point contested catches. 

 

What other spot spot would you "short "?

 

i think either TE or LB. because Bills base offense is 11 personnel, and their base defense is a 4-2-5. I'm using base here to signify most common alignment. 

You might be able to short TE keep 3 with Sweeny, Knox, Smith with kroft on PUP coming back to make it 4 then make a decision at WR or other position then 

Edited by Mrbojanglezs

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7 minutes ago, pennstate10 said:

I don't think it's a crazy idea to keep 7 WR. This would include both Williams and McKenzie. Williams, I think, may be the only WR on the roster with the ball skills to high point contested catches. 

 

What other spot spot would you "short "?

 

i think either TE or LB. because Bills base offense is 11 personnel, and their base defense is a 4-2-5. I'm using base here to signify most common alignment. 

 

Only dressing 46 on game day.  There is a good chance only 5 WR dress.

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Posted (edited)

If Duke makes one more big catch I could see it going:

 

Brown 

Beasley

Zay

Foster

Roberts 
Williams

I just don't see what McCloud and McKenzie offer that you can't find anywhere.

 

 

Edited by BullBuchanan

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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, Logic said:


Well first of all, he plays all four special teams units. A player that plays all four special teams units is more valuable than a back-end receiver who doesn't really contribute on special teams. So even if special teams were ALL that Dimarco did, he would be worth keeping over a non-ST contributing depth receiver.

But it's NOT all he does. He plays about 20-30% of the offensive snaps. Daboll's offensive playbook is extremely similar to New England's. It features a fullback. In the NFL, your offensive system either features a fullback or it doesn't. Daboll's does. You could employ a back-end-of-the-roster TE as a fullback, but he probably wouldn't be any good at it.

Unless and until the Bills change offensive coordinators and offensive playbooks, you can count on them continuing to employ and use a traditional fullback.

Thanks. I didn't understand the case for Dimarco.  This explains it and answers the question. He is in. 

Edited by Shaw66

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4 hours ago, Logic said:


I'm not really sure why the Bills would want to trade away their leader in touchdown receptions from last year for a late round pick. Seems like bad business.

Welcome to roster management when you have depth.  When you have more options than you have slots, you look at potential and trade value.  You certainly dont look at history.

 

It's unlikely Jones will ever lead this team in TDs again.  He has trade value.  Williams has more potential.  In that situation, even though Jonea may be in the top 6 in terms of current performance, a year from now the Bills may be better off having gotten a po k for him now and having let someone else grow into something.  

 

If Jones isnt in the top 3 receivers, his best use may be as trade bait. 

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1 hour ago, HappyDays said:

 

Foster at least contributes speed to the offense. Defenses have to worry about him over the top. I mean I'm disappointed with him this offseason but he still puts stress on the opposition. Zay is just a guy. He doesn't provide anything special. If we're picking between 2 receivers with hand problems I'll take the speedy guy.

 

 

We have speed in spades with Brown McKenzie Beasley Roberts ..What we need is tall WR who can go up and make the circus catch with a sick arm radius.. If Duke can make catches like he did in Carolina sign me up

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