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Phil The Thrill

Greg Cosell Says Ed Oliver “struggled” and evaluates new Bills players in preseason debut

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12 minutes ago, jeremy2020 said:

 

Baldy's breakdown was awfully high on Oliver's play so I don't wtf you watched.

I didn't think Baldy was that high on him at all, and I watched it. He basically said he didn't do much against Nelson and was mostly controlled, but still flashed athletic talent, which excited him. The main takeaway was that this was his first preseason game so focus on the athletic promise rather than the production, which was mostly negligible. He did almost get one sack, but it was of the vulture variety on a hustle play in which the QB didn't get rid of the ball quickly.

 

Regardless, it's all fine. He'll get better because he does have a lot of physical talent. He'll be going up against a lot of bad guards over the course of the year.  

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1 hour ago, Element115 said:

 

Logic dictates Donald is rare, not that Oliver will have similar success just because they are the same size lol.  

 

That's kind of the definition of homerism.

 

Its not “homerism,” it’s pointing out inconsistencies between national analysts and beat reporters.  Compare the evaluation of Cosell and Baldy to Sa Capaccio and Joe B/Matt Fairburn.  They have different opinions on his debut

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Just now, Phil The Thrill said:

 

Its not “homerism,” it’s pointing out inconsistencies between national analysts and beat reporters.  Compare the evaluation of Cosell and Baldy to Sa Capaccio and Joe B/Matt Fairburn.  They have different opinions on his debut

 

Do you think this happens to just the Buffalo Bills organization?  Or other organizations who have not won for like 25 years?

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Just now, Element115 said:

 

Do you think this happens to just the Buffalo Bills organization?  Or other organizations who have not won for like 25 years?

 

If you are evaluating the performance of a player in his debut, none of that should matter.  If it does, it shows a tremendous bias for someone who is supposed to be an “impartial” journalist 

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1 minute ago, Phil The Thrill said:

 

If you are evaluating the performance of a player in his debut, none of that should matter.  If it does, it shows a tremendous bias for someone who is supposed to be an “impartial” journalist 

 

Yes, media is biased, hope you're not just figuring that out!  When you were in High School, were things biased towards the popular kids?  Was everything done in High School accurate? How about politics, is there any media bias there, does popularity come into play? How accurate is media when it comes to reporting on politics?

 

Sports is generally reported on by ex players and people with communications degrees, not astrophysicists or mathematicians.

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1 hour ago, Element115 said:

 

I need to find the Baldy breakdown and watch again, I can't picture the play.  But from the sounds of it I could question how long an undersized player could keep that up.

How can you determine ANYTHING from a breakdown where he didnt play a full game in pre season?

1 hour ago, MDH said:

It’s interesting that he though Ford played well and Oliver struggled. Most observers had the opposite take.

 

I wonder, what were Cosell’s pre-draft evaluations of those guys?

I actually didnt think Ford struggled.....he had a couple of bad snaps but also some very good ones.

 

I didnt think Oliver struggled at all.....I dont understand why it is so hard to understand that even a very good rookie is not going to win EVERY snap?

49 minutes ago, Element115 said:

 

Yes, media is biased, hope you're not just figuring that out!  When you were in High School, were things biased towards the popular kids?  Was everything done in High School accurate? How about politics, is there any media bias there, does popularity come into play? How accurate is media when it comes to reporting on politics?

 

Sports is generally reported on by ex players and people with communications degrees, not astrophysicists or mathematicians.

This is not high school.....

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Posted (edited)
14 hours ago, Phil The Thrill said:

I enjoy listening to the old and wise Greg Cosell breaking down the Bills with The Murph on One Bills Live.

 

I saw that he was on the show last Friday to evaluate the Bills in the preseason opener so i took a listen.

 

To my surprise he was no high on Ed Oliver’s debut.  He said he “struggled” for most of his plays especially when facing double teams.  He also said that Eddie needs to develop “perfect technique” in the NFL because he is too small to take on double teams.  

 

I watched the game and this was not the impression I came away with.  I did see Ed get taken out by Quentin Nelson a few times but he is an All-Pro and one of the best.  I was very impressed by his debut, as were many Bills beat writers and it makes me wonder whether Greg really watched all of Ed’s plays of just the few where he was rendered ineffective by Nelson.

 

As for the rest, Greg seemed somewhat reserved.  He mentioned some good things but also didn’t seem too impressed.  Even Murph was like “I feel pretty good about the Bills.”  But Greg did say, it’s important not to take away too much from the preseason - so maybe that’s why.   

 

He is high on Daryl Johnson.  This he can be a good edge rusher in the NFL.

 

Thinks Josh made some good throws but also missed a few others he should have had.   That pass to Zay Jones could have gotten him walloped.  Says he needs to work on that.

 

Liked Cody Ford’s debut.  Believes that the coaching staff is trying to find the 5 best lineman which is why they are moving him around.  

 

Thinks Vosean Joseph moves well but is a little small and thinks he’ll play behind Matt Milano and will have a tough time getting on the field behind him. (Greg actually talked about him and then 5 minutes later Tasker said “what did you think about Vosean Joseph?”  forcing Greg to repeat what he said earlier LOL).

 

Said Tyree Jackson struggled big time as well and has a ton of work to do.  

 

Puts over Singletary’s hard running, vision and patience but questions whether he can be a “power runner” due to his small size.  

 

https://app.radio.com/hiQaUPmN6Y

I keep seeing people say this, yet Darius Leonard is 6-2, 230 and Vosean Joseph is 6-1, 230 (Combine measurements). Once Joseph gets NFL training, he will get stronger and put on a few pounds. I think he's Lorenzo Alexander's replacement next year, not Milano's backup. I think Milano - Edmunds - Joseph could be one of the best LB trios in the league within a couple years, they have a lot of talent and a ton of athleticism.

 

 

As for everything else, I agree with Cosell. I still worry about Allen, Ford is legit, Oliver is very small for a DT, Singletary's size and speed worry me, and Jackson should be tried at TE. I like Johnson a lot (especially his size)...he's been behind Hughes, Lawson, Murphy, Yarbrough and Love, but he won't make it to the practice squad. I'd keep Hughes, Lawson, Murphy, Love and Johnson...the two young kids can be just as effective as Yarbrough.

 

I'd like to keep all of our rookies and 2nd year players, because I don't think any of them will go unclaimed in the practice squad process. Draft picks like Vosean Joseph, Darryl Johnson, Jaquan Johnson, Ray-Ray McCloud, Siran Neal, Tommy Sweeney, Wyatt Teller, and UDFA's like Tyree Jackson, Mike Love and Corey Thompson, would all get claimed. I'm not sure where most of them stand with the team, but they all have talent and teams would claim them, especially the draft picks. I'd add Jason Croom and Cam Phillips too, but I see no way that they can make the roster with the talent in front of them.

 

Either way, it's nice that we're finally getting to a point where we can worry about who makes it and who doesn't...it's been a long time coming.

Edited by JustWinPlease

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That play where Oliver jumps up and causes a pump fake then he gets inside anyway and winds up whiffing on the sack is the kind of play I expect from a talented rookie who’s just figuring things out. 

 

I thought it was weird that Colts doubled him so much. Is Nelson not a good enough player yet to handle a rookie on his own? Guess they wanted to send a message.

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20 minutes ago, VW82 said:

That play where Oliver jumps up and causes a pump fake then he gets inside anyway and winds up whiffing on the sack is the kind of play I expect from a talented rookie who’s just figuring things out. 

 

I thought it was weird that Colts doubled him so much. Is Nelson not a good enough player yet to handle a rookie on his own? Guess they wanted to send a message.

I bet some thought it was a bad play when Oliver whiffed on the sack

 

I dont agree....that broke the QB's timing....it wasnt as flashy as getting an actual sack but I consider "pressures" to be more important then sacks

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2 minutes ago, John from Riverside said:

I bet some thought it was a bad play when Oliver whiffed on the sack

 

I dont agree....that broke the QB's timing....it wasnt as flashy as getting an actual sack but I consider "pressures" to be more important then sacks

 

Sacks are great, but so is messing with the QB's timing to make a bad throw 

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8 minutes ago, John from Riverside said:

I bet some thought it was a bad play when Oliver whiffed on the sack

 

I dont agree....that broke the QB's timing....it wasnt as flashy as getting an actual sack but I consider "pressures" to be more important then sacks

The fact Nelson couldn’t finish Oliver BEFORE Oliver whiffed on the sack was incredible. If Oliver could have corralled Brissett and brought him down for the sack, the ENTIRE narrative of the Nelson/Oliver matchup results is changed. 

 

Most other DTs, up in the air with Nelson trying to finish them, are flat on their backs. That was an amazing display of athleticism by Oliver. 

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12 hours ago, Protocal69 said:

Kid Ed Oliver gonna be good bro. Guy with that kinda leverage and Athletic ability . He was playing the Dbl teams tough and made tackles off them! That’s impressive. I thought he would get tossed around! That play where he landed on his feet after jumping Maan please !

— Willie Anderson (@BigWillie7179) August 10, 2019

 

That is a former ALL-PRO Offensive Tackle  giving his opinion.

 

 

Yes that really caught Nelson by surprise........once he left his feet Nelson gave him a good shove and relaxed assuming the play was over.

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On third downs I watched Oliver exclusively and he was tossing Nelson around, so from a pure pass rush standpoint he looked really good.

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Oliver wasn't getting pushed back by double teams and only really got completely controlled twice, I'd call that a solid debut considering the competition. 

 

 

Allen getting crap for the Zay drop is hilarious. There was plenty of space for Zay to catch the ball and score while protecting himself. Watching Zay flub that and then thinking about Singletary reaching up for a high throw from Barkley only to quickly spin out of a hit and pick up 6 yards for a first, is kinda frustrating to think about. A first year RB made a really nice catch/play for a first down while the 3rd year WR continues to make the same mistakes he's been making. 

 

 

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15 hours ago, JOE IN HAMPTON ROADS said:

so our brand new rookie struggled against All-Pro double teams in his first NFL outing?  BUST!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

My thought as well. Who doesn’t struggle with double team. Dareus struggled with double teams sometimes during his all pro seasons...  

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I thought he did very well and was in for a near sack and a couple of other nice plays in his first couple of drives of NFL action

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Oliver looked good against a great line. Should of had a TFL on the one play and batted down a pass on the other. Colts line is very good.

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4 hours ago, Element115 said:

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MacGyver

 

I don't see any Bills related content there. I reported your post as spam.

 

Are you an engineer? Do you have a problem with women in the workplace? What were your thoughts on Josh Rosen at draft time last year? Those are just 3 random questions for you, don't read anything into them.

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3 hours ago, John from Riverside said:

How can you determine ANYTHING from a breakdown where he didnt play a full game in pre season?

I actually didnt think Ford struggled.....he had a couple of bad snaps but also some very good ones.

 

I didnt think Oliver struggled at all.....I dont understand why it is so hard to understand that even a very good rookie is not going to win EVERY snap?

This is not high school.....

 

I don’t get his point.  Is he saying the media is bias against the Bills for being irrelevant over the past 2 decades?  Is that why Cosell said Oliver was disappointing?

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Posted (edited)
12 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

Are you an engineer? Do you have a problem with women in the workplace? What were your thoughts on Josh Rosen at draft time last year? Those are just 3 random questions for you, don't read anything into them.

outstanding.

 

you may want to see how he feels about macgyver.

Edited by teef

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16 hours ago, Azucho98 said:

He was watching Ed with his eyes closed....the same way he should keep his mouth.  

Boom Take that Cosell.

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5 hours ago, Element115 said:

 

Maybe they should win some games and this would not happen?  I mean the media guys you are whining about have NEVER seen the Bills win. Some of them not even born yet when the Bills were last good lol.

 

And this justifies them being paid for spouting ignorance?  Or more specifically to your weird arguments, that "being a homer" is disqualifying some of us from calling them out on their lazy ignorance??

 

Dude, you are seriously drifting into Troll territory.

 

 

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