TigerJ Posted June 21, 2019 Share Posted June 21, 2019 2 hours ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said: Poyer and Hyde have been absolute gems. Both were marginal players in their prior teams and systems and marginal prospects coming out. In buffalo they have flourished. McDermotts defense is secondary friendly. Hyde was kind of a utility DB for the packers. He played some safety and some slot CB as well as special teams. Green Bay liked their safeties, I guess, so Hyde never got a shot to start for them. Poyer was a depth safety for the Browns. McDermott surmised he had the talent to start and took a chance. Both were great signings for Buffalo, but I'm getting the impression that one advantage of McDermott's defensive scheme is that it tends to get the most out of players who might be marginal for other teams. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eball Posted June 21, 2019 Share Posted June 21, 2019 1 minute ago, TigerJ said: I'm getting the impression that one advantage of McDermott's defensive scheme is that it tends to get the most out of players who might be marginal for other teams. This is so deep it's beyond my comprehension... 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stank_Nasty Posted June 21, 2019 Share Posted June 21, 2019 8 minutes ago, TigerJ said: Hyde was kind of a utility DB for the packers. He played some safety and some slot CB as well as special teams. Green Bay liked their safeties, I guess, so Hyde never got a shot to start for them. Poyer was a depth safety for the Browns. McDermott surmised he had the talent to start and took a chance. Both were great signings for Buffalo, but I'm getting the impression that one advantage of McDermott's defensive scheme is that it tends to get the most out of players who might be marginal for other teams. so what could it do with his shiny new toy, "Big" Ed?!?! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TigerJ Posted June 21, 2019 Share Posted June 21, 2019 38 minutes ago, eball said: This is so deep it's beyond my comprehension... I'm just looking at the number of players, either free agents from other teams, draft picks and UDFAs who have outplayed expectations that observers outside of Buffalo have had for them: Hyde, Poyer, Milano, Zo, Levi Wallace, Taron Johnson. Even a first round pick like Tre White has been as productive as a couple CBs picked ahead of him. We haven't seen so much of that out of the line, but maybe there's something about the scheme that helps the LBs and DBs look better at the expense of the line. I do think having a difference maker like Ed Oliver could do some real interesting things for the defense this year 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punching Bag Posted June 21, 2019 Share Posted June 21, 2019 2 hours ago, Ethan in Portland said: Beane has no idea if Allen will ever be able to consistently complete a 10 yard crossing pattern or if a 19 year old kid can continue to develop any more than the other 31 general managers. I am sure a 19 year old kid can continue to develop ON THE FOOTBALL FIELD more than the other 31 general managers. 2 hours ago, 1ManRaid said: The sarcasm may not be clear enough for some on here. Wasn't him being traded a forced issue? Like he just wanted out of Buffalo or something? After negotiating a new contract his agent, currently in hell, wanted to renegotiate since he was moved from RT to LT with three years left and he told his client to hold out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eball Posted June 21, 2019 Share Posted June 21, 2019 19 minutes ago, TigerJ said: I'm just looking at the number of players, either free agents from other teams, draft picks and UDFAs who have outplayed expectations that observers outside of Buffalo have had for them: Hyde, Poyer, Milano, Zo, Levi Wallace, Taron Johnson. Even a first round pick like Tre White has been as productive as a couple CBs picked ahead of him. We haven't seen so much of that out of the line, but maybe there's something about the scheme that helps the LBs and DBs look better at the expense of the line. I do think having a difference maker like Ed Oliver could do some real interesting things for the defense this year Or maybe McD and his staff are good coaches. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo716 Posted June 21, 2019 Share Posted June 21, 2019 Draft position literally means NOTHING once your in the league Poyer is a good system player and fits the scheme but he is pretty one dimensional He is fantastic in coverage but below average in run support and misses way to many tackles. But his contract is a bargain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TigerJ Posted June 21, 2019 Share Posted June 21, 2019 40 minutes ago, eball said: Or maybe McD and his staff are good coaches. I think they are, but part of being a good coach is putting your players in a position to succeed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Badanswer Posted June 21, 2019 Author Share Posted June 21, 2019 4 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said: Poyer is a good system player and fits the scheme but he is pretty one dimensional I must disagree....he's all over the field and pretty good in all phases 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo716 Posted June 21, 2019 Share Posted June 21, 2019 (edited) 12 minutes ago, Badanswer said: I must disagree....he's all over the field and pretty good in all phases You can have your opinion and yes he is all over the field but he misses the most tackles on our team It would take hours to go through a whole season and make a video of just poyer tackle attempts but there would be a lot of misses and getting trucked and stiff armed Hyde is smaller and A MUCH Sounder tackler and he's average against the run . ... Poyer is below average against the run and misses tackles weekly He is great against the pass but not that great against the run It's not being mean it's the truth Edited June 21, 2019 by Buffalo716 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Badanswer Posted June 21, 2019 Author Share Posted June 21, 2019 11 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said: You can have your opinion Discussion is always good :)....no sweat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo716 Posted June 21, 2019 Share Posted June 21, 2019 Just now, Badanswer said: Discussion is always good :)....no sweat Can't wait for the season ! This is our year! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted June 21, 2019 Share Posted June 21, 2019 I am much higher than 716 on Poyer and we have debated it before. I think he is average against the run and borderline elite in coverage and he excels defending in the redzone. In this day in age give me the safety will elite cover skills against the safety who can run up and stuff the running back every single day of every single week. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Over 29 years of fanhood Posted June 21, 2019 Share Posted June 21, 2019 3 hours ago, TigerJ said: Hyde was kind of a utility DB for the packers. He played some safety and some slot CB as well as special teams. Green Bay liked their safeties, I guess, so Hyde never got a shot to start for them. Poyer was a depth safety for the Browns. McDermott surmised he had the talent to start and took a chance. Both were great signings for Buffalo, but I'm getting the impression that one advantage of McDermott's defensive scheme is that it tends to get the most out of players who might be marginal for other teams. Scheme fit matters for every team. That’s why free agents can go from boom or bust, to boom or bust. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanker Posted June 21, 2019 Share Posted June 21, 2019 7 hours ago, Stank_Nasty said: just.... what a player. hopefully the team starts winning and he gets recognized like we all know he should...…. although I get slightly annoyed with how "pretty"(her words) my wife thinks he is. if I watched blake lively movies 16 sundays a year and routinely reminded my darling of how "pretty" blake was I may not live to see a 17th week.... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo716 Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 7 hours ago, GunnerBill said: I am much higher than 716 on Poyer and we have debated it before. I think he is average against the run and borderline elite in coverage and he excels defending in the redzone. In this day in age give me the safety will elite cover skills against the safety who can run up and stuff the running back every single day of every single week. I didn't think I ever said he wasn't a good football player He has some really good traits especially for the modern NFL but he absolutely has weaknesses like most players His is top notch in man to man as a safety and has good awareness in zone so he is a versatile FS I like him , certainly a good football player , I just wish we had someone on the roster who has shown he can cover and lay the wood... Rare combination I know Poyer and Hyde certainly are in the running as best playmaking safety tandem 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
machine gun kelly Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 The OP makes a good point and another example is emerging in Foster. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
formerlyofCtown Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 (edited) On 6/21/2019 at 10:32 AM, Over 29 years of fanhood said: Poyer and Hyde have been absolute gems. Both were marginal players in their prior teams and systems and marginal prospects coming out. In buffalo they have flourished. McDermotts defense is secondary friendly. Hyde was pretty good in GB. Their fan base was pissed they didnt resign him. IIRC On 6/21/2019 at 11:03 AM, Ethan in Portland said: Why you should always trade down not up in the draft. Its a total crap shoot and none of these GMs are any better at finding talent than any of the others. The examples of busts and misses are limitless. Beane has no idea if Allen will ever be able to consistently complete a 10 yard crossing pattern or if a 19 year old kid can continue to develop any more than the other 31 general managers. Trade down and add more players. Every once in a while you will find a Stevie Johnson or even better an Antonio Gates. Of course there are always gems in UDFA like Jason Peters, too bad the Bills couldn't find a guy like that. I mean a future HOF player at LT. Bills just never seem to find those guys. Beane should have waited so we could get the next JP Losman or waited even longer for the next EJ.?? The draft is about what they could become. Potential. Safe drafters lose their jobs. Edited June 22, 2019 by formerlyofCtown 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Over 29 years of fanhood Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 17 minutes ago, formerlyofCtown said: Hyde was pretty good in GB. Their fan base was pissed they didnt resign him. IIRC A good former Bills comparison is NRC- the 12 best player on d. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
formerlyofCtown Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 (edited) 2 minutes ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said: A good former Bills comparison is NRC- the 12 best player on d. They probably did think he was the 12 best player but had plenty of guys he was better than. They apparently just didnt know it yet. Edited June 22, 2019 by formerlyofCtown 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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