Would you rather explore Julio Jones or Clowney in the trade market?

[GunnerBill]

2 minutes ago, ProcessTruster said:

neither. 

 

shiny objects. 

 

too expensive.   we just got out of cap hell.   lets not go back into it

 

We were never in cap hell.

[BADOLBILZ]

 

Julio Jones and it's not close.

 

This is a critical year for Josh Allen.    He and the Bills passing game struggled mightily last year.   His huge rushing games covered for a lot of deficiencies but that can't continue.     Even if they tried, the Pats and Lions laid out effective gamelans to defend against Allen running the ball which will simply be copied by opposing DC's.    He needs to pass his way to success.

 

They improved the WR corps some and if healthy now have "just" a bottom 1/3 of the league WR unit instead of the dead last quality unit that they started last season with.

 

But that's still a sink or swim proposition for Josh Allen............which just ain't how the successful teams are doing it.

 

I love Clowney..........but the reality is that this team has already invested 3 of 4 McD first rounders on defense.

 

The long term play for your team is to prop up and build up your QB.    Defensive success is fleeting.

 

That said.........the Falcons owner has sworn numerous times publicly that Julio will be a Falcon for life and Julio seems comfortable with negotiations so I guess that's off the table.

 

And if they trade a first round pick for Clowney they will have no ammunition to get one of the top WR in the 2020 class...........which projects to be a great one like the 2014 or 1996 drafts.

 

[Pete]

Hold on to our draft picks.  It’s only May.  WRs and DEs will be available.  Beane is not done improving roster

[BigBuff423]

Like all things in life, it really depends on the cost. If they both cost a 1st, then no to both. If they both cost a 2nd, then yes to Clowney and no to Jones. If Jones cost a 3rd and Clowney costs a 2nd, I'd still take Clowney. But, if Jones and Clowney both cost a third, then I'd take Jones as it will help Josh Allen in a measurable way, regardless of wins and losses. Allen's development is THE key in his 2nd year. IF Allen takes a huge step forward, then all of the investment is worth it because the Bills will have set the stage for the next decade of what can be accomplished. 

 

That's not to say I'm giving up on this year, it's just to say I don't want the Bills to bet on a Ravens-esque Defense and Dilfer at QB for the LONG term. And since we've been down this road before trying to make gold out of hay with poor QBs, IMHO - it's *more* important we see big strides in development from Josh. I think, *think*, Josh will develop AND the Bills will make a push for the playoffs if injuries aren't a big problem and the rest of the team plays to their capability.

 

All of that said, I like the idea of Clowney better because of his position, age, talent level, and how the NFL is structured today, in terms of the game itself and contracts. I don't think people outside of Buffalo (and some inside it as well) are giving their WRs enough credit. The O-line was really bad as a whole last year and that makes it nearly impossible to sit in a pocket and make plays and even harder for a young QB to truly grow and yet, we saw it before our very eyes: Josh Allen got markedly better in his final quarter of the season. Give him time and the WRs / TEs time to get actually get a little separation, add in a better running game with better Offensive Line play, and the additions to the roster as well as developing young players in Jones and Foster (and Croom) and I think we'll see a much better passing game and QB play. 

[BADOLBILZ]

35 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

If the Falcons struggle this season (I think they might) then I think Julio could be available for trade next offseason. I think the Falcons would likely try a mini reset and Julio at 31 with one year left on his deal might fetch them a high pick to help that reset. If Ridley has a good season they might think Jones is expendable. If at that point an elite receiver seems to be the missing piece to put Buffalo over the top then I'd have interest depending on where we are drafting and who might come out that could be an alternative solution.

 

 

You don't think he gets his extension?    I don't think he plays this season without one.   He already held out briefly last year over the situation and they promised him a new deal.

 

IMO they should have traded him this year.    They are cap tight and have other areas of need.   And as great as he is,  he's overkill for what they can already do with Ryan.     Julio's TD's have dropped off because Ryan can't get the ball over the top like he used to.    As Brees has proven you don't need a cast of stars to complete intermediate throws.

 

Next year would be a bad offseason to trade him with that loaded WR class in the draft.    IMO, no way he nets a first rounder then.   Even after a repeat of this past season.   Age and contract will start deteriorating his trade value.

[formerlyofCtown]

13 minutes ago, ShadyBillsFan said:

If I had to choose     JJ 

Wrong Texan but he would be great next to Oliver.?

[GunnerBill]

2 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

You don't think he gets his extension?    I don't think he plays this season without one.   He already held out briefly last year over the situation and they promised him a new deal.

 

IMO they should have traded him this year.    They are cap tight and have other areas of need.   And as great as he is,  he's overkill for what they can already do with Ryan.     Julio's TD's have dropped off because Ryan can't get the ball over the top like he used to.    As Brees has proven you don't need a cast of stars to complete intermediate throws.

 

Next year would be a bad offseason to trade him with that loaded WR class in the draft.    IMO, no way he nets a first rounder then.   Even after a repeat of this past season.   Age and contract will start deteriorating his trade value.

 

Maybe they extend him. I don't think they should for the reasons you state. And my preference next offseason would be to look to what a year out seems a very talented draft class for receivers. Julio for the Bills to me is a possibility I might explore if by Jan we feel differently about that class (or we are out of range for getting one of the top guys...... one can hope!)

[thebandit27]

Priority numero uno is making sure that your young QB has every possible piece around him to develop into a franchise QB.

 

Ergo, Julio is the easy answer.

[Wayne Cubed]

Julio without question.

 

The Bills should be giving Josh Allen players that give him the best possible chance to succeed. 

[TroutDog]

27 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

We were never in cap hell.

True, but we were saddled with poorly structured contracts for players who did not  buy into the process or produce in a manner commensurate with their pay. 

 

Personally, I love how this FO is handling the cap and I’m glad we bit the bullet last year to get here. 

 

One look at the players we have jettisoned and what they’ve done since speaks volumes to the fact that Beane has done this right. 

[BADOLBILZ]

58 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

The advanced analytics show he has a very high pass rush productivity. The Texans ask him to do a lot of other stuff rather than just rush the passer though.

 

 

Clowney is a tremendous player.......he's not the ideal technician coming off of the edge.......his hands are not very effective....... and that hurts his sack numbers..........but he still gets a ton of pressure.

 

His gift is that he is maybe the fastest forward moving DL in NFL history.    When used to attack the backfield from the middle he is crazy good.   I'm sure McD would love him........and he would allow the McDefense to explore doing a lot of interesting things as they evolve.........and with a more traditional pass rusher opposite him like Hughes he makes plenty of sense even at $20M per.

 

But at some point they gotta' get more serious about addressing the offense.     Aside from the potential of Robert Foster there isn't a single guy on the offense that is someone you can count on to beat the man in front of him every week.    It's mostly stalemates at best.    Which is advantage defense.

[Victory Formation]

Julio.

[Patrick Duffy]

Julio, but highly doubt they will trade him anytime soon.

[Mark92]

If we added Clowney then the D would be 99.9 % complete.  Only thing missing would be a true 2nd CB to play opposite White.  

[Freddie's Dead]

Jones.  We need a true #1 WR.  We got a bunch of 2's and 3's.

[BarleyNY]

Man, I’d trade for either. Clowney has more value because of their ages so I’d give up more for him, but I’d take both if I could. 

Edited May 1, 2019 by BarleyNY

[Rocket94]

Clowney all the way. He is much younger and he fills a much bigger need. He may be Mcdermott's "Prototype" at the position. 

[BADOLBILZ]

50 minutes ago, Patrick_Duffy said:

Julio, but highly doubt they will trade him anytime soon.

 

Same with Clowney.    Ultimately he signs the franchise tender, IMO.    

 

Right or wrong, now that they got their LT in the draft there is no motivation to move JC.

 

I think the Texans are thinking SB this year and they probably want to buy another year and see how Clowney progresses and what condition JJ Watt is in before deciding on anything long term for Clowney or Mercilus.    

 

What do they have to lose?   They aren't cap strapped and if he remains healthy Clowney isn't signing for anything short of top of the market regardless.

 

If the Bills were in the similar situation we'd want them to hold onto Clowney.   

[Kirby Jackson]

Julio for me. I like Clowney a lot and think that he could turn this defense into an elite unit, now and moving forward. With that being said, the biggest current need on the roster is a #1 WR. Add to that with the fact that you are trying to develop your, young, franchise QB. Is there ANY better way to do that than to give him a top 3 player at the position? Julio is a complete (and dominant) player. Nothing will help the Bills more than that.

14 minutes ago, Rocket94 said:

Clowney all the way. He is much younger and he fills a much bigger need. He may be Mcdermott's "Prototype" at the position. 

You really think, at this point, that a pass rushing DE is a bigger need than a number 1 WR? I don’t even think it’s close. The Bills have 2-3 DEs (depending on where you count Zo) better than our best WR and that doesn’t even account for the fact that our DT’s will get pressure. We can rush from the edge with or without Clowney. We don’t have guys altering coverage or beating their man without Julio. 

 

An argument can certainly be made for Clowney (age, cost, etc...) but it’s a REALLY tough argument to say he fills a bigger need on this roster as of today.

Edited May 1, 2019 by Kirby Jackson

[machine gun kelly]

Unless both Houston and Atlanta are in cap hell, and absolutely has to purge salaries, they would never get rid of either one.  If asked to choose! Jones is the sexy pick given his abilities, but with his age, I would choose Clooney to make us have the best D Line in the NFL.