Jump to content

Penalties are becoming a problem again


Recommended Posts

Buffalo Bills Penalties By Year;

 

2014 Doug Marrone;   124 penalties,   31st in league       1031 yards,   28th in league   

2015 Rex Ryan;            143 penalties   32nd in league       1249 yards,   32nd in league 

2016 Rex Ryan;            111 penalties   23rd in league        995 yards,     21st in league

2017  McDermott;       98   penalties   10th in league         872 yards,    9th in league ---  PLAYOFFS

2018  McDermott;       116 penalties   27th in league         992 yards,    28th in league

 

We obviously took a big step backwards from 2017 to 2018 in penalties.  You can't blame our poor 2018 season on an increase in penalties alone, but it certainly was a significant part of it.  How many of Allen's big passes down field for a first down got called back due to penalties?  At times last season it seemed like every other big play Allen had got nullified by a penalty.  I don't think it was possible for the Bills to punt or kick off, or receive a punt or kick off last year without a penalty flag flying.   I think it's fair to blame part of the team's penalty regression on a young roster of less skillful players who got caught out of position and were forced to interfere or hold trying to make a play,  but some of it is also due to a lack of player discipline.  Below are the "discipline" penalty totals broken down by type. 

 

The totals below are for Roughing the Passer, Personal Fouls, Unnecessary Roughness, and Unsportsmanlike Conduct penalties on the Bills.  

 

2014    10

2015    12

2016    11

2017      6  ---  PLAYOFFS

2018      9

 

The totals below are for pre-snap infractions, Offside and False Start penalties on the Bills.

 

2014    26

2015    22

2016    12

2017    13 ---  PLAYOFFS

2018    26

 

We're not a good enough football team yet to be able to give away yards and downs to the opposition and not have it cost us in the win-loss column.  If we can get back to playing disciplined football that could make the difference between getting into the playoffs this year or watching from the sidelines again.  Playing clean football is a trait of well coached, disciplined, and ultimately successful teams.  McDermott and his staff need to reverse this trend and get back to playing tough, physical, but smart football this season.

 

Edited by Inigo Montoya
  • Like (+1) 1
  • Thank you (+1) 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I’ve been screaming this since January. Culture/Process/Leadership/Discipline are hammered and repeated every day by Sean. Yet we’re the antithesis of this on the field. Penalties gave away a couple games last year and put a serious dent in Josh Allen’s season stats. It wasn’t even that we weren’t good or talented enough to overcome them. I don’t think any team could. The worst byproduct of this undisciplined play is every referee team who has a Buffalo game coming next week is schooled on how error-filled we are. They expect it likely to the point of spending extra time in the days leading up to the game practicing throwing their hanky. Fair or not, this is on coaching. Implement an escalating fine system. Bench a starter for a half. Have refs at every single practice. Change your ‘Process’ Sean. With more turnovers and fewer penalties, that half-talented team threatens the playoffs last year.

  • Like (+1) 3
  • Awesome! (+1) 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Lack of talent (2018 Bills)often leads to penalties. Especially on the O line, where guys hold when they are getting physically overwhelmed , or false start trying to get into their pass set a split second too fast. I’d expect better line play this year, and less of those types of penalties. I often hear folks say penalties are on the coaching, but ex players ( such as Steve Tasker) will say it’s on the players. I’d tend to agree with Tasker there. Players are out on the field, not the coach. 

Edited by Boatdrinks
  • Like (+1) 8
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Inigo Montoya said:

Buffalo Bills Penalties By Year;

 

2014 Doug Marrone;   124 penalties,   31st in league       1031 yards,   28th in league   

2015 Rex Ryan;            143 penalties   32nd in league       1249 yards,   32nd in league 

2016 Rex Ryan;            111 penalties   23rd in league        995 yards,     21st in league

2017  McDermott;       98   penalties   10th in league         872 yards,    9th in league ---  PLAYOFFS

2018  McDermott;       116 penalties   27th in league         992 yards,    28th in league

 

We obviously took a big step backwards from 2017 to 2018 in penalties.  You can't blame our poor 2018 season on an increase in penalties alone, but it certainly was a significant part of it.  How many of Allen's big passes down field for a first down got called back due to penalties?  At times last season it seemed like every other big play Allen had got nullified by a penalty.  I don't think it was possible for the Bills to punt or kick off, or receive a punt or kick off last year without a penalty flag flying.   I think it's fair to blame part of the team's penalty regression on a young roster of less skillful players who got caught out of position and were forced to interfere or hold trying to make a play,  but some of it is also due to a lack of player discipline.  Below are the "discipline" penalty totals broken down by type. 

 

The totals below are for Roughing the Passer, Personal Fouls, Unnecessary Roughness, and Unsportsmanlike Conduct penalties on the Bills.  

 

2014    10

2015    12

2016    11

2017      6  ---  PLAYOFFS

2018      9

 

The totals below are for pre-snap infractions, Offside and False Start penalties on the Bills.

 

2014    26

2015    22

2016    12

2017    13 ---  PLAYOFFS

2018    26

 

We're not a good enough football team yet to be able to give away yards and downs to the opposition and not have it cost us in the win /  loss column.  If we can get back to playing disciplined football that could make the difference between getting into the playoffs this year or watching from the sidelines again.  Playing clean football is a trait of well coached, disciplined, and ultimately successful teams.  McDermott and his staff need to reverse this trend and get back to playing tough, physical, but smart football this season.

 

 

The 2018 penalty issue was simple - lack of talent. Guys who couldn't line up right had shoddy technique and panicked when beaten.

  • Like (+1) 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, macaroni said:

On the bright side …. the Bills haven't committed a penalty in months

 

I was thinking I missed something when I saw the thread title, let's at least wait until Rookie Mini-Camp is over to start talking game analysis.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

If you look at the overall totals, we were penalized double the amount on the road than we were at home. The Jacksonville game also has to be taken into account because that was just a brawl. The Minnesota, Houston, Jacksonville, and first Miami game accounted for 50 of our total 116 penalties. That's almost half of the total in a quarter of the season. We were one Charles Clay drop and a Josh Allen injury away from being 4-0 in those games as Nate "Petermanned" the game in Houston. With that being said I agree with Gunner's take as well. 

  • Thank you (+1) 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Good analysis and topic!  Undisciplined play is a huge indicator of wins/losses.  Another nuance to the game that they need to take care of to get back on the positive side of a season's record.

  • Thank you (+1) 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, Inigo Montoya said:

Buffalo Bills Penalties By Year;

 

2014 Doug Marrone;   124 penalties,   31st in league       1031 yards,   28th in league   

2015 Rex Ryan;            143 penalties   32nd in league       1249 yards,   32nd in league 

2016 Rex Ryan;            111 penalties   23rd in league        995 yards,     21st in league

2017  McDermott;       98   penalties   10th in league         872 yards,    9th in league ---  PLAYOFFS

2018  McDermott;       116 penalties   27th in league         992 yards,    28th in league

 

We obviously took a big step backwards from 2017 to 2018 in penalties.  You can't blame our poor 2018 season on an increase in penalties alone, but it certainly was a significant part of it.  How many of Allen's big passes down field for a first down got called back due to penalties?  At times last season it seemed like every other big play Allen had got nullified by a penalty.  I don't think it was possible for the Bills to punt or kick off, or receive a punt or kick off last year without a penalty flag flying.   I think it's fair to blame part of the team's penalty regression on a young roster of less skillful players who got caught out of position and were forced to interfere or hold trying to make a play,  but some of it is also due to a lack of player discipline.  Below are the "discipline" penalty totals broken down by type. 

 

The totals below are for Roughing the Passer, Personal Fouls, Unnecessary Roughness, and Unsportsmanlike Conduct penalties on the Bills.  

 

2014    10

2015    12

2016    11

2017      6  ---  PLAYOFFS

2018      9

 

The totals below are for pre-snap infractions, Offside and False Start penalties on the Bills.

 

2014    26

2015    22

2016    12

2017    13 ---  PLAYOFFS

2018    26

 

We're not a good enough football team yet to be able to give away yards and downs to the opposition and not have it cost us in the win-loss column.  If we can get back to playing disciplined football that could make the difference between getting into the playoffs this year or watching from the sidelines again.  Playing clean football is a trait of well coached, disciplined, and ultimately successful teams.  McDermott and his staff need to reverse this trend and get back to playing tough, physical, but smart football this season.

 

Might be a reason there were many changes to the coaching staff.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So what were the league averages those same years?  Were they up?  Maybe there were more penalties called last season overall, don't know.  Without knowing that part, no idea if this is really getting worse or not or is it a league trend, just caused by tighter/more calls.

 

Having said that I'll also agree with many other who blame it on lack of talent and also player churn, i.e. inexperience, tweaking the lineup, etc.  All the pre-snap penalties can be attributed to new QB and many new/different lineman. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, macaroni said:

On the bright side …. the Bills haven't committed a penalty in months

This right here is part of the problem!  Everything is a joke around here.  Always trying to have fun.  Be serious for once! Until we get serious, Pena lites will be our downfall

Link to comment
Share on other sites

32 minutes ago, ShadyBillsFan said:

I have the simple answer 

 

The Refs SUCK 

So many new rules / tweaks that even the Refs don't understand and it seems neither do the people in the booth or Referee Central (wherever that is) 

 

The same as I said earlier, have definitely seen some flags thrown many of time when they shouldn't have. In any event it's a mixture of a little bit of all of it though.

3 minutes ago, NewEra said:

This right here is part of the problem!  Everything is a joke around here.  Always trying to have fun.  Be serious for once! Until we get serious, Pena lites will be our downfall

Lol, we as fans need to get serious so the penalties will decrease. I see what you did there.......

  • Like (+1) 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, Boatdrinks said:

Lack of talent (2018 Bills)often leads to penalties. Especially on the O line, where guys hold when they are getting physically overwhelmed , or false start trying to get into their pass set a split second too fast. I’d expect better line play this year, and less of those types of penalties. I often hear folks say penalties are on the coaching, but ex players ( such as Steve Tasker) will say it’s on the players. I’d tend to agree with Tasker there. Players are out on the field, not the coach. 

My first thought as well so I wanted to take a deeper look.

 

Here is what I found.

 

http://www.nflpenalties.com/team/buffalo-bills?year=2018&view=position

 

Totals 116 992 52 64 13 8
Offensive Line 38 295 18 20 7 1
Defensive Back 19 278 7 12 3 2
Defensive Line 13 80 5 8 1 2
Tight End 11 89 4 7 0 0
Unknown/Unset 11 46 4 7 0 0
Wide Receiver 10 93 4 6 2 1
Linebacker 8 61 4 4 0 1
Quarterback 3 25 3 0 0 0
Runningback 3 25 3 0 0 1

 

I took the "Unknown" and split them between offense and defense and that give 70/116 penalties on the offense (38) on the offensive line alone.  Dawkins had the most per player at 11.

 

EDIT:

Here is the breakdown for the "unknown/Unnamed" players.

Unnamed   11 0.688 46 2.875 0 0 8 Illegal Formation (4), Defensive Too Many Men on Field (3), Delay of Game (3), Illegal Shift (1)

 

So of those penalties it looks like the breakdown is 8 on offense and 3 on defense which makes the total 73/116 on offense.  Although those penalties could be on ST so it might be better to leave them out other than the 3 listed as defense. 

Edited by The Wiz
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Dawkins, Mills, Teller, Miller and Ducasse were 5 of the top 7 penalized (31 total) with Dawkins the major culprit (11).

 

Let's see what the new OL new coach does to clean it up.  The top 5 OL for the Colts had 25 (somewhat better).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

×
×
  • Create New...