John Warrow’s High Praise For Beane & McDermott Regime

[Magox]

7 minutes ago, SoTier said:

 

Only in the minds of individuals who cannot tolerate the fact that not every Bills thinks McDermott and Beane are the next Levy and Polian.

 

Then I'm glad to hear that you are giving McD credit for coaching up the team that no one thought could come close to having a winning record to the playoffs back in 2017 and that it was mainly due to their efforts and not luck.

[K-9]

7 minutes ago, SoTier said:

Ungrateful punk?  I paid taxes in Erie County for 20 years, so my county taxes have funded the Bills for that period.  I've been a NYS resident for my entire adult life, so my state tax dollars have funded the Bills for about fifty years.  Wilson and Pegula are in the business of providing entertainment, and that entertainment product has pretty much sucked except for a few years in the late 1980s and early 1990s.   Now Pegula is coming around looking for more taxpayer $ for a new stadium. 

 

Well, for those taxpayer $, I think I should get more than 1 playoff season and 3 winning seasons in two decades. 

Ah, the mad as hell working class hero, “they owe me, damn it!” indignation.  A real classic. Have you had your Howard Beale moment yet? You’ll have to get in line with ScottLaw when demanding that apology letter from then Bills, though. 

[Rock-A-Bye Beasley]

Just now, Royale with Cheese said:

 

I think this is greatly exaggerated.  Most are saying the understand the moves and like them.  We know the results are on the field.

You are looking at it differently.  You believe what happened 19 years ago applies to today and choose to be pessimistic.  

 

Speaking for myself obviously, but my concerns are all based on failed personnel moves (mostly on offense) and game day management from this regime only. 

 

Whenever there’s a new coach the only clean way to evaluate them at first is game management because there are clear-cut right and wrong answers to those decisions. McDermott has failed repeatedly in this aspect. 

[Bill from NYC]

2 hours ago, oldmanfan said:

Maybe not a bad thing but there are certainly folks here that are negative about it

I think that being negative about it and not being overwhelmed by it need to be separated.

 

The team went 9-7. For the Bills this is good. They slid into the playoffs. For the Bills this is also good. They were promptly eliminated which is a shame, and caused some posters to temper their expectations, and it turned out that they were correct.

 

How much does all of this matter? NE is getting older, the Dolphins look as if they are tanking and the Jets are young. This Bills team has a good chance to compete. I hope that the coaches can facilitate exactly this.

[Gugny]

17 minutes ago, Bill from NYC said:

Wouldn't ignoring him make more sense than going to the mods?

 

These are people who are nice enough to help keep this place together. Why would you want to bother them with this kind of petty stuff?

 

I don't report people.  I'm normally on the other end of those transactions!  And I agree with you 100% re: the Mod Squad.

[Shaw66]

20 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

You make an interesting point about my looking back, and a valid one.  But the way you do so and I do so are completely different.   I do so to show that ultimately it matters not what happened 40 years ago; that one can still remain optimistic about the current set of circumstances.  You use it to somehow suggest that things will be the same, despite the fact that we have a completely new set of owners, front office personnel, coaches, players, and so on.  Your thought process in forming that opinion is illogical in assuming any of the previous years , save the last two, have any bearing on the current status of the team.

 

Also, your thought about you deserving more because of paying taxes in terms of team success seems misplaced.  You have gotten entertainment.  You have gotten to watch NFL football.  That is what your ticket price gets you.  No more, no less. 

 

I will try to refrain from personal insults.  I have been hard on you, and I'll try to refrain from anything personal and address your opinions specifically.  I hope you can do the same.

 

 

Good for you, fan, and I will say good for tier too.  What he says in the post you quoted is fair, reasoned and makes a lot of sense.  I think your criticism of that post is right on, too.

 

For me, I don't agree with much of what the negative posters are saying, and I think their arguments regularly change direction rather than respond to the points others make.  HOWEVER, their most fundamental point is correct.  It is hard to say that the Bill's were a good team in either of the last two years.  

 

I'm a firm believer that there usually is very little to no difference between 6-10 and 10-6, and certainly 7-9 and 9-7. So I dont.think tha Bills on field performance over past two seasons can be said to prove anything about McBeane yet.  The Bill's haven't won and they haven't looked like winners. 

 

I see lots of things I like, and I saw some things on the field last season I liked, so I conclude the Bills are heading in the right direction nicely.   But I can agree with the negative crowd that there's been enough lack of real progress on the field to reach a different conclusion.  

Edited June 17, 2019 by Shaw66

[Deranged Rhino]

23 minutes ago, Bill from NYC said:

Wouldn't ignoring him make more sense than going to the mods?

 

These are people who are nice enough to help keep this place together. Why would you want to bother them with this kind of petty stuff?

 

That's certainly the case 99.999% of the time here. Posting here for almost two decades (damn, time is a SOB), I've never reported anyone to the mods nor had any run ins with people that even made me think of doing so. I've only really ever butted heads with two people in all that time --both of whom were fine (if annoying) on the board but went way off the reservation when they try to bring the conversation to a PM. That can get annoying/sad.

 

Tuning them out is easy enough though... as is laughing at their idiocy when they're proven wrong (and then run from it as the one poster in question is famous for doing).

[K-9]

1 hour ago, JohnC said:

Bob Lanier went to Bennett High. Rumor had it that he wanted to go to Canisius College but couldn't get in. I'm not sure if that is a true story or not? Calvin Murphy was one of the most dynamic players I have seen play in the college ranks. He was small but he was strong and a ball of fire. He can twirl that baton. 

 

Canisius College was not very receptive toward Buffalo High School talent, usually for academic issues. Gene Roberson from Burgard was one of the first local high profile black players to go to Canisius. He did well until he became academically ineligible. Mel Montgomery in HS was a man playing against boys. He stupidly was used in a car promotion that hurt his career because it clearly violated college rules. 

 

https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=nba+calvin+murphy+twirl+drum+majorette&view=detail&mid=36BA0E24DF8E2A9BD63236BA0E24DF8E2A9BD632&FORM=VIRE

I think there might truth to that rumor about Lanier and Canisius. My dad, a CC grad and an involved alumnus, was tweaked that the Griffs couldn’t land Lanier and I remember him saying something about his grades not being good enough. Surprised there wasn’t a rumble between the Jesuits and Franciscans when he signed with Bona. 

 

But man, Little 3 b-ball was a show back then; a must see event on Saturday nights at the Aud. Some highly ranked national teams were on the schedule back then and I remember that packed, smokey arena buzzing with excitement. 

 

First time I ever saw Calvin Murphy, he was twirling his baton as part of a halftime show of a Bills game at the Rockpile. He was an amazing athlete who, despite his short stature, could dunk two handed from a standing jump under the basket. 

 

The Mel Montgomery story was sad. He went downhill fast. Too bad there weren’t the international options available today. He could have made a nice living playing ball overseas. 

32 minutes ago, SoTier said:

 

Only in the minds of individuals who cannot tolerate the fact that not every Bills thinks McDermott and Beane are the next Levy and Polian.

We better hope McDermott is better than Levy.

[JohnC]

1 hour ago, K-9 said:

 

We better hope McDermott is better than Levy.

The one thing that McDermott will never have better than Levy is a robust vocabulary. 

 

Levy was great in managing personalities. He delegated the offense and defense to his coaches. The SB game against the Giants was there to be had. Instead of allowing Kelly to throw the ball into an eight man coverage he should have forced the OC to run the ball with Thurman and Davis. Bill Belichick was the DC for the Giants. We had more talent and the Giants had better coaching.   

[K-9]

1 minute ago, JohnC said:

The one thing that McDermott will never have better than Levy is a robust vocabulary. 

 

Levy was great in managing personalities. He delegated the offense and defense to his coaches. The SB game against the Giants was there to be had. Instead of allowing Kelly to throw the ball into an eight man coverage he should have forced the OC to run the ball with Thurman and Davis. Bill Belichick was the DC for the Giants. We had more talent and the Giants had better coaching.   

Belichick begged us to run on him and I get the impression he knew Kelly's ego wouldn't allow it. That over-hyped defensive alignment, with the two DL with their hands on the ground and everybody else standing up, conceded the leverage battle to our OL right off the bat. Levy, Marchibroda, Kelly et al should have seen that and just let Hull and Co. tee off. Belichick would have gotten out of that after one series of watching his guys get their asses handed to them. 

 

But no, Marv didn't have the stones to demand of Marchibroda and Kelly to let Thurman take the rock and force the issue. Marv was too good of a delegator, sometimes to the team's detriment. 

 

Would have helped if our defense stopped the run in that game, too. But that's another sad story already beaten to death. 

[BADOLBILZ]

3 hours ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

No he wasn't and no it didn't.  You hated the Dareus move so you exaggerate points....TREMENDOUS LOL.

 

They re-did his deal so he wouldn't be cut.  If he had been playing as well as you said he would, he would have gotten a better re-worked deal than he has now.  

 

Go back and watch some of the Cover-1 stuff on Dareus from that time.    Tell me if Star can stack and shed like that.

 

Two weeks after Dareus was traded the defense went on the worst stretch of play in team history.

 

They were fortunate to limp to a 4-5 finish because of 3 wins against woeful Dolphins and Colts teams.........and the Colts and second Phins game were much too close considering Brissett and Fales were the opposing QB's.

 

And not only was Dareus good in Buffalo but he went to Jax in 2017 and they instantly went from the bottom of the league in run defense to near the top.

 

It was a very suspect decision to trade him and only exacerbated by replacing him with a ridiculous contract for Star.

 

 But if they had traded Dareus in the preseason they surely miss the playoffs.........no question........so I guess that's a plus for McBeane.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

1 hour ago, Deranged Rhino said:

 

That's certainly the case 99.999% of the time here. Posting here for almost two decades (damn, time is a SOB), I've never reported anyone to the mods nor had any run ins with people that even made me think of doing so. I've only really ever butted heads with two people in all that time --both of whom were fine (if annoying) on the board but went way off the reservation when they try to bring the conversation to a PM. That can get annoying/sad.

 

Tuning them out is easy enough though... as is laughing at their idiocy when they're proven wrong (and then run from it as the one poster in question is famous for doing).

 

Gary says hello ?

[oldmanfan]

1 hour ago, Bill from NYC said:

I think that being negative about it and not being overwhelmed by it need to be separated.

 

The team went 9-7. For the Bills this is good. They slid into the playoffs. For the Bills this is also good. They were promptly eliminated which is a shame, and caused some posters to temper their expectations, and it turned out that they were correct.

 

How much does all of this matter? NE is getting older, the Dolphins look as if they are tanking and the Jets are young. This Bills team has a good chance to compete. I hope that the coaches can facilitate exactly this.

I agree.  We should look towards the future.

[K-9]

6 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

They've been among the worst franchises in sports the past two decades.

 

What do I need an apology for?  Jusy try not to get too upset when I laugh and criticize at their expense. Eventually they'll figure it out(I think?) but I'll have a good laugh at how bad they've been and continue to enjoy the games in the "process."?

Among the worst isn't as bad as the worst, which we were over that 25 year period I described previously. 

 

Why don't I get the impression you're actually laughing, though? You seem miserable when it comes to anything Bills related. 

[C.Biscuit97]

9 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

They've been among the worst franchises in sports the past two decades.

 

What do I need an apology for?  Jusy try not to get too upset when I laugh and criticize at their expense. Eventually they'll figure it out(I think?) but I'll have a good laugh at how bad they've been and continue to enjoy the games in the "process."?

In fairness, we’ve been slightly below average for 20 years.  That’s kinda the problem.  We never hit rock bottom.  

 

[Shaw66]

19 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

Go back and watch some of the Cover-1 stuff on Dareus from that time.    Tell me if Star can stack and shed like that.

 

Two weeks after Dareus was traded the defense went on the worst stretch of play in team history.

 

They were fortunate to limp to a 4-5 finish because of 3 wins against woeful Dolphins and Colts teams.........and the Colts and second Phins game were much too close considering Brissett and Fales were the opposing QB's.

 

And not only was Dareus good in Buffalo but he went to Jax in 2017 and they instantly went from the bottom of the league in run defense to near the top.

 

It was a very suspect decision to trade him and only exacerbated by replacing him with a ridiculous contract for Star.

 

 But if they had traded Dareus in the preseason they surely miss the playoffs.........no question........so I guess that's a plus for McBeane.

In his book GM, Ernie Accorsi says you can have a winning team with one prima donna, it's very hard with two and impossible with three.  McDermott wants none, and its hard to argue with that.  It makes no difference how talented Dareus is; he didn't have the attitude to play for McDermott's Bills.  

  

[K-9]

2 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

In fairness, we’ve been slightly below average for 20 years.  That’s kinda the problem.  We never hit rock bottom.  

 

There's a lot to that. Leads to perpetual mediocrity at best. 

[ColoradoBills]

Even though these guys were not very "positive" they were a lovable bunch!

 

 

[Royale with Cheese]

35 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

Go back and watch some of the Cover-1 stuff on Dareus from that time.    Tell me if Star can stack and shed like that.

 

Two weeks after Dareus was traded the defense went on the worst stretch of play in team history.

 

They were fortunate to limp to a 4-5 finish because of 3 wins against woeful Dolphins and Colts teams.........and the Colts and second Phins game were much too close considering Brissett and Fales were the opposing QB's.

 

And not only was Dareus good in Buffalo but he went to Jax in 2017 and they instantly went from the bottom of the league in run defense to near the top.

 

It was a very suspect decision to trade him and only exacerbated by replacing him with a ridiculous contract for Star.

 

 But if they had traded Dareus in the preseason they surely miss the playoffs.........no question........so I guess that's a plus for McBeane.

 

Cover 1 stuff typically shows about 10-20 plays total?  That's a small fraction of all his plays and these ones were specifically picked by the writer/evaluator.

 

What I do know is that in 2017, Dareus lost snaps....even though we were very thin at DT.

 

I see that Dareus gets credit for helping their run defense in 2017 but last they finished I think 19th in 2018....I'm assuming not Dareus's fault? 

 

Actions speak louder than words Baldo.  If Star loses snaps, then I'll start believe you...especially since it's a healthy scratch.  But right now, it looks like he's our starter opposite Oliver and nothing is indicating that is going to change. 

McDermott and Beane feel Star's contract is worth it....

[HappyDays]

On 6/16/2019 at 8:47 AM, SoTier said:

McDermott and Beane just might not walk on water

On 6/16/2019 at 8:47 AM, SoTier said:

McDermott/Beane cheerleaders

2 hours ago, SoTier said:

you can worship McDermott for it if you want.

 

2 hours ago, SoTier said:

I'm not anointing McDermott anything special

 

2 hours ago, SoTier said:

not every Bills thinks McDermott and Beane are the next Levy and Polian.

 

There has to be a name for this particular complex, where you constantly exaggerate what other people are saying to make yourself look superior.