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Tipster19

Whaley is an idiot.

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27 minutes ago, Tipster19 said:

I’m not even going to bemoan that he passed on Mahomes but it never ceases to amaze when I hear him say publicly that he didn’t know. It’s almost comical.

 

http://www.espn.com/nfl/draft2019/story/_/id/26561055/drafting-patrick-mahomes-how-chiefs-outmaneuvered-nfl?platform=amp

 

The real idiot is the people that think Whaley was calling any shots in this Draft. 

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Whaley worked on that trade with Dorsey for weeks.

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Read EXACTLY what I said. Whaley publicly saying that he didn’t or doesn’t know should be embarrassing for him. He is SUPPOSE to know and if he doesn’t then at least shut your mouth about it, don’t confess that you didn’t know!

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1 minute ago, Tipster19 said:

Read EXACTLY what I said. Whaley publicly saying that he didn’t or doesn’t know should be embarrassing for him. He is SUPPOSE to know and if he doesn’t then at least shut your mouth about it, don’t confess that you didn’t know!

Wow.

 

A) He's out of the NFL.

 

B) He's acknowledging something he knows doesn't paint him in a flattering light WITHOUT throwing McDermott under the bus.(It's HIGHLY likely that he was not even given the opportunity to draft a QB)

 

C) Strange flex.

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By mentioning that he passed on Mahomes is in fact bemoaning that he passed on Mahomes. 

 

 

Again. 

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32 minutes ago, Happy Gilmore said:

McD was calling the shots that draft, not Whaley.  Been discussed many times before.

 

The fact it was discussed doesn't make it true.  All the scouts worked for Whaley.   The entire scouting process was under Whaley's control. 

 

Why would McD make the actual picks?  The supposition defies logic.  

 

 

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I think a lot of teams were skeptical about QB's coming out of the Big 12---the spread offenses, high scoring games, less defenses, & some previous Big 12 QB's not panning out. I think the majority of this board wanted Mahomes as did I----but I do like Josh.

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I can’t believe how much hate Whaley gets on here sometimes. How can you not respect a guy who swings for the fences? The only thing he didn’t do, and what cost him his job was land a quarterback. If he got anywhere near close to a top 15 quarterback he’d still be here and this team would of been riding the playoffs. We can point out all the silly moves, like Bryce brown from philly or whatever his name was.. But Whaley made some absolutely amazing moves here and some questionable ones too, all in all that defense under Schwartz was lethal and one of my favorite seasons to watch ever of buffalo football. That front 4 was the nastiest I have ever seen on a field. Every play they hit the quarterback it was lovely. It was time to move on so I didn’t have a problem with the firing but I would of preferred fans to show him a little more respect, was a complete sh** show for that guy here. From marrone bailing, to ortons retirement, to the stupid Rex show and a team being sold with uncertain future and then the new owners. It was a job doomed to fail. 

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Posted (edited)
44 minutes ago, Gugny said:

An idiot who built a top 5 NFL defense, only to be torn down by Kim Pegula hiring Rex Ryan.

 

And everyone on earth was surprised that the Chiefs traded up to get Mahomes.  Don't act like it was a given.  Far from it.

 

 

 

The top ten defense was built with all but two players brought in under Buddy Nix. And the two acquired by Nix were neither standouts. Preston Brown and someone else. Lorax, maybe? I forget, but that's not the heart of that defense.

 

Agreed on Mahomes.

Edited by Thurman#1

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Posted (edited)

I'm always confused by the discussion of the 2017 offseason and draft. When Whaley was still with the Bills, they brought in Hyde, Poyer and Hauschka. They drafted White, Milano, Jones and Dawkins. Seemed like a pretty good offseason to me, but everyone is trying to bash Whaley for whatever his part in it was. Strange.

Edited by vincec
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19 minutes ago, QCity said:

Whaley worked on that trade with Dorsey for weeks.

 

 

Being on the phone isn't being in charge. I can assure you of that from many times when my boss had me negotiate things over the phone after telling me what he wanted. I wasn't the one with the power or the decision maker.

 

McDermott was in charge.

 

IMO, it's far too strong to say that Whaley is an idiot. He's not. But he wasn't as good as either McDermott or Beane. He didn't have an overarching plan. And he left us screwed on the salary cap when we were a mediocre team. Our cap looked like a team at the end of a Super Bowl window and we didn't have the wins to make that kind of a fiscal problem necessary. And he didn't draft very well, though his pro personnel decisions were good.

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7 minutes ago, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

 

The top ten defense was built with all but two players brought in under Buddy Nix. And the two acquired by Nix were neither standouts. Preston Brown and someone else. Lorax, maybe? I forget, but that's not the heart of that defense.

 

Agreed on Mahomes.

 

Whaley was there for those drafts and he was part of them.  His scouting history supports that.  I'll never say Whaley was a "great" GM.  But he did a good job in Buffalo during a time where there was absent ownership, at best; and he was ridiculously and disrespectfully undermined by new owners who had no effing clue what they were doing.  The guy was set up to fail from beginning to end, in my opinion.

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Posted (edited)
49 minutes ago, Gugny said:

An idiot who built a top 5 NFL defense, only to be torn down by Kim Pegula hiring Rex Ryan.

 

And everyone on earth was surprised that the Chiefs traded up to get Mahomes.  Don't act like it was a given.  Far from it.

Look at his number 1draft picks during his time here....

 

EJ Manuel

Sammy Watkins

Sammy Watkins (yes twice cause he wasted 2 number one picks on the worthless POS in a draft deeeeeeep at WR)

Shaq Lawson

 

Stellar number 1 picks there....

 

Edited by Azucho98

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Posted (edited)
14 minutes ago, Rc2catch said:

I can’t believe how much hate Whaley gets on here sometimes. How can you not respect a guy who swings for the fences? The only thing he didn’t do, and what cost him his job was land a quarterback. If he got anywhere near close to a top 15 quarterback he’d still be here and this team would of been riding the playoffs. We can point out all the silly moves, like Bryce brown from philly or whatever his name was.. But Whaley made some absolutely amazing moves here and some questionable ones too, all in all that defense under Schwartz was lethal and one of my favorite seasons to watch ever of buffalo football. That front 4 was the nastiest I have ever seen on a field. Every play they hit the quarterback it was lovely. It was time to move on so I didn’t have a problem with the firing but I would of preferred fans to show him a little more respect, was a complete sh** show for that guy here. From marrone bailing, to ortons retirement, to the stupid Rex show and a team being sold with uncertain future and then the new owners. It was a job doomed to fail. 

 

 

"How can you not respect a guy who swings for the fences?"

 

Um, with great ease? With very little effort and for obvious reasons? I could come up with more.

 

Swinging for the fences and striking out isn't something a decision-maker should be cheered for. A home run hitter who leads the league in HRs and strikeouts? Maybe. But an executive who leaves the team with a career record under .500? Not hardly. The Watkins trade was a swing for the fences, but it looked awful from minute one.

 

For execs, swinging for the fences means squat. Building an excellent team is what you should be judged on. He didn't do that.

 

And again, that front four you're going on about were all Nix gets.

Edited by Thurman#1

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....this whole thing was discussed alot last year....

 

Here is a reminder of how that all went down.

 

1.  Whaley was going to be fired, and McDermott had only been on the job for a month.  McD was running the draft, BUT, he hadn't had time to evaluate the QB's himself AND he wasn't going to draft one until the NEW GM was in place so they could scout and discuss together.  Whaley was retained through draft day to provide scouting reports etc and run the nuts and bolts..but this was McD's draft.  ...I can't emphasize enough that Whaley was on the way out..and MCD wasn't taking a QB that he hadn't evaluated to stake his reputation on, and his job on....and wasn't about to do that with with a GM on his way out.

 

2.  It is a FACT that the Saints were going to draft Mahomes at 11 if he was there.  Sean Payton has said as much...and on draft day itself, Jordan Speith, the professional golfer, who was in attendance in the Saints war room, tweeted that Mahomes was going to be the pick.

 

3.  was never really confirmed, but it was rumored that Whaley wanted to in fact draft Mahomes...but again, he was on the way out and it wasn't his call....don't even know for sure if this is true.  

 

4.  was rumored that Terry Pegula liked Mahomes...but deffered to his new coach....Pegula, more than anyone is to blame IF you into assigning blame for missing on Mahomes...The front office dynamic created by Pegula prior to the 2017 NFL Draft...was NEVER going to produce a QB as a draft pick.  See point 1 again for why.  

 

The facts alone are enough to absolve Whaley of blame for missing on Mahomes......and it technically falls on McD because he was running the draft, but you can't blame him for passing at QB when he'd only been on the job a month...is a defensive minded coach...and wasn't comfortable taking a QB he hadn't evaluated, etc.  The trade made alot of sense to a new guy, who didn't have anywhere enough information available to him to draft a QB....to go ahead and move down, and get that extra 1st and 3rd for him and the next GM to work with.  It's pretty clear that if anyone is to blame, it's Pegula.  His process of firing/hiring put the team at a disadvantage on draft day.  

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1 minute ago, Gugny said:

 

Whaley was there for those drafts and he was part of them.  His scouting history supports that.  I'll never say Whaley was a "great" GM.  But he did a good job in Buffalo during a time where there was absent ownership, at best; and he was ridiculously and disrespectfully undermined by new owners who had no effing clue what they were doing.  The guy was set up to fail from beginning to end, in my opinion.

 

 

You're right, he was a part of those drafts. So were a lot of scouts. 

 

Whaley gets the credit for helping.

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48 minutes ago, brianthomas said:

If Allen goes on to have a productive career, this trade with the Chiefs won't mean as much.

But if Mahomes goes on to be the next Brady & Allen somehow busts (even though i highly doubt he will), this coulda woulda shoulda passing on Mahomes will go down as another chapter in the big book of Bills mistakes imo. Regardless of who was making the draft decisions that day.

If Trubiski busts and Mahomes ends up the next Brady, the Bears will look like much bigger fools. 

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Posted (edited)

I don't blame whaley for not getting mahomes. I blame McDermott. 

 

My thought has always been this : McDermott has always credited Andy Reid as a mentor and someone he learned alot from saying how he came from the Andy Reid coaching tree. So having said that, when cheifs called and said they wanted the bills pick for mahomes, a light should've went off in McDermott's head. Like hey Andy Reid wants this guy, maybe he's that good that they'd give up a first round pick for him. 

Edited by Steptide
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25 minutes ago, hondo in seattle said:

 

The fact it was discussed doesn't make it true.  All the scouts worked for Whaley.   The entire scouting process was under Whaley's control. 

 

Why would McD make the actual picks?  The supposition defies logic.  

 

 

 

Defies logic?  Whaley and his scouts were fired on Monday after the draft.  Whaley set the board based off his scout's player data.  McD made the picks; surprised there is any doubt about this...still.

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Posted (edited)

Well to be fair I don't think Mahomes would of been as good if he landed else where. Literally got the picture perfect sceneio. Great coaching staff, great play makers, playoff team, and he got to sit behind a vet QB for a year. Doesn't get any more ideal then that. Don't get me wrong he still would have been a really good QB but don't think he would be anywhere near how this season turned out 

 

Also let's not forget that without that trade our team would be missing a lot of key players.

 

We wouldn't have had Tre White

 

Wouldn't have been able to trade up for Dion Dawkins

 

Wouldn't have been able to trade up for Josh Allen or Tremain Edmunds

 

Those are corner stone pieces that we would be missing. No franchise LT, no #1 CB, and no leader at MLB. All just to be change Mahomes for Allen at QB.

 

Question is would you trade Dawkins, Allen, White, and Edmunds for Mahomes. That's a no for me. I see it as a win win. Both teams had a good outcome from the trade and that's what you like to aee

Edited by Kmart128

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It is hard to forget the Whaley era when the NFL Network rebroadcasts recent drafts, including the 2014 draft where we traded up to the fourth pick in the first round to select Sammy Watkins, giving up our first round pick in 2015.  We could have selected Mack or Mike Evans with that pick, or stayed at our original spot and selected Beckhan or Donald.  In the second round, Whaley selected Cyrus Kouandijo.  Still painful.

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