CSBill Posted February 2, 2019 Share Posted February 2, 2019 20 hours ago, YoloinOhio said: I would like to pick up one in FA but I think it’s hard to find really good ones there. It’s getting to the point where really good OL are so valuable they don’t make it to FA. I think you need to build your line through the draft if you want it to be elite. Totally agree, do what you can in Free Agency, but those counting on that to build the line are buying fools gold--smart teams just do not let the good ones go. And, just about every team in the NFL would like to upgrade their o-line, it's a seller's market for average homes. Thus, build the o-line through the draft! I have said it before and I'll repeat it, I would love to see 2 of our 3 picks in rounds 1 & 2 be top quality O-lineman, any position. Ideally, I would love to get a starting Tackle and Center out of this draft. If we can and add those two positions to the mix of the young guys we already have, even without any Free Agents, we are in really good shape for a long time. Of course, we are always looking to upgrade when possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
machine gun kelly Posted February 2, 2019 Share Posted February 2, 2019 1 hour ago, CSBill said: Totally agree, do what you can in Free Agency, but those counting on that to build the line are buying fools gold--smart teams just do not let the good ones go. And, just about every team in the NFL would like to upgrade their o-line, it's a seller's market for average homes. Thus, build the o-line through the draft! I have said it before and I'll repeat it, I would love to see 2 of our 3 picks in rounds 1 & 2 be top quality O-lineman, any position. Ideally, I would love to get a starting Tackle and Center out of this draft. If we can and add those two positions to the mix of the young guys we already have, even without any Free Agents, we are in really good shape for a long time. Of course, we are always looking to upgrade when possible. Good call and agreed. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted February 2, 2019 Share Posted February 2, 2019 2 hours ago, CSBill said: Totally agree, do what you can in Free Agency, but those counting on that to build the line are buying fools gold--smart teams just do not let the good ones go. And, just about every team in the NFL would like to upgrade their o-line, it's a seller's market for average homes. Thus, build the o-line through the draft! I have said it before and I'll repeat it, I would love to see 2 of our 3 picks in rounds 1 & 2 be top quality O-lineman, any position. Ideally, I would love to get a starting Tackle and Center out of this draft. If we can and add those two positions to the mix of the young guys we already have, even without any Free Agents, we are in really good shape for a long time. Of course, we are always looking to upgrade when possible. A smart team would be signing AND drafting starting quality OLmen. Can't afford to count on either to meet expectations 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted February 2, 2019 Author Share Posted February 2, 2019 It might be slim pickings in FA, but I’d be interested in maybe flipping a 4th to a team who is rebuilding, changing scheme/coaching, and/or needs to shed cap for a decent OL who is not on the market. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldTimer1960 Posted February 2, 2019 Share Posted February 2, 2019 On February 1, 2019 at 12:38 PM, thebandit27 said: I'd watch for Ben Garland of Atlanta to be a player that the Bills may target. He's going to be 31 at the start of the 2019 season, but he's got very little mileage on him due to a combination of military service, positional switches, and practice squad time. He's a process guy for sure. If Beane misses out on the top-tier guards like Saffold/Spain, Garland could certainly be an option. Bandit, what are you seeing in Garland? I've not seen him play, but looking him up, it looks like he has only started 7 games in his NFL career. Are you seeing him as a potential starting OG? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CookieG Posted February 2, 2019 Share Posted February 2, 2019 14 hours ago, Seoul_panther said: I agree with you. But if Beane truly believes in BPA as he says he does, can he resist taking a D player? I just don’t think OL can be BPA at 9- I’m not a Jonah Williams fan. You could argue that WR isn’t BPA either. Can he resist? IDK..but he can only play out this silly rebuild for so long. another bottom 5 offense might not cut it with the Pegula's in year three, and it shouldn't. BPA matters more in a few instances. First, where your team is already built. Second, where you have so many holes that it really doesn't matter where you start. But when one side of the ball is pretty good and the other is devoid of talent, and you continue to neglect that side because you're taking what you believe is the "BPA" in your mind, your career as a GM isn't going to be long...especially when you aren't winning. That doesn't mean you take a dud at an area at need. But "reaching" is a relative term. Taking an OL who might be 15th on your board at no. 9 isn't really a "reach". *****...Bill Walsh didn't even like scouts to talk about the round a player should be drafted. His canned response was, "if he works out, no one remembers the round he was chosen." He really wanted to know, how does this guy help our team? "BPA" is a half-subjective term in and of itself. Example. Take a Dalton Risner vs. Montez Sweat comparison. When they matched up twice this year...Sweat one 2-3 of the plays. Risner won the rest. Sweat might be able to get in the backfield 3-4 times a game. Risner might keep his guy out of the backfield on all but 2-3 plays per game. Who's the BPA? You can use the canned phrases like "you don't draft a RT at 9" or "you always need a pass rush" But I'll take the guy that wins 90% of the matchups. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HappyDays Posted February 2, 2019 Share Posted February 2, 2019 On 2/1/2019 at 10:51 AM, thebandit27 said: I'm not a big trade-down guy, especially when you're in the top 10 in a draft that is loaded with top-5 type talent at a position as critical as pass rusher (be it interior or EDGE). I'm of the opinion that the team has enough picks, and that what they really need is to stock the roster elite prospects whenever possible. I would always happily trade down. Elite prospects don't always work out. The more chances you give yourself the better. I consider our biggest needs OL, WR, and TE. The sweet spot of those positions in this draft is between picks 15 and 50. Anything we can do to get extra picks in that sweet spot is a better opportunity to fill needs. I'd much rather take two top 40 offensive prospects than one top 10 defensive line prospect. JMO. If we do stay at 9 I agree the BPA will almost certainly be defense. The last thing I want to see is any more trade ups. Just draft more players. We have too many needs to take chances like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seoulofstone Posted February 2, 2019 Share Posted February 2, 2019 1 hour ago, CookieG said: Can he resist? IDK..but he can only play out this silly rebuild for so long. another bottom 5 offense might not cut it with the Pegula's in year three, and it shouldn't. BPA matters more in a few instances. First, where your team is already built. Second, where you have so many holes that it really doesn't matter where you start. But when one side of the ball is pretty good and the other is devoid of talent, and you continue to neglect that side because you're taking what you believe is the "BPA" in your mind, your career as a GM isn't going to be long...especially when you aren't winning. That doesn't mean you take a dud at an area at need. But "reaching" is a relative term. Taking an OL who might be 15th on your board at no. 9 isn't really a "reach". *****...Bill Walsh didn't even like scouts to talk about the round a player should be drafted. His canned response was, "if he works out, no one remembers the round he was chosen." He really wanted to know, how does this guy help our team? "BPA" is a half-subjective term in and of itself. Example. Take a Dalton Risner vs. Montez Sweat comparison. When they matched up twice this year...Sweat one 2-3 of the plays. Risner won the rest. Sweat might be able to get in the backfield 3-4 times a game. Risner might keep his guy out of the backfield on all but 2-3 plays per game. Who's the BPA? You can use the canned phrases like "you don't draft a RT at 9" or "you always need a pass rush" But I'll take the guy that wins 90% of the matchups. I may agree with you. It will be interesting. I think Risner (OT) Lindstrom (G) and Jenkins (C) would be a great trio to take with the first 3 picks. And yes certainly if the team has a mediocre season Beane will likely get heavily criticized no matter who he picked. Time will tell. My prediction? DE or DT unless he trades back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsShredder83 Posted February 2, 2019 Share Posted February 2, 2019 Ive been looking at mock drafts my entire adulthood. First one i really got into was Dareus' draft class. When did EDGE become such a popular word? Lol i know what it is, but ive never seen it used, and its like every 4th word all the sudden. Everybody just jumped on board and acted like that name has been used for 10years without batting an eye. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuvian Posted February 3, 2019 Share Posted February 3, 2019 If I have to choose between a great pass rusher and a great OT I go pass rusher Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njbuff Posted February 3, 2019 Share Posted February 3, 2019 13 minutes ago, stuvian said: If I have to choose between a great pass rusher and a great OT I go pass rusher I don’t know, man. A great OT to protect Allen would be worth it’s weight in gold. I still think Dawkins can develop into a very good LT. I fully understand your argument though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuvian Posted February 3, 2019 Share Posted February 3, 2019 Just now, njbuff said: I don’t know, man. A great OT to protect Allen would be worth it’s weight in gold. I still think Dawkins can develop into a very good LT. I fully understand your argument though. I'm thinking more about Lorax retiring. It looks like a good OT will be available in later rounds 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2020 Our Year For Sure Posted February 3, 2019 Share Posted February 3, 2019 5 hours ago, BillsShredder83 said: Ive been looking at mock drafts my entire adulthood. First one i really got into was Dareus' draft class. When did EDGE become such a popular word? Lol i know what it is, but ive never seen it used, and its like every 4th word all the sudden. Everybody just jumped on board and acted like that name has been used for 10years without batting an eye. I think we all accepted it so easily because it makes a lot more sense than the old way. They used to list a guy like Von Miller as a Linebacker or OLB, and if you weren't familiar with the kid you had no idea if that meant edge rusher (high value) or off-ball linebacker (low value). Grouping all the pass rushers together, whether we expect them to be a DE or an OLB, and just calling them EDGE is much more efficient imo. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted February 3, 2019 Share Posted February 3, 2019 5 hours ago, 2018 Our Year For Sure said: I think we all accepted it so easily because it makes a lot more sense than the old way. They used to list a guy like Von Miller as a Linebacker or OLB, and if you weren't familiar with the kid you had no idea if that meant edge rusher (high value) or off-ball linebacker (low value). Grouping all the pass rushers together, whether we expect them to be a DE or an OLB, and just calling them EDGE is much more efficient imo. Also reflects that NFL defenses are much more hybrid than they used to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan1988 Posted February 3, 2019 Share Posted February 3, 2019 On 2/1/2019 at 8:18 PM, Bill Murray said: Agree w you, but i think its not about the firepower, its about the availability. I dont want to do another Charles Clay, Langston Walker, or Dockery FA contract throwing $ at our need without it being a good player.... If someone like Khalil Mack were out there again, with our firepower i would do that, but i dont think the pieces will all be there for the taking. J Clowney is due to become a FA possibly (but prob wont), would you throw a ton of $ at him and then go OL & WR in the draft completing the strategy you are suggesting? No Clowney he's not explosive enough to warrant the type of money he will get. I'd much rather use the money on Grady Jarrett and Donte Fowler. Both players are still young Jarrett is 26 & Fowler 24. These 2 guys will help our dline immensely. Use free agency and mid rds of draft to build the Oline add 3-5 players this off-season . Preferably 3 players in free agency and 2 via draft. The 3 I would target via free agency LT Trent Brown RT D Williams C Mitch Morse Adding these 3 players will allow us to move Dawkins to LG where he has potential to be a pro bowl player . 2019 OLINE LT Brown LG Dawkins C Morse RG Teller RT Williams This line can be a force for yrs to come . I know it will cost some serious money to get these guys to come to Buffalo but even if we have to overpay it will be worth the money. We have the cap space so use it . The Draft In the draft we go hunting for the skill position players . Try to trade bk with Washington and aquire a extra 2nd rd pk. #15 - TE -TJ Hockenson #40 - Wr- Marquis Brown #46- LB- Devin Bush #75- Wr - Andy Isabella 4th Rd- RB Darrell Henderson 2nd 4th RB Elijah Holyfield With this draft our offense can develop into a power house in a few yrs. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
machine gun kelly Posted February 3, 2019 Share Posted February 3, 2019 What confuses me is the repeated talk about a pass rusher. My reasoning is simple. Offense 30th Rushing 9th Pass 31 Defense 2nd Rushing 16th (We we’re hovering between 9th and 10th until the Cheats gashed us for I think 273 yards) Pass 1st We have Murphy and Lawson on one side and 55 on the other. Now we are desperate for an OL, WR, and TE’s. Maybe in a later round more depth with Rushers or an eventual replacement for Alexander, and a CB. I know a lot will be handled in free agency, but not everything. Excellent Tackles, and even interior lineman unless a cap casualty, and Tackles are more expensive then interior lineman. I agree Dawkins will improve, but we made a terrible mistake in trying to make Richie take a pay cut when he was blowing holes for Shady. Look at between Wood, RI, how many runs came off Center. I know he went crazy, but he seems to do that when he doesn’t have anything to do. Anyway, that is my two cents. I know pass rushers are awesome, but we have far more important needs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCal Deek Posted February 3, 2019 Share Posted February 3, 2019 This team better build an Offensive Line! Much of it comes down to timing. They have their young quarterback and now they need to draft a young line that’ll all come of age along with him. If they do, they’ll be set for the next four years. Then use free agency to plug and play guys on defense. Just my two cents. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted February 3, 2019 Share Posted February 3, 2019 19 hours ago, OldTimer1960 said: Bandit, what are you seeing in Garland? I've not seen him play, but looking him up, it looks like he has only started 7 games in his NFL career. Are you seeing him as a potential starting OG? He looked solid in his few starts for Atlanta last year, and my hope would be that he'd be a Brandon Moore type late bloomer at guard. So yeah, I guess I expect a team to sign him as a lower-tier starter, but I think that he's a great fit for McDermott and has untapped upside Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted February 3, 2019 Share Posted February 3, 2019 2 hours ago, thebandit27 said: He looked solid in his few starts for Atlanta last year, and my hope would be that he'd be a Brandon Moore type late bloomer at guard. So yeah, I guess I expect a team to sign him as a lower-tier starter, but I think that he's a great fit for McDermott and has untapped upside I think he will get signed to starter money somewhere. He would be an upgrade on what he have but he isn't the sort of guy who turns the line around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted February 3, 2019 Share Posted February 3, 2019 3 hours ago, machine gun kelly said: What confuses me is the repeated talk about a pass rusher. My reasoning is simple. Offense 30th Rushing 9th Pass 31 Defense 2nd Rushing 16th (We we’re hovering between 9th and 10th until the Cheats gashed us for I think 273 yards) Pass 1st We have Murphy and Lawson on one side and 55 on the other. Now we are desperate for an OL, WR, and TE’s. Maybe in a later round more depth with Rushers or an eventual replacement for Alexander, and a CB. I know a lot will be handled in free agency, but not everything. Excellent Tackles, and even interior lineman unless a cap casualty, and Tackles are more expensive then interior lineman. I agree Dawkins will improve, but we made a terrible mistake in trying to make Richie take a pay cut when he was blowing holes for Shady. Look at between Wood, RI, how many runs came off Center. I know he went crazy, but he seems to do that when he doesn’t have anything to do. Anyway, that is my two cents. I know pass rushers are awesome, but we have far more important needs. The best offense is a good defense? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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