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Re-purposing Shady McCoy in the passing offense


YoloinOhio

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1 hour ago, Florida Bills Fanatic said:

I think you are right on point.  McCoy danced in holes that were closing fast due to the terrible line play.  The routes that he was asked to run were not downfield and didn't use his speed advantage over the linebackers that were covering him.  When you look at the way that the Cheatriots use James White, it is completely different from the use of McCoy.  White runs a lot of wheel routes, option routes underneath, and an occasional deep route up the seam against zones.  White is a huge part of their offence.  I believe McCoy is a faster and more illusive back than White.  McCoy has been a good receiver throughout his career. He isn't going to be the guy to pound it between the tackles 20 times a game but he can still be a big part of an effective backfield.  2019 should be the year that McCoy is sharing reps with his replacement.

 

1 hour ago, Logic said:


YES!

When I look at how the Patriots use James White...and Rex Burkhead, and how the used to use Dion Lewis and Kevin Faulk, etc, etc, etc...it drives me absolutely NUTS that the Bills don't use Shady the same way in the passing game. He is more talented than ALL of the above running backs. Splitting him out into the slot or out wide against a linebacker or safety and sending him on a slant or drag route should be easy money every time. Utilizing him as a receiver out of the backfield on wheel routes and option routes - same thing. Easy money. Why don't the Bills do this? Everyone knows the Pats have bad receivers and that their running backs will be getting the ball in the passing game, yet they're STILL able to use them successfully, even with the defense knowing its coming. Again, why can't the currently receiver-deficient Bills do this? It's just maddening.

 

Absolutely!  I've been saying the same thing since training camp.  Linebackers are dead meat vs. McCoy.  It baffles me that in what everyone calls a "copy cat league" more teams don't copy New England more...

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2 hours ago, CaptnCoke11 said:

I would just release him and not blow 9 million on the cap for an old third down back.  

Another thing with him i can see happening.. The way his career is heading with dwindling production I can see him starting to cause problems in the locker room.  He already got benched for the start of a game for somethingbhe did.  

 

1/3 of that cap hit occurs in any case. 

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15 minutes ago, Buddy Hix said:

RBs fall off a cliff production wise at his age. So it’s not “forgetting how to play”, but it’s the same result.

Didn’t Shady get benched last season? Doesn’t jive with the “great in the locker room” narrative.

Yes, he got benched for one play for being late for the team bus.  Hardly makes him a locker room cancer.  Foster credited Shady for helping him get his head on straight after he was cut and then signed to the practuce squad.  That is a much better measure of his locker room value IMO.  

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43 minutes ago, Logic said:


I'd love to know how getting hit immediately upon receiving the hand-off indicates how his skills/production "fell off a cliff". Care to elaborate?

 

Shady wasn’t hit immediately at the hand-off in most cases, he refused to hit the hole (however small or fleeting), IMO.

 

http://www.espn.com/blog/nflnation/post/_/id/123542/inside-slant-running-back-cliff-after-age-27

 

Here’s an older article I found that presents the data. The RB age cliff has been discussed for years in fantasy football, there are lots of articles on it.

31 minutes ago, FLFan said:

Yes, he got benched for one play for being late for the team bus.  Hardly makes him a locker room cancer.  Foster credited Shady for helping him get his head on straight after he was cut and then signed to the practuce squad.  That is a much better measure of his locker room value IMO.  

I was only aware of an infraction, didn’t know what it was for. Either way, I don’t recommend paying a guy top dollar for his locker room presence. But it seems like Beane has already committed to Shady so we shall see what he has left.

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13 minutes ago, Buddy Hix said:

Shady wasn’t hit immediately at the hand-off in most cases, he refused to hit the hole (however small or fleeting), IMO.

 

http://www.espn.com/blog/nflnation/post/_/id/123542/inside-slant-running-back-cliff-after-age-27

 

Here’s an older article I found that presents the data. The RB age cliff has been discussed for years in fantasy football, there are lots of articles on it.

I was only aware of an infraction, didn’t know what it was for. Either way, I don’t recommend paying a guy top dollar for his locker room presence. But it seems like Beane has already committed to Shady so we shall see what he has left.


I understand the "running back production historically goes down at a certain age" argument. I just don't see any evidence that this has happened to McCoy yet. His problem last year was mental. Hesitance to hit the hole due to his not having faith that there would BE a hole most of the time. Mental hesitancy based on lackluster offensive line personnel does not equal "falling off the age cliff" to me. But we can agree to disagree.

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8 minutes ago, Logic said:


I understand the "running back production historically goes down at a certain age" argument. I just don't see any evidence that this has happened to McCoy yet. His problem last year was mental. Hesitance to hit the hole due to his not having faith that there would BE a hole most of the time. Mental hesitancy based on lackluster offensive line personnel does not equal "falling off the age cliff" to me. But we can agree to disagree.

Beane said Shady is coming back, and he doesn’t seem like a guy to go back on his word without cause. So unlike most disagreements, we should have an answer after next season as to Shady’s ability...I’m rooting for him and you.

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If the Dolphins are "Losing for Lawrence"........................

 

the Bills should go out and acquire Drake from the Dolphins and be done with it.

 

Drake is believed to want out of Miami, so it wouldn't cost the Bills much to get him.

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7 hours ago, Shaw66 said:

I don't know if third down back is the right characterizatuon, but a different role in the offense might make sense.  Making McCoy more of a primary target in the offense, using more west coast principles, probably stresses the defense significantly.  This ties in with the notion that Allen needs to go with the shorter option more often, to boost his completion percentage (also a west coast idea). 

Yeah. I agree with this but I'll bite the bullet and offer a slight critique of Allen. He not only needs to check down more often, but also work on the timing. Just checking down does nothing if you don't give the back/tight end/whatever a chance to run with it. EJ and Trent Edwards were checkdown machines but they always seem to get guys killed. Allen didn't lead his receivers to destruction like those two. I'll give him that. But he was often a bit late or slightly off target. If he can get that down, it'll be a big deal.

 

Shady. I just don't know. From my vantage point, he appears to be done, but he pretty much NEVER had a lane. I think he's still respected around the league and teams keyed on him. Combine that with an atrocious run blocking unit, and there is a CHANCE he could have a productive 2019 with OL improvement. I expect him to be on the roster, so we should find out.

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19 minutes ago, formerlyofCtown said:

I think the Shady haters are abusing the same stuff as the JA haters.  Smoke away.

 

Shady was the past, JA is the future.

 

You can like the future and put zero reliance on the past.

 

 

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Personally if I were the GM I would waive him. 7 million in cap savings is huge and I would rather spend that money elsewhere and draft a RB and get a mid-level free agent who would cost much less. BUT if you are going to keep him then I think he is better served as a uber third down back. Draft a young guy for early downs, use Ivory (if you don't cut him) for short yardage, and have Shady only be in on 2nd and long and 3rd down. Use him similar to how NOLA uses Kamura. 

 

Overall I think Shady can be effective if his role is dramatically shifted, but if the Bills think they can get one more year out of him as a full time back they are sadly mistaken. 

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7 hours ago, Marv's Neighbor said:

Would we  re-purpose his salary too?

 

 

...therein lies the REAL question.....pretty tall tariff for one dimensional re-purposing with no guarantees for what would most likely be his last year....so do you look farther ahead??.......

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8 hours ago, Shaw66 said:

I don't know if third down back is the right characterizatuon, but a different role in the offense might make sense.  Making McCoy more of a primary target in the offense, using more west coast principles, probably stresses the defense significantly.  This ties in with the notion that Allen needs to go with the shorter option more often, to boost his completion percentage (also a west coast idea). 

There's gotta be a way Daboll can use him like Belichick uses White?

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If he is back in 2019 I think it would have to be in a role player capacity.  Buffalo should not enter the season depending on McCoy for their rushing attack. A younger FA and a rookie need to be added.  Utilized in an uptempo spread out package would play to his strengths.  Like how NE uses white.q

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2 hours ago, row_33 said:

 

Shady was the past, JA is the future.

 

You can like the future and put zero reliance on the past.

 

 

I still think Shady has a couple good years left.  Ill take one of em.  Dont get me wrong, I think we need to draft a RB after the second unless someone spectacular is there in the 2nd.

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5 hours ago, LSHMEAB said:

Yeah. I agree with this but I'll bite the bullet and offer a slight critique of Allen. He not only needs to check down more often, but also work on the timing. Just checking down does nothing if you don't give the back/tight end/whatever a chance to run with it. EJ and Trent Edwards were checkdown machines but they always seem to get guys killed. Allen didn't lead his receivers to destruction like those two. I'll give him that. But he was often a bit late or slightly off target. If he can get that down, it'll be a big deal.

 

Shady. I just don't know. From my vantage point, he appears to be done, but he pretty much NEVER had a lane. I think he's still respected around the league and teams keyed on him. Combine that with an atrocious run blocking unit, and there is a CHANCE he could have a productive 2019 with OL improvement. I expect him to be on the roster, so we should find out.

I think what you say is correct, certainly about Allen. That's what I saw on his short balls. I think it's a concentration issue.  And recognition.  But you describe the problem well. 

 

As for Shady, I didn't think he looked different in 2018. I really think he had very few opportunities. People keep talking about how Belichick uses his backs, and Shady is still better than those backs the Pat's use. Its more about scheme.   I think that is on Daboll.  And that has to do with whether Daboll can create some kind of passing offense generally.  

 

 

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