Bleeding Bills Blue Posted January 7, 2019 Share Posted January 7, 2019 15 minutes ago, auburnbillsbacker said: It looks like they were smart not to trade him away last off-season. yeah - if he can win them another it's all worth it. Moving forward they have a complete lack of cap space - and the only way to make cap space is to cut valuable contributors. Foles needs to be traded for cap relief (assuming he agrees to the option), and they'd still need to maneuver some pieces (trade agholor for pennies on the dollar, or release peters, or release Kelce, or release Chris long) to be at all flexible in free agency. If they don't trade him, they likely need to do several of those moves just to get under the cap. They also lose Darby, Tate, and Graham for nothing - so they'll probably end up with some comp picks in 2020. I think 2019 will be a rough year for the Eagles - unless they have a 2018 jags year and no one gets hurt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prissythecat Posted January 7, 2019 Share Posted January 7, 2019 21 minutes ago, Real McCoy said: His name was Jeff Fisher with the Rams. The same coach that had 90% of Fans calling Goff a bust. Except that Goff was a rookie... Foles was not. Also, Vince Young who was not a good QB, had his best years under Fisher? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleeding Bills Blue Posted January 7, 2019 Share Posted January 7, 2019 2 minutes ago, prissythecat said: Except that Goff was a rookie... Foles was not. Also, Vince Young who was not a good QB, had his best years under Fisher? Fisher is a D guy though. Frank Cignetti and Rob Boras were the OC's in 2016 which was Foles only year with the rams. Neither of them had ever called plays in the NFL prior to 2016 - and Boras called plays again in 2017 and was just as bad with Goff as anyone else. Foles was pretty good in his first 2 years starting under chip kelly. Even almost won a playoff game against New Orleans in year 1, before breaking his collarbone in year 2. Since that bad year with St. Louis he's actually been really good. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IDBillzFan Posted January 7, 2019 Share Posted January 7, 2019 Interesting conversation. I wonder if we'd still be having it if Parkey hits that field goal yesterday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
downunderbill Posted January 7, 2019 Share Posted January 7, 2019 15 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Yes, that would appear to be the case. Yet given Foles’ expressed feelings on the topic of where he plays - that he thought about retiring, that he decided to play for Andy Reid, that he was willing to play for a coach from the Reid tree such as Pederson - it seems unlikely that he would renegotiate his contract without putting in some sort of protection for himself. I mean, what would be the point of having a payback/void option, if he could just be tagged? It would be pointless, right? Eagles: “we have exercised our option and we are gonna trade you to the Arizona Cardinals” Foles: “Ok, here’s $2M, I’m a free agent now” Eagles: “We accept your $2M but HAHA! TAG! Now you’re not free once again, and we’re still gonna trade you to the Arizona Cardinals. Or the Broncs.” Foles would be $2M poorer, and still stuck with a situation he may not want. What would be the point? If he voids the contract he is a free agent and no contractual obligation to Philadelphia. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Artem Lipatov Posted January 7, 2019 Share Posted January 7, 2019 (edited) Is it similar to dilema of Pats many years ago? Bledsoe or Brady? The star and fan favorite vs the guy who won Super Bowl? I think Patriots don't regret about their choice. Edited January 7, 2019 by Artem Lipatov Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted January 7, 2019 Author Share Posted January 7, 2019 3 hours ago, dneveu said: Can they tag him if he pays back the bonus money? That was a topic of discussion up-thread. Some say yes, but others say doesn't make sense that Foles and his agents would write a contract that would allow him to be $2M less wealthy and still allow him to be kept from UFA by a tag. I think the new contract was all about allowing Foles a choice, for a price, so I think no, they can't. Someone (Rapaport?) was writing as though they could. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cripple Creek Posted January 7, 2019 Share Posted January 7, 2019 3 hours ago, LABillzFan said: Interesting conversation. I wonder if we'd still be having it if Parkey hits that field goal yesterday. "Timing is everything." Joe Flacco Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted January 7, 2019 Share Posted January 7, 2019 5 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: That was a topic of discussion up-thread. Some say yes, but others say doesn't make sense that Foles and his agents would write a contract that would allow him to be $2M less wealthy and still allow him to be kept from UFA by a tag. I think the new contract was all about allowing Foles a choice, for a price, so I think no, they can't. Someone (Rapaport?) was writing as though they could. What I'm unclear about is whether the Eagles can tag Foles after he has opted-out of his contract. Typically you hear about players being tagged after their existing contract is coming to an end, not after they opt-out of one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beast Posted January 7, 2019 Share Posted January 7, 2019 20 hours ago, LEBills said: Don’t be surprised if Wentz is the one shopped. Living in Philadelphia, the fans and the team are all behind Foles. They like Wentz, they love Foles. And honestly, their offense is on track more with Foles than with Wentz. If they do decide to keep Wentz, I’m with you it’s unlikely they keep Foles...though Foles knows he is best with Pederson. If they beat the Saints they keep Foles and trade Wentz. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beast Posted January 7, 2019 Share Posted January 7, 2019 3 hours ago, LABillzFan said: Interesting conversation. I wonder if we'd still be having it if Parkey hits that field goal yesterday. He led that last TD drive, in the playoffs, on the road, against a top defense. I think we would. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted January 7, 2019 Author Share Posted January 7, 2019 3 hours ago, dneveu said: Fisher is a D guy though. Frank Cignetti and Rob Boras were the OC's in 2016 which was Foles only year with the rams. Neither of them had ever called plays in the NFL prior to 2016 - and Boras called plays again in 2017 and was just as bad with Goff as anyone else. Foles was pretty good in his first 2 years starting under chip kelly. Even almost won a playoff game against New Orleans in year 1, before breaking his collarbone in year 2. Since that bad year with St. Louis he's actually been really good. So I just want to emphasize this again. Cignetti and Boras and their offense was a total hot mess in 2015 (not 16) with the Rams. He made not one, but two QB who have had some success elsewhere (Foles, and Keenum) look like garbage. Then Boras was given the chance to do it again and made Goff and Keenum look like garbage. When an OC manages to make 3 QB who have some success elsewhere look like crap, it's not them, Rob, it's you and your offense. Two words for why Foles did very well (not just pretty good his 2nd season, very well) in Philly: Pat Shurmur. It's not a coincidence that Keenum looked good last year under Shurmur in Minn as well and that Minn's O was simply not as good this year under DeFilippo. It remains to be seen if Shurmur can do something as HC, but as a QB mentor and OC, there's no question he knows something. Anyway, having had the epiphany that a QB is pretty well at the mercy of the guy calling plays, I think Nick Foles would retire before playing for about 2/3 of the OCs in the league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LSHMEAB Posted January 7, 2019 Share Posted January 7, 2019 (edited) 9 minutes ago, Binghamton Beast said: If they beat the Saints they keep Foles and trade Wentz. I'm taking all (theoretical of course) wagers on the Eagles dealing Wentz. I'll give you 3/1 odds. Edited January 7, 2019 by LSHMEAB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beast Posted January 7, 2019 Share Posted January 7, 2019 1 minute ago, LSHMEAB said: I'm taking all (theoretical of course) wagers on the Eagles dealing Wentz. I'll give you 3/1 odds. You don’t think they would keep Foles under those circumstances? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LSHMEAB Posted January 7, 2019 Share Posted January 7, 2019 Just now, Binghamton Beast said: You don’t think they would keep Foles under those circumstances? Not even if they win the Superbowl. They'll thank Foles for his amazing service and move on with their franchise QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted January 7, 2019 Author Share Posted January 7, 2019 6 hours ago, Mr. WEO said: As long as they continue to pair Wentz and Foles, the Eagles will be OK. Foles won them a SB and this year he turned the team around from a losing season to Div playoff game. Right now, the Eagles are $12M in the red on the cap. They gotta do something Foles $20M would be a lot of something. 12 minutes ago, Binghamton Beast said: If they beat the Saints they keep Foles and trade Wentz. Wentz is on a rookie contract. His salary is almost all signing bonus and roster bonus next year. The Iggles maybe save $3M and take a $4M cap hit if they trade Wentz. Now that's not to say trading Foles is what the Eagles will do. Howie Roseman has shown himself before to be an "outside the box" thinker on the cap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProcessYaDigg Posted January 7, 2019 Share Posted January 7, 2019 18 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: How you figure that? Foles has a SB ring and an NFC Championship. I don’t think Romo ever made it to the Championship game. Also, Wentz is the one with the cracked-up back Damn, I completely mentioned the wrong QB. I meant to say Wentz = Romo. i'll edit my post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beast Posted January 7, 2019 Share Posted January 7, 2019 (edited) 36 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Right now, the Eagles are $12M in the red on the cap. They gotta do something Foles $20M would be a lot of something. Wentz is on a rookie contract. His salary is almost all signing bonus and roster bonus next year. The Iggles maybe save $3M and take a $4M cap hit if they trade Wentz. Now that's not to say trading Foles is what the Eagles will do. Howie Roseman has shown himself before to be an "outside the box" thinker on the cap. Oh, I get that. But 1 SB and, at the very least, a conference title appearance, should trump a rookie contract. They could make some cuts and some holes they need to fill could be done by the haul of draft picks that would come their way. Edited January 7, 2019 by Binghamton Beast Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted January 7, 2019 Author Share Posted January 7, 2019 5 minutes ago, Binghamton Beast said: Oh, I get that. But 1 SB and, at the very least, a conference title appearance, should trump a rookie contract. They could make some cuts and some holes they need to fill could be done by the haul of draft picks that would come their way. It's a valid and interesting point. You have a promising rookie who lit up the league in his 2nd year before becoming injured. He played very well when he returned from that injury - but somehow not quite well enough, leading to a 6-7 team record at the point where he's injured again - a troubling injury, fractured spine. You make the playoffs again with a 9-7 record on the arm of his backup QB - who also won you the Superbowl the previous year - and win your first round. At some point, the guy who is winning the playoff games would seem to become the better bet over the guy who got injured and wasn't available 2 years in a row. When is that point? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LSHMEAB Posted January 7, 2019 Share Posted January 7, 2019 7 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: It's a valid and interesting point. You have a promising rookie who lit up the league in his 2nd year before becoming injured. He played very well when he returned from that injury - but somehow not quite well enough, leading to a 6-7 team record at the point where he's injured again - a troubling injury, fractured spine. You make the playoffs again with a 9-7 record on the arm of his backup QB - who also won you the Superbowl the previous year - and win your first round. At some point, the guy who is winning the playoff games would seem to become the better bet over the guy who got injured and wasn't available 2 years in a row. When is that point? I'm on record as stating there's not a snowball's chance in hell they move Wentz, but I found it interesting that Foles is only 3 years older than Wentz. Still....no. The salary cap alone makes it virtually impossible. They would have to move heaven and earth to choose Foles over Wentz and it ain't gonna happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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