Can Allen Pass for 4000yds 30TDs and 1000 Rushing yds and 15TDs in the same season?

[formerlyofCtown]

2 hours ago, BillsFan1988 said:

I'll be honest i wasn't a Allen guy when we drafted him. Matter of fact i hated the pk and thought he would be a complete bust. I kept thinking about the Mahomes trade that seemed to be a disaster for us. 

 

Wow have things changed . I will admit now i am a believer in Allen future and the future of this franchise. Its gonna be a really exciting offseason. My question is at some point in his career can Allen achieve this crazy Lebron James esqe numbers. What we have seen from Allen so far is not even scratch in the surface of what he can develop into. I realize he still has many flaws in his game that he needs to work on and defenses will adjust to what he does best. But if he hits his peak upside i think this type of season is very possible for him to achieve and if he does he would be the first NFL QB to ever do it. 250yds passing a gm and 62yds rushing will do it. The question is can he.

I believe so and he will win the MVP that year.

[freddyjj]

43 minutes ago, Veneno said:

 

This is a joke? The better questing should be since as a starter in college in a mediocre division playing against scrub defense never completed more than 56% of his passes, can JA complete 55% of his passes in the next season?  This season he was at 52%.  SO FAR he is better suit to be a RB or WR just like ex- Bills former speedy running QB like Terrelle Pryor.   Rosen so far had proven to be a better passer QB.

Josh Rosen 163 YPG, .85 TD PG, 1.08 INT PG.  No Rushing TDs.

Year	Age	Tm	Pos	No.	G	GS	QBrec	Cmp	Att	Cmp%	Yds	TD	TD%	Int	Int%	Lng	Y/A	AY/A	Y/C	Y/G	Rate	QBR	Sk	Yds	NY/A	ANY/A	Sk%	4QC	GWD	AV
2018	21	ARI	QB	3	14	13	3-10-0	217	393	55.2	2278	11	2.8	14	3.6	75	5.8	4.8	10.5	162.7	66.7	26.6	45	320	4.47	3.53	10.3	1	2

 

Josh Allen 173 YPG, .91 TD PG, 1.09 INT PG and add 8 Rushing TDs or another .8 TD PG

     

Year	Age	Tm	Pos	No.	G	GS	QBrec	Cmp	Att	Cmp%	Yds	TD	TD%	Int	Int% ▲	Lng	Y/A	AY/A	Y/C	Y/G	Rate	QBR	Sk	Yds	NY/A	ANY/A	Sk%	4QC	GWD	AV
2018	22	BUF	QB	17	12	11	5-6-0	169	320	52.8	2074	10	3.1	12	3.8	75	6.5	5.4	12.3	172.8	67.9	52.3	28	213	5.35	4.37	8.0	2	3

 

So I am calling BS here.  The above PASSING STATS shows Josh is better in YPG, TD%, YARDS/ATTEMPT, YARDS/COMPLETION, SACK RATE, 4TH QTR COMEBACKS AND GAME WINNING DRIVES.  Rosen is only slightly better in Completion Rate and INT%.  No way he is the better passer to this point of their careers.

 

Both QBs struggled but it should be obvious that Josh is better overall QB as generates 1.7 TD per game including Rushing.  His Goal Line sneaks and Red zone runs lead to TDs and QB sneaks keep drives alive.  That is a plus in NFL. QBR is double that of Rosen's even if Passer rating seems similar.

 

As for Rosen, I liked him as well but think we drafted the right Josh. 

Edited January 3, 2019 by freddyjj

[freddyjj]

19 minutes ago, jwhit34 said:

 

Outside of the 12 rushing TDs other #s could be done. Grogan and Newton are only QBs ever to score 12 or more rushing TDs in a season. Jack Kemp is #3 all time rushing TDs by a QB (40). 

 

QBs have run for over 800 yards only 6 times in SB era so that would be quite an accomplishment. 

Here's his past stub year

 

				Game	Game	Rush	Rush	Rush	Rush	Rush	Rush	Rush
Year	Age	Tm	Pos	No.	G	GS	Rush	Yds	TD	Lng	Y/A	Y/G	A/G
2018	22	BUF	QB	17	12	11	89	631	8	45	7.1	52.6	7.4

 

If one just straight lines these stats we get 12 TDS in 16 games.  And 800 Yds.  I believe he could accomplish both.  Easily

[GreggTX]

Any QB that can barely complete half of the passes he throws will never throw for 4000 yards in a season.

[Pbomb]

Next year 

[BillsFan1988]

14 minutes ago, GreggTX said:

Any QB that can barely complete half of the passes he throws will never throw for 4000 yards in a season.

Allen % will get better im thinking he'll hit 60% as soon as next season. Once we get this kid some talent around him and line that can block for more then 2 secs Josh will be able to work threw his progressions and find the open Wr . This is just the start for him as with expericence the gm will naturally come to him.

[MJS]

As he gets better he'll run less. Just a fact. He'll find guys open and will be able to read defenses. Plus, if the oline is improved he'll get more time to throw.

 

Plus defenses know what a run threat he is now. They'll follow the blue print of Detroit and New England to take that away (hopefully opening up the passing game in the process).

 

So I'm going to say no. I don't think he'll ever have a 1000 yard rushing season. I bet he'll have plenty of 500 yard seasons though. And I bet he'll have a bunch more 100 yard games in his career. If everything works out he could go down as one of the best dual threat QB's ever.

 

He'll be special if he can improve his passing mechanics, touch, and short pass game. He's really smart so he will learn how to read defenses and manipulate them naturally over time. Not worried about that piece.

[Patrick Duffy]

In no way shape or form would I want my potential franchise QB running THAT much. He would surely get hurt and could ruin his career if the right injury were to happen. The passing stats you posted OP, I would love 4k yards and 30 TDs. Bills would have major points if that happened. Maybe one day he will, for now I just want to see him continue to improve

[LABILLBACKER]

30/10/4000 is possible but I would prefer he uses his mobility as a part time weapon and reduce his chances at injury. Let the RB have 15 tds....

[C.Biscuit97]

I wonder what Bills fans would have predicted if Allen had Cam’s rookie year:  https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/N/NewtCa00.htm

[Veneno]

1 hour ago, freddyjj said:

Josh Rosen 163 YPG, .85 TD PG, 1.08 INT PG.  No Rushing TDs.

Year	Age	Tm	Pos	No.	G	GS	QBrec	Cmp	Att	Cmp%	Yds	TD	TD%	Int	Int%	Lng	Y/A	AY/A	Y/C	Y/G	Rate	QBR	Sk	Yds	NY/A	ANY/A	Sk%	4QC	GWD	AV
2018	21	ARI	QB	3	14	13	3-10-0	217	393	55.2	2278	11	2.8	14	3.6	75	5.8	4.8	10.5	162.7	66.7	26.6	45	320	4.47	3.53	10.3	1	2

 

Josh Allen 173 YPG, .91 TD PG, 1.09 INT PG and add 8 Rushing TDs or another .8 TD PG

     

Year	Age	Tm	Pos	No.	G	GS	QBrec	Cmp	Att	Cmp%	Yds	TD	TD%	Int	Int% ▲	Lng	Y/A	AY/A	Y/C	Y/G	Rate	QBR	Sk	Yds	NY/A	ANY/A	Sk%	4QC	GWD	AV
2018	22	BUF	QB	17	12	11	5-6-0	169	320	52.8	2074	10	3.1	12	3.8	75	6.5	5.4	12.3	172.8	67.9	52.3	28	213	5.35	4.37	8.0	2	3

 

So I am calling BS here.  The above PASSING STATS shows Josh is better in YPG, TD%, YARDS/ATTEMPT, YARDS/COMPLETION, SACK RATE, 4TH QTR COMEBACKS AND GAME WINNING DRIVES.  Rosen is only slightly better in Completion Rate and INT%.  No way he is the better passer to this point of their careers.

 

Both QBs struggled but it should be obvious that Josh is better overall QB as generates 1.7 TD per game including Rushing.  His Goal Line sneaks and Red zone runs lead to TDs and QB sneaks keep drives alive.  That is a plus in NFL. QBR is double that of Rosen's even if Passer rating seems similar.

 

As for Rosen, I liked him as well but think we drafted the right Josh. 

 

Rosen and JA both had more INT than TD so please don't try to go cute putting outside stats.  But you never show JA pathetic completion rate and he played in the AFC East hardly play any defense, in fact the Bills is the only team that play real defense.  A guy that was taken from the street Matt Barkley put 40 points on the Jets completing 60% of his passes throwing a couple of TD with zero INT. 

AZ OL is college level in a division that play nfl defense, see Rams, Seattle, 49niners.  Still Rosen with a weak OL and no weapon was able to complete 55% of his passes.  So yeah Rosen at this point better passer QB than JA.  

[Beast]

No.

[transient]

What’s all the fuss about? When Allen throws for 30 TDs and rushes for 15 more he’ll still be 7 shy of Mahomes 2018... the big dumb loser. 

[freddyjj]

41 minutes ago, Veneno said:

 

Rosen and JA both had more INT than TD so please don't try to go cute putting outside stats.  But you never show JA pathetic completion rate and he played in the AFC East hardly play any defense, in fact the Bills is the only team that play real defense.  A guy that was taken from the street Matt Barkley put 40 points on the Jets completing 60% of his passes throwing a couple of TD with zero INT. 

AZ OL is college level in a division that play nfl defense, see Rams, Seattle, 49niners.  Still Rosen with a weak OL and no weapon was able to complete 55% of his passes.  So yeah Rosen at this point better passer QB than JA.  

So I will agree to disagree.  Heck I forgot that the NFC West has the scary QB-less  SF 49ers in it - and that's where you got 2 of your wins!

 

As for common opponents, Allen beat Minnesota in their house prior to his injury and Detroit at Home so 2-1.  Chicago beat Peterman led Bills. 

AZ went 1-3 against same opponents with Rosen going 1-2.

 

Allen went 5-5 in games he started and finished.  Rosen was 3-10.  Keep on with your excuses for Rosen though and please be happy when he passes for 56% completion and 4 wins next year.

Edited January 3, 2019 by freddyjj

[Jay_Fixit]

2 hours ago, GreggTX said:

Any QB that can barely complete half of the passes he throws will never throw for 4000 yards in a season.

Unless you’re Sith, or me, talking in absolutes can be harmful.

 

Andrew Luck was at 54.1% as a rookie.

Josh Allen was at 52.7%

 

1.4% difference for all you mathematicians.

 

And don’t waste your time saying “you’re comparing Allen to Luck??!!?? LLLOLROTFL”

 

I’m commenting on what you wrote.

 

 

 

 

[Pbomb]

3 hours ago, Veneno said:

 

This is a joke? The better questing should be since as a starter in college in a mediocre division playing against scrub defense never completed more than 56% of his passes, can JA complete 55% of his passes in the next season?  This season he was at 52%.  SO FAR he is better suit to be a RB or WR just like ex- Bills former speedy running QB like Terrelle Pryor.   Rosen so far had proven to be a better passer QB.

No rosen hasn’t

[Jay_Fixit]

3 hours ago, Veneno said:

 

This is a joke? The better questing should be since as a starter in college in a mediocre division playing against scrub defense never completed more than 56% of his passes, can JA complete 55% of his passes in the next season?  This season he was at 52%.  SO FAR he is better suit to be a RB or WR just like ex- Bills former speedy running QB like Terrelle Pryor.   Rosen so far had proven to be a better passer QB.

The irony.

[Warcodered]

4 hours ago, BillsFan1988 said:

I'll be honest i wasn't a Allen guy when we drafted him. Matter of fact i hated the pk and thought he would be a complete bust. I kept thinking about the Mahomes trade that seemed to be a disaster for us. 

 

Wow have things changed . I will admit now i am a believer in Allen future and the future of this franchise. Its gonna be a really exciting offseason. My question is at some point in his career can Allen achieve this crazy Lebron James esqe numbers. What we have seen from Allen so far is not even scratch in the surface of what he can develop into. I realize he still has many flaws in his game that he needs to work on and defenses will adjust to what he does best. But if he hits his peak upside i think this type of season is very possible for him to achieve and if he does he would be the first NFL QB to ever do it. 250yds passing a gm and 62yds rushing will do it. The question is can he.

I mean I think if develops as well as I think he can I think he'll be able to but I don't think he will still. A combination of better receivers and being better able to utilize them with a better rushing game will probably drain some of his gaudy rushing stats.

[billsfan_34]

If he has to run for a grand in the season that means out offense is probably a hot mess again.

[CincyBillsFan]

The easy or maybe lazy answer to this question is a resounding NO.  No QB will ever attain those types of numbers. 

 

But I'm in the group that thinks the times they are a changing in the NFL.  Today QB's regularly put up passing numbers that we would have thought unreachable in 1980.  It's clear the NFL is incorporating more & more of the college game and at some point they'll have to take the final plunge and go with true duel threat QB's to run these offenses at full throttle.  That Allen has the physical tools to be an elite level dual threat QB is apparent.  It may be that 4,000 yards/1,000 yards is unattainable but what about 3500 yards/800 yards? 

 

So since Buffalo was the franchise that gave the NFL it's first 2,000 yard rusher maybe we'll be the first franchise to give the NFL a QB with extreme numbers like these.  Who knows but it sure would be awesome to see.