the Edelman TD

[Rk_Bills86]

@ Binghamton Beast

Oh get off that homer concept - I've by no means gone anywhere near that type of delusional bantering. I'm stating that Refs have been poor, penalties and referee decisions have been ununiform at best.

 

The point that is trying to be made is simple - Refs do not make the same calls for the same concepts. They do show favoritism - look no further than the ref telling Cam Newton that he hasn't played in the league long enough to get a call.

 

The Bills won more games this year than I expected - That said, the play in Houston in which Allen got hurt, would have absolutely been a flag if that had been Brady.

Edited December 24, 2018 by Rk_Bills86

[BillsfaninChicago]

I think we are missing the bigger issue here. What about the fact that Edelman looked like a high garden gnome?

[JoPar_v2]

5 hours ago, Hellcamino said:

I hate this rule! 

If a runner gets wrapped up, stopped completely and then taken completely off his feet and pulled to the ground, it should not matter that he was laying on a body instead of the grass.  The tackler, then thinking the play is over, releases runner and he's now allowed to get back on to his feet and start running again?

At the VERY least it should be ruled forward progress.

 

 

Nitpicky. You’re sour because the play went against us in this instance. 

[zow2]

Edelman has a higher football IQ than all our receivers combined.  I hate it, but it's true.

[row_33]

13 minutes ago, zow2 said:

Edelman has a higher football IQ than all our receivers combined.  I hate it, but it's true.

 

He’s the heart of that team

 

wish the Bills skill players could muster up 2 percent of it on aggregate

[Bing Bong]

You're supposed to strip the ball when you got the carrier stuck like that. It's like the only way to have a ball carrier stuck for you to strip without that darned forward progress rule. Saints made a helluva strip tackle to end the day on the Steelers yesterday and it went similar to that. JuJu wasn't down and his back landed on the tackler who ripped the ball out. Just play to the whistle.. well coached teams etc. I think it's an advantagious position for tacklers that aren't being dummies.

[Mr. WEO]

2 hours ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

Too much whining about rules and refs. 

 

"there's a flag on every play!.  The refs are ruining NFL football!"

 

"they are (holding/PI/jumping offside) on every play--and no flags??  The refs are ruining NFL football!"

2 hours ago, Rk_Bills86 said:

Refs have shown clear favoritism and lack of uniformity on play calls for the last five year. This isn't even a debate. That play in Miami where the guy took Allen down by the neck would have absolutely been a flag if it had been Brady.

 

 

As has been posted on this board many times, the numbers say this is not correct.

[LSHMEAB]

There is just no justification or rationale for such a rule change and I don't think it's analogous to the touchback on a fumble OOB.

 

You gonna rule a running back down as they approach the goal line if they happen to be using a defensive player to stay off the ground? It just doesn't make any sense.

 

Tackle the guy and play to the whistle. It's that simple.

[buffalobillswin]

Or the tackler can have some sort of awareness and make sure the receiver touches the ground

[TigerJ]

"Forward progress" is one of the more subjective decisions referees have to make.  In theory, I imagine sometimes in the circumstances that led to the Edelman TD, officials could blow the play dead citing forward progress.  They didn't.  Conversely, on some plays similar to the Foster catch where the whistle blew, another referee might have let the play continue a bit longer.  I'm not thrilled with the level of subjectivity in the officiating of football, but I don't see a viable alternative.

Edited December 24, 2018 by TigerJ

[26CornerBlitz]

3 minutes ago, TigerJ said:

"Forward progress" is one of the more subjective deceision referees have to make.  In theory, I imagine sometimes in the circumstances that led to the Edelman TD, officials could blow the play dead citing forward progress.  They didn't.  Conversely, on some plays similar to the Foster catch where the whistle blew, another referee might have let the play continue a bit longer.  I'm not thrilled with the level of subjectivity in the officiating of football, but I don't see a viable alternative.

 

If Foster had not been ruled stoppped (forward progress) and a fumble was forced there would have been a riot here on TSW with complaining that his forward progress was stopped.  

[judman]

Kelso took issue with the way it was called (or NOT called) on the radio broadcast. I vomit in my mouth a bit... but it looked good to me.

 

His point was that a defender could have come in and rocked PEDdleman because the whistle hadn't blown.  I'll bet if LorAx had done just that he'd have been flagged for unnecessary roughness.  He went on to say that the league is trying to get rid of those situations and therefore it should have been whistled dead. He was quite exercised about it, actually. 

[John from Riverside]

The real question is why didnt Edmunds DESTROY him

[Nick the Greek]

Annoying and irritating yes, but how to then establish when a person is down? Make it a judgment call by the refs? You need concrete rules. 

[The Frankish Reich]

8 hours ago, Mr. WEO said:

It's always a pleasure when posters who don't understand a rule tell us they don't like the call.

In defense of the OP - I don’t think anyone doesn’t understand the rule. It’s more “why is this the rule?” And it’s a good question. Should another Bills player have jumped on top of Edelman with sufficient force to dislodge part of his body that was being supported by a teammate? Wouldn’t that be a penalty? Isn’t that a player safety issue? The fact that a player - otherwise down by contact - lands on another player doesn’t seem a good or smart reason for not having the whistle blow by rule. In other words, it’s the rule, but it also strikes me as a bad rule regardless of which team it helps or hurts. 

[26CornerBlitz]

2 minutes ago, The Frankish Reich said:

In defense of the OP - I don’t think anyone doesn’t understand the rule. It’s more “why is this the rule?” And it’s a good question. Should another Bills player have jumped on top of Edelman with sufficient force to dislodge part of his body that was being supported by a teammate? Wouldn’t that be a penalty? Isn’t that a player safety issue? The fact that a player - otherwise down by contact - lands on another player doesn’t seem a good or smart reason for not having the whistle blow by rule. In other words, it’s the rule, but it also strikes me as a bad rule regardless of which team it helps or hurts. 

 

That's just it. Edeleman was not down by contact since no part of his body touched the ground and his forward progress certainly wasn't stopped.  No down by contact and no whistle means the play isn't over. Another rule that's perfectly fine just the way it is. 

[KD in CA]

6 minutes ago, The Frankish Reich said:

In defense of the OP - I don’t think anyone doesn’t understand the rule. It’s more “why is this the rule?” And it’s a good question. Should another Bills player have jumped on top of Edelman with sufficient force to dislodge part of his body that was being supported by a teammate? Wouldn’t that be a penalty? Isn’t that a player safety issue? The fact that a player - otherwise down by contact - lands on another player doesn’t seem a good or smart reason for not having the whistle blow by rule. In other words, it’s the rule, but it also strikes me as a bad rule regardless of which team it helps or hurts. 

 

No, it's a stupid question.  Obviously, the rule is part of the objective standard over what it means to be "down".  If no part of the body other than hands and feet touch the ground a guy is not down.

 

It amazing to me how people here b---h about the officiating yet want to make every damn rule in the book even MORE subjective.  

[The Frankish Reich]

Just now, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

That's just it. Edeleman was not down by contact since no part of his body touched the ground and his forward progress certainly wasn't stopped.  No down by contact and no whistle means the play isn't over. Another rule that's perfectly fine just the way it is. 

We also see plays in which the runner in the Edelman “posture” has an alert defender strip the ball from him, and the defense recovers. I don’t like that either. What’s the Edelman supposed to do? Yell out a safe word?  I think the game would be better (and safer) if the whistle blew in these situations. 

1 minute ago, KD in CA said:

 

No, it's a stupid question.  Obviously, the rule is part of the objective standard over what it means to be "down".  If no part of the body other than hands and feet touch the ground a guy is not down.

 

It amazing to me how people here b---h about the officiating yet want to make every damn rule in the book even MORE subjective.  

In other words: the rule is what it is, and ever shall be. We live in a world of perfect rules. Any debate over whether they can be made better for enjoyment of the game and player safety is therefore a stupid debate. 

[Bing Bong]

1 minute ago, The Frankish Reich said:

We also see plays in which the runner in the Edelman “posture” has an alert defender strip the ball from him, and the defense recovers. I don’t like that either. What’s the Edelman supposed to do? Yell out a safe word?  I think the game would be better (and safer) if the whistle blew in these situations. 

See Juju's fumble last play against the Saints. Is this not supposed to be advantageous to the defense if they play the whistle??

 

However I can see the point of above that it's dangerous for defenders to keep tackling a man that's going down. Hold him from being down by contact and strip away until forward progress is called. You don't need to head hunt him there but don't let him get up either.

[26CornerBlitz]

5 minutes ago, The Frankish Reich said:

We also see plays in which the runner in the Edelman “posture” has an alert defender strip the ball from him, and the defense recovers. I don’t like that either. What’s the Edelman supposed to do? Yell out a safe word?  I think the game would be better (and safer) if the whistle blew in these situations. 

 

Like it or not the play's over until you actually get tackled to the ground, have forward progress stopped, or go out of bounds. Why not just make it touch or flag football?

Edited December 25, 2018 by 26CornerBlitz