Cowboys AND BEARS just showed why I keep saying Defense MATTERS still

[mjd1001]

On 11/30/2018 at 12:29 AM, Domdab99 said:

you know what matters more?

 

Brees missing every other throw

NO receivers dropping passes

lots of flags

Agreed.

 

also, I game where "defense mattered" in this way vs dozens and dozens more where the Offense was more important.....not a trend. Just because something happens on a very rare basis doesn't justify its importance.

[reddogblitz]

Of course defense still matters. It's only the knuckleheads on WGR and sportswriters that think otherwise.

 

Here's my opinion  from left field. To win the SB you need to really good on one side and above average on the other. And have decent at least kicking teams. And a money kicker.

Edited December 1, 2018 by reddogblitz

[paulbills]

It was a fluke game, offense still matters more in this day and age than defense, what has our great defense got us? nothing without an offense. 

[reddogblitz]

2 of the greatest offensive minds in the history of football with multiple SB wins were DCs that led.dominating D's that won the NFL Championship.

 

Tom Landry

Bill Bellyache

Edited December 1, 2018 by reddogblitz

[CaptnCoke11]

You see games like this a few times a year.. by far the exception not the rule in today’s NFL 

[Boca BIlls]

On 11/29/2018 at 11:52 PM, Alphadawg7 said:

Cowboys and their top 5 defense just shut down and beat the hottest team with the most efficient and best offense in football led by the MVP front runner and one of the best QBs of all time.  

 

Everyone keeps saying “game has changed”, “you must have offensive minded coach”, “you gotta throw for 300 yards most games”...blah blah blah.  Same crap people have said every year for 10 years.  Yet the two highest scoring offenses in NFL history combined to score 22 points in their SB losses to defensive teams.   Last year Brady threw for 500 yards and lost to a journeyman QB because the Pats D was so bad.  In fact, none of the top 5 highest scoring offenses in history won the SB, and only 3 reached it going 0-3 and all losing to defensive teams.

 

There are a lot of ways to win.  And come playoff time, defense matters a lot.  I love offense as much as anyone, don’t get me wrong, but just tired of all the absurd hot takes around here every time a high scoring game happens people crap on McD like he has no chance to succeed.  Like this weeks ridiculous thread on how our biggest mistake was not hiring Frank Reich.  Or all the threads on now we have to fire McD and hire some other offensive HC.  It’s ridiculous.

 

Personally, I love the way McD and Beane are building this team.  Built the D into a real strength, cleared our cap, and got a promising young QB to build around.  Plus they got extra picks this draft too.

 

Couple OL and WR additions and we will be on our way to being a team that could really contend for a long time.

1 game where Brees had more of a bad game than I would pin on defense. Offense matters most.

[78thealltimegreat]

Only a handful of teams have the linebackers the Cowboys have to run with the likes of Kamara out of the backfield since that’s the Saints bread and butter..Still gotta score points to win in the league but having an elite D helps A LOT 

[GunnerBill]

23 hours ago, ctk232 said:

So this is just blatantly false.

 

Another way of saying this is 5 different coaches won the SB in the past 20 years that are defensively-minded. Only 9 have been won by a team with a defensive minded HC at the time. To break it down, of those 9, 5 were Belly in NE with Tom Brady, so skews that one just a bit. The others were Dungy, Cowher, Tomlin, and Carroll. I also don't know how you counted coaches with an ST background, but the balance is there.

 

So the two in the last 20 years who have been Special Team backgrounds are Vermeil - who was also an OC in college so goes down as offense and Harbaugh - who was also a defensive backs coach in Philly so goes down as defense. 

 

When I count it I have 10 Offensive and 10 Defensive in the last 20 years. Years in brackets are the year of the Superbowl not the year of NFL season. 

 

Offensive: Shanahan (99), Vermeil (00), Billick (01), Gruden (03), Coughlin (08, 12), Payton (10) and McCarthy (11), Kubiak (16), Pederson (18) 

 

Defensive: Belichick (02, 04, 05, 15, 17), Cowher (06), Dungy (07), Tomlin (09), Harbaugh (13), Carroll (14)

 

[CircleTheWagons99]

Anyone else see that Cowboys staffer on the saints side line with a headset and cell phone?

 

http://www.ebaumsworld.com/pictures/did-the-cowboys-cheat-int-heir-game-against-the-saints/85826090/

[reddogblitz]

7 minutes ago, CircleTheWagons99 said:

Anyone else see that Cowboys staffer on the saints side line with a headset and cell phone?

 

http://www.ebaumsworld.com/pictures/did-the-cowboys-cheat-int-heir-game-against-the-saints/85826090/

 

World's dumbest cheater. If you're gonnA stand on the other teams sidelines and steal their plays, at least Don t wear your own  team's regalia.

[BringBackOrton]

14 hours ago, billsfan_34 said:

Brees, Rodgers, Brady, and Big Ben all seem to be on the decline. A changing of the guard is amongst us.

Brees is having the best year of his career.

[billsfan_34]

7 hours ago, BringBackOrton said:

Brees is having the best year of his career.

You think? I dont know if the stats show that. His arm seems to be tiring the last few times ive watched him. Maybe im wrong I dunno.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/B/BreeDr00.htm

Edited December 2, 2018 by billsfan_34

[BringBackOrton]

20 minutes ago, billsfan_34 said:

You think? I dont know if the stats show that. His arm seems to be tiring the last few times ive watched him. Maybe im wrong I dunno.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/B/BreeDr00.htm

Highest TD%, highest completion%, highest YPA, highest passer rating, highest QBR and lowest INT%.

 

The stats absolutely show that. There’s a reason he’s been basically announced as MVP already.

[Jerome007]

Brees is still golden. More than a changing of the guard, is (at last) the rising of a new. Goff and Mahones are in the new breed just like Mayfield, Allen and co. 2nd year vs 1st year is huge now but in 5 years that difference will be minimal. So few stars between the big dogs and the new breed. Rivers, and then a lot of "very good but not great" guys like Dalton, Bradford, etc.

 

My "fear" is not that Allen is a bust. I'm convinced he is THE man. The best already since Flutie/Bledsoe and hopefully since Kelly. The guy you want to lead and build the team around.  I just hope he becomes elite and not "just" one of those guys that occasionally cracks the Top 10. That'd be quite the improvement of course but still, we deserve our star QB

As for defenses, of course they matter. IMO there are many ways to win. A great defense would still make a team Superbowl contenders. No doubt new rule tweaks favor the offense but defenses ain't obsolete.

 

 

[ctk232]

On 11/30/2018 at 6:06 PM, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Ah well thats on me then, I have always thought Coughlin had been a DC for Parcells at some point.  Maybe it was because he was part of so many defensive heavy teams, but just literally for as long as I have known Coughlin thought he had defensive background.  

 

And when I looked at Fox, it said he was the coach until 2015, I didn't realize he left at the beginning of 2015 and wasnt part of the Super Bowl winning team that year.  So that was an ovesight, so my apologies.  One was just a long incorrect understanding of Coughlins background and the other was a misread on my part when I was looking at the past winners.  

 

But yes, original point remains and we are in agreement on.  

 

In case you were wondering, to force Vermeil and Harbuagh out of ST, Vermeil was offense at one point in his career as Harbaugh was defense. So the 10/10 split over the last 20 years holds true. 

 

This might just be me, but I feel like most of the people dying for an offensive coach really just want to see a better offense period. And who might not take into account the many different organizational dynamics that are currently employed across the league that logically disprove the advantage of one HC over the other based upon background experience.

[Alphadawg7]

I’m just gonna bump this little thread right back up here for those who watched the Bears defense whoop the vaunted Rams offense all up and down the field.

 

#DefenseStillMatters

Edited December 10, 2018 by Alphadawg7

[dubs]

It definitely matters. Look at the Bears. Look at the Ravens. 

 

I think you cant really win a super bowl without competent offense and defense. There’s no secret formula for which one needs to be better but you need both. 

 

 

[Mr. WEO]

6 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

I’m just gonna bump this little thread right back up here for those who watched the Bears defense whoop the vaunted Rams offense all up and down the field.

 

#DefenseStillMatters

 

How about against that vaunted Giants Offense?

 

4 minutes ago, dubs said:

It definitely matters. Look at the Bears. Look at the Ravens. 

 

I think you cant really win a super bowl without competent offense and defense. There’s no secret formula for which one needs to be better but you need both. 

 

 

 

Never team will play in the SB this year.

[Alphadawg7]

21 minutes ago, dubs said:

It definitely matters. Look at the Bears. Look at the Ravens. 

 

I think you cant really win a super bowl without competent offense and defense. There’s no secret formula for which one needs to be better but you need both. 

 

 

 

Agreed.  You’re not gonna win with a very good defense and terrible offense (see Bills) just like you won’t win with a very good offense and terrible defense (See Brees, Ryan, Rivers, etc. career).  Brees won his only SB when they had a more balanced team.  In fact Saints had a high ranked defense the year he won and then mostly missed the playoffs since when the defense was terrible.  

 

Come playoff time, defense matters a lot.  And this year there aren’t really any Defenses at the level of the Legion of Boom or the Broncos D in 2015, so offenses have taken center stage.  But there are still some very good defenses like the Bears and Cowboys who showed that if you can slow these offenses down they can beat them.  Especially when those high powered teams don’t have very good defenses allowing teams with lesser offenses to keep pace.

 

This brings me back to my original point.  I’m not saying defense is the most important key to winning, I mean I want a high powered offense as much as anyone.  But, I made this post to refute those who repeatedly said Offense is king, Defense doesn’t matter, we can’t win with McD because of defensive background, McBeane should be fired for fixing defense, and all the other non sense.  

 

I love the direction we are headed.  We have that playoff caliber defense and we have a kid at QB who was built to lead a high powered offense.  They went after him for that reason.  The intent is to build this offense up around him, and if they succeed this offseason in giving him the tools to succeed, we will be a team in real contention annually for a long time.  

Edited December 10, 2018 by Alphadawg7

[dubs]

13 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Agreed.  You’re not gonna win with a very good defense and terrible offense (see Bills) just like you won’t win with a very good offense and terrible defense (See Brees, Ryan, Rivers, etc. career).  Brees won his only SB when they had a more balanced team.  In fact Saints had a high ranked defense the year he won and then mostly missed the playoffs since when the defense was terrible.  

 

Come playoff time, defense matters a lot.  And this year there aren’t really any Defenses at the level of the Legion of Boom or the Broncos D in 2015, so offenses have taken center stage.  But there are still some very good defenses like the Bears and Cowboys who showed that if you can slow these offenses down they can beat them.  Especially when those high powered teams don’t have very good defenses allowing teams with lesser offenses to keep pace.

 

This brings me back to my original point.  I’m not saying defense is the most important key to winning, I mean I want a high powered offense as much as anyone.  But, I made this post to refute those who repeatedly said Offense is king, Defense doesn’t matter, we can’t win with McD because of defensive background, McBeane should be fired for fixing defense, and all the other non sense.  

 

I love the direction we are headed.  We have that playoff caliber defense and we have a kid at QB who was built to lead a high powered offense.  They went after him for that reason.  The intent is to build this offense up around him, and if they succeed this offseason in giving him the tools to succeed, we will be a team in real contention annually for a long time.  

 

Love this post. ? 

 

Won’t sit well with the PTI or Twitter crowd where everything has to be one or the other and fight to the death over it. But totally correct nonetheless.