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Bills QB Josh Allen is changing skeptical minds. ---- Brady Quinn apparently prefers potential over results


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6 minutes ago, Comebackkid said:

http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/25500861/best-worst-qbs-nfl-week-14-goff-stumbles-bears,

 According to ESPN Josh just missed the list of of top 3 QBs    for week 14.  

Thank you for providing

 

Some ppl just will not or dont want to get it.

 

Nobody is saying he does not have work to do......but he is absolutely on par with the other 1st round QBs that were taken ahead of him in this draft and to say otherwise is to just be throwing monkey crap and hope someone says it dont stink.

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3 minutes ago, John from Riverside said:

Thank you for providing

 

Some ppl just will not or dont want to get it.

 

Nobody is saying he does not have work to do......but he is absolutely on par with the other 1st round QBs that were taken ahead of him in this draft and to say otherwise is to just be throwing monkey crap and hope someone says it dont stink.

Correct. 

 

Josh is breaking records almost every week he plays. 

 

One record was hat he was on pace  to have the most sacks.  Other than yesterday that trend was nearly put to bed.  

Darnold had a crap game until late.   

 

Rosen hasn’t been making any headlines at all.  

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Just now, ShadyBillsFan said:

Correct. 

 

Josh is breaking records almost every week he plays. 

 

One record was hat he was on pace  to have the most sacks.  Other than yesterday that trend was nearly put to bed.  

I have honestly expected him to have more....the amount of would be sacks that he breaks away from is unreal

 

TT was slippery.......Josh flat breaks arm/leg tackles

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14 minutes ago, John from Riverside said:

Thank you for providing

 

Some ppl just will not or dont want to get it.

 

Nobody is saying he does not have work to do......but he is absolutely on par with the other 1st round QBs that were taken ahead of him in this draft and to say otherwise is to just be throwing monkey crap and hope someone says it dont stink.

Your welcome.   When you judge Josh you have to look at his entire body of work and also the talent around him.    Also if you look at his sack totals since he came back from injury it paints a different story. 

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ESPN's QBR is a very debatable stat. but I like that it takes in MANY factors including rushing..... Allen is actually 19th in the NFL in QBR

 

that's fairly impressive given he's a rookie, he's running for his life routinely, and his wr's and te's sorta suck. I don't think he's the best rookie qb, but he's actually got a better QBR than any other rookie qb. I was pleasantly surprised by that.

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2 minutes ago, Stank_Nasty said:

ESPN's QBR is a very debatable stat. but I like that it takes in MANY factors including rushing..... Allen is actually 19th in the NFL in QBR

 

that's fairly impressive given he's a rookie, he's running for his life routinely, and his wr's and te's sorta suck.

Also taking into account  defense is that he's faced and the fact that we're number one at quarterback pressures against., basically quarterback pressure is the Kryptonite of rookie quarterbacks

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10 minutes ago, Comebackkid said:

Also taking into account  defense is that he's faced and the fact that we're number one at quarterback pressures against., basically quarterback pressure is the Kryptonite of rookie quarterbacks

Allen has, by far faced the toughest defenses, by DVOA rankings, of all the rookie QBs.

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Seriously, the detractors that do not realize that over the past weeks the amount of yardage this team has put up on offense, the average yards per play spiking upwards and that the amount of punts per game plummeting over the past few weeks, not to mention all the WOW plays that Josh has brought to this team are burying their heads in the sand.   They have an agenda, most of them can't get over the fact that we didn't select Rosen and are so hell bent on not wanting to accept Josh that they aren't having the opportunity to truly enjoy a QB that is entering into his own.

 

It's been a lot of fun watching Allen over the past few weeks, you can see his star potential written all over him.  He just needs to continue to progress, which I have all the faith in the world that he will do and we need to build a much better line around him and get some weapons that can actually make some plays.  I think if we can adequately address these two areas in the off season I believe that we will become a high flying exciting offense that takes lots of shots down the field.   

 

I honestly believe we have the most exciting QB in the league and I'm stoked to watch him develop.

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37 minutes ago, John from Riverside said:

I have honestly expected him to have more....the amount of would be sacks that he breaks away from is unreal

 

TT was slippery.......Josh flat breaks arm/leg tackles

Lol.  How many TT fans are bashing Josh?  

 

Josh is A far better QB with a much worse Oline 

12 minutes ago, billsfan1959 said:

Allen has, by far faced the toughest defenses, by DVOA rankings, of all the rookie QBs.

Don’t let stats cloud the conversation 

 

;) lol 

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3 hours ago, TaskersGhost said:

 

From a passing perspective he sure didn't look like anything close to a top-10 pick.  He had a good rushing game yesterday, passing was horrible yesterday.  Horrible.  Mayfield, Jackson, Darnol, and Rosen all had better passing games this week, I don't hear anyone talking about Rosen, Jackson, or Darnold like they're talking about Allen.  

 

Question for you:  which do you think is more pertinent to his future as a franchise QB?  A, his passing game, or B, his rushing game?  

 

He went 18 of 36, 206 yards, 0 TDs, 2 INTs, 3 sacks, and a rating of 44.4  this week?  Darnold with no more talent to work with than Allen for the most part, come to Rich and posted 16 of 24 for 170, 1 TD, 1 INT, no sacks, and a rating of 83.7 against what many claim here is a #1 D.  The Jets have a horrible D.  We supposedly have a good one if yards allowed are the only measure, and despite for example that we're at or near DFL in the NFL in red zone D.  

 

But A, he's not, cannot, nor should not, run for 100 (or so, before we get hung up on the number) be the team's leading rusher.  Every fool knows that and McD has even said as much.  

 

My point all along is that if he's going to become a "franchise QB," it's NOT going to be because he can run the ball. 

 

Do you agree or disagree with that?  

 

Let me put it another way, that if he IS going to become a franchise QB, then it'll be because he's above-average in the passing game, particularly  the short-medium game.  

 

How do we know this?  Because there isn't one QB in the history of the modern NFL that is a franchise QB based upon his rushing.  Furthermore, all that a rushing QB translates to is poor planning for having a decent rushing game.  I took heat last year, in the few posts I made, suggesting that Shady was or would be near finished and that trading him prior to this season would have been wise.  Well, here we are.  Poor planning, again, in yet another form by McBeane.  The question really is, why does Allen need to run so much?  Answer, because the rushing game sucks moose balls.  Why does it suck moose balls?  I'll leave that one for you to piece together.  

 

Over the past there games he's been at 100+ rushing (back below against the Jags after a kneel-down) in each of those three games, yet, we're 1-2.   Why?  Does any of it have to do with Allen's passing game?  

 

It wasn't Allen's rushing that won games.  It was his passing, or lack thereof, that cost us games, like yesterday.  Meanwhile, Darnold, whom I have scant hopes for as being a future franchise QB, had a game-winning drive on the road.  Yeah yeah, I know, we were only in it because Allen was a one-man show, true, but no matter how you slice it, his passing game was terrible.  As I said, the reason why he is and has to run so much is because of other issues related to poor team-building and poor planning by McBeane.  There's nothing that I can do to convince you of that, you'll either realize it or you won't.  

 

I mean seriously, are you going to accept 50% passsing, 0 TDs and 2 bad INTs every week?  Are you?  If he cannot begin at least throwing more TDs than INTs are you still going to suggest that he'll be a franchise QB?  

 

Over his last three games he's 44 for 88 ( perfect 50.0%), for an average of 199 yards, 1 TD, and 1.3 INTs with a rating of in the 60s.  Isn't it his last three games (1-2) that everyone's raving about?  Seriously?  Please tell me that absolutely no one is impressed with his passing.  Factor in that we've averaged a pathetic 20 points-per-game against two of the worst defenses in the league in Miami and the Jets.  Seriously, who's impressed by this?   And both times in losses.  I know that people are impressed, buy why?  Rushing?  Seriously?  

 

And look, I agree, the rushing in isolation is indeed impressive, it's fun to watch, frankly there's not much other reason to even watch the games, but to use that as an indicator as to whether or not he'll ever become a franchise QB is absurd.  That'll never hinge upon his rushing, it'll always come back to how good of a passer he is, and right now he's not good at passing.  

 

As to Allen, as of now he's a one-read QB whose completion % (after his return from injury, so I'm leaving out his worst games) is a perfect 50%, worse than Rosen, Darnold, Jackson, and Mayfield, and that includes those players' entire seasons, so frankly, it's not even an apples-to-apples comparison in Allen's favor.  

 

I have no idea why anyone is arguing this point.  If Allen does not move on from being a 50% completion passer that can pitch on a pace for more than 16 TDs/20 INTs season, for a below 7 YPA (post injury), sorry, but he's not going to become a franchise QB, I don't care if he does run for 1,000 yards/season.  And frankly, I'll be not only surprised, but shocked if he makes it three more years running like that w/o sustaining a very serious injury.  Anyone that can't see that simply doesn't know football.  He got beat up yesterday as it was and there were at least a couple of instances where he could have been seriously hurt.  

 

Otherwise, he ranks worse than Darnold (who just outplayed him, on the road, against a better D, and whose team is not better than Allen's), Rosen (whose team one of the few that is arguably worse than Allen's), Jackson's (also whose team is not notably better), and Mayfield (whose team was 0-16 last season) in just about every relevant statistical indicator out there.  

 

I'll leave out yards because he's been hurt, but he's worse in YPA, rating, Compl. %, TD/INT, and sack % (despite his mobility), and his short-medium pass numbers are bottom-dwelling.  

 

If that doesn't improve, do you expect him to continue to be our franchise QB?  I don't.  WAY too much is being made of his mobility and rushing, which will be short-lived if it continues, I'd put big money on it.  Sorry, but there's not nor ever has been a QB in the modern era that has had such numbers that became a franchise QB, so those WILL HAVE TO IMPROVE if he's to become one.  His rushing isn't going to matter.  It's great for a dual threat, but if it's not part of a DUAL threat, then it's all but irrelevant in the modern NFL. 

 

And by the way, here's something else to chew on, his sack rate is currently one sack every 9.7 attempts, which is horrid.  To add some perspective, Mayfield's sack rate is one sack every 17.3;  Darnold's is 15.9;  Rosen's is 11.8; Jackson's is 11.1.   I mean has anyone even looked at this?  That's Bledsoe-esque.  Actually it's even worse, Bledsoe's career was 15.4.  And frankly, the last threer games against Jax, Miami, and the Jets, which rank 28th, 31st, and 25th in generating sacks, actually pushed that rate up significantly.  

 

What it suggests, and confirms amidst other data, is that Allen struggle to read defenses.  Again, name one QB that can't read Ds with the best of them that is a franchise QB.  There aren't any.  

 

[Disclaimer:  there's ABSOLUTELY NOTHING  in the above post that suggests whether or not he'll improve!  It's purely an analysis as to where he is now .  I have absolutely no idea whether he'll improve and if you're honest you'll say the same thing.]  

 

tl;dr

 

im going to use 25 paragraphs to deny what’s going on on the field and adhere to my preconceived ideas.

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3 hours ago, TaskersGhost said:

 

From a passing perspective he sure didn't look like anything close to a top-10 pick.  He had a good rushing game yesterday, passing was horrible yesterday.  Horrible.  Mayfield, Jackson, Darnol, and Rosen all had better passing games this week, I don't hear anyone talking about Rosen, Jackson, or Darnold like they're talking about Allen.  

 

Question for you:  which do you think is more pertinent to his future as a franchise QB?  A, his passing game, or B, his rushing game?  

 

He went 18 of 36, 206 yards, 0 TDs, 2 INTs, 3 sacks, and a rating of 44.4  this week?  Darnold with no more talent to work with than Allen for the most part, come to Rich and posted 16 of 24 for 170, 1 TD, 1 INT, no sacks, and a rating of 83.7 against what many claim here is a #1 D.  The Jets have a horrible D.  We supposedly have a good one if yards allowed are the only measure, and despite for example that we're at or near DFL in the NFL in red zone D.  

 

But A, he's not, cannot, nor should not, run for 100 (or so, before we get hung up on the number) be the team's leading rusher.  Every fool knows that and McD has even said as much.  

 

My point all along is that if he's going to become a "franchise QB," it's NOT going to be because he can run the ball. 

 

Do you agree or disagree with that?  

 

Let me put it another way, that if he IS going to become a franchise QB, then it'll be because he's above-average in the passing game, particularly  the short-medium game.  

 

How do we know this?  Because there isn't one QB in the history of the modern NFL that is a franchise QB based upon his rushing.  Furthermore, all that a rushing QB translates to is poor planning for having a decent rushing game.  I took heat last year, in the few posts I made, suggesting that Shady was or would be near finished and that trading him prior to this season would have been wise.  Well, here we are.  Poor planning, again, in yet another form by McBeane.  The question really is, why does Allen need to run so much?  Answer, because the rushing game sucks moose balls.  Why does it suck moose balls?  I'll leave that one for you to piece together.  

 

Over the past there games he's been at 100+ rushing (back below against the Jags after a kneel-down) in each of those three games, yet, we're 1-2.   Why?  Does any of it have to do with Allen's passing game?  

 

It wasn't Allen's rushing that won games.  It was his passing, or lack thereof, that cost us games, like yesterday.  Meanwhile, Darnold, whom I have scant hopes for as being a future franchise QB, had a game-winning drive on the road.  Yeah yeah, I know, we were only in it because Allen was a one-man show, true, but no matter how you slice it, his passing game was terrible.  As I said, the reason why he is and has to run so much is because of other issues related to poor team-building and poor planning by McBeane.  There's nothing that I can do to convince you of that, you'll either realize it or you won't.  

 

I mean seriously, are you going to accept 50% passsing, 0 TDs and 2 bad INTs every week?  Are you?  If he cannot begin at least throwing more TDs than INTs are you still going to suggest that he'll be a franchise QB?  

 

Over his last three games he's 44 for 88 ( perfect 50.0%), for an average of 199 yards, 1 TD, and 1.3 INTs with a rating of in the 60s.  Isn't it his last three games (1-2) that everyone's raving about?  Seriously?  Please tell me that absolutely no one is impressed with his passing.  Factor in that we've averaged a pathetic 20 points-per-game against two of the worst defenses in the league in Miami and the Jets.  Seriously, who's impressed by this?   And both times in losses.  I know that people are impressed, buy why?  Rushing?  Seriously?  

 

And look, I agree, the rushing in isolation is indeed impressive, it's fun to watch, frankly there's not much other reason to even watch the games, but to use that as an indicator as to whether or not he'll ever become a franchise QB is absurd.  That'll never hinge upon his rushing, it'll always come back to how good of a passer he is, and right now he's not good at passing.  

 

As to Allen, as of now he's a one-read QB whose completion % (after his return from injury, so I'm leaving out his worst games) is a perfect 50%, worse than Rosen, Darnold, Jackson, and Mayfield, and that includes those players' entire seasons, so frankly, it's not even an apples-to-apples comparison in Allen's favor.  

 

I have no idea why anyone is arguing this point.  If Allen does not move on from being a 50% completion passer that can pitch on a pace for more than 16 TDs/20 INTs season, for a below 7 YPA (post injury), sorry, but he's not going to become a franchise QB, I don't care if he does run for 1,000 yards/season.  And frankly, I'll be not only surprised, but shocked if he makes it three more years running like that w/o sustaining a very serious injury.  Anyone that can't see that simply doesn't know football.  He got beat up yesterday as it was and there were at least a couple of instances where he could have been seriously hurt.  

 

Otherwise, he ranks worse than Darnold (who just outplayed him, on the road, against a better D, and whose team is not better than Allen's), Rosen (whose team one of the few that is arguably worse than Allen's), Jackson's (also whose team is not notably better), and Mayfield (whose team was 0-16 last season) in just about every relevant statistical indicator out there.  

 

I'll leave out yards because he's been hurt, but he's worse in YPA, rating, Compl. %, TD/INT, and sack % (despite his mobility), and his short-medium pass numbers are bottom-dwelling.  

 

If that doesn't improve, do you expect him to continue to be our franchise QB?  I don't.  WAY too much is being made of his mobility and rushing, which will be short-lived if it continues, I'd put big money on it.  Sorry, but there's not nor ever has been a QB in the modern era that has had such numbers that became a franchise QB, so those WILL HAVE TO IMPROVE if he's to become one.  His rushing isn't going to matter.  It's great for a dual threat, but if it's not part of a DUAL threat, then it's all but irrelevant in the modern NFL. 

 

And by the way, here's something else to chew on, his sack rate is currently one sack every 9.7 attempts, which is horrid.  To add some perspective, Mayfield's sack rate is one sack every 17.3;  Darnold's is 15.9;  Rosen's is 11.8; Jackson's is 11.1.   I mean has anyone even looked at this?  That's Bledsoe-esque.  Actually it's even worse, Bledsoe's career was 15.4.  And frankly, the last threer games against Jax, Miami, and the Jets, which rank 28th, 31st, and 25th in generating sacks, actually pushed that rate up significantly.  

 

What it suggests, and confirms amidst other data, is that Allen struggle to read defenses.  Again, name one QB that can't read Ds with the best of them that is a franchise QB.  There aren't any.  

 

[Disclaimer:  there's ABSOLUTELY NOTHING  in the above post that suggests whether or not he'll improve!  It's purely an analysis as to where he is now .  I have absolutely no idea whether he'll improve and if you're honest you'll say the same thing.]  

 

LOL

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6 hours ago, TaskersGhost said:

 

From a passing perspective he sure didn't look like anything close to a top-10 pick.  He had a good rushing game yesterday, passing was horrible yesterday.  Horrible.  Mayfield, Jackson, Darnol, and Rosen all had better passing games this week, I don't hear anyone talking about Rosen, Jackson, or Darnold like they're talking about Allen.  

 

Question for you:  which do you think is more pertinent to his future as a franchise QB?  A, his passing game, or B, his rushing game?  

 

He went 18 of 36, 206 yards, 0 TDs, 2 INTs, 3 sacks, and a rating of 44.4  this week?  Darnold with no more talent to work with than Allen for the most part, come to Rich and posted 16 of 24 for 170, 1 TD, 1 INT, no sacks, and a rating of 83.7 against what many claim here is a #1 D.  The Jets have a horrible D.  We supposedly have a good one if yards allowed are the only measure, and despite for example that we're at or near DFL in the NFL in red zone D.  

 

But A, he's not, cannot, nor should not, run for 100 (or so, before we get hung up on the number) be the team's leading rusher.  Every fool knows that and McD has even said as much.  

 

My point all along is that if he's going to become a "franchise QB," it's NOT going to be because he can run the ball. 

 

Do you agree or disagree with that?  

 

Let me put it another way, that if he IS going to become a franchise QB, then it'll be because he's above-average in the passing game, particularly  the short-medium game.  

 

How do we know this?  Because there isn't one QB in the history of the modern NFL that is a franchise QB based upon his rushing.  Furthermore, all that a rushing QB translates to is poor planning for having a decent rushing game.  I took heat last year, in the few posts I made, suggesting that Shady was or would be near finished and that trading him prior to this season would have been wise.  Well, here we are.  Poor planning, again, in yet another form by McBeane.  The question really is, why does Allen need to run so much?  Answer, because the rushing game sucks moose balls.  Why does it suck moose balls?  I'll leave that one for you to piece together.  

 

Over the past there games he's been at 100+ rushing (back below against the Jags after a kneel-down) in each of those three games, yet, we're 1-2.   Why?  Does any of it have to do with Allen's passing game?  

 

It wasn't Allen's rushing that won games.  It was his passing, or lack thereof, that cost us games, like yesterday.  Meanwhile, Darnold, whom I have scant hopes for as being a future franchise QB, had a game-winning drive on the road.  Yeah yeah, I know, we were only in it because Allen was a one-man show, true, but no matter how you slice it, his passing game was terrible.  As I said, the reason why he is and has to run so much is because of other issues related to poor team-building and poor planning by McBeane.  There's nothing that I can do to convince you of that, you'll either realize it or you won't.  

 

I mean seriously, are you going to accept 50% passsing, 0 TDs and 2 bad INTs every week?  Are you?  If he cannot begin at least throwing more TDs than INTs are you still going to suggest that he'll be a franchise QB?  

 

Over his last three games he's 44 for 88 ( perfect 50.0%), for an average of 199 yards, 1 TD, and 1.3 INTs with a rating of in the 60s.  Isn't it his last three games (1-2) that everyone's raving about?  Seriously?  Please tell me that absolutely no one is impressed with his passing.  Factor in that we've averaged a pathetic 20 points-per-game against two of the worst defenses in the league in Miami and the Jets.  Seriously, who's impressed by this?   And both times in losses.  I know that people are impressed, buy why?  Rushing?  Seriously?  

 

And look, I agree, the rushing in isolation is indeed impressive, it's fun to watch, frankly there's not much other reason to even watch the games, but to use that as an indicator as to whether or not he'll ever become a franchise QB is absurd.  That'll never hinge upon his rushing, it'll always come back to how good of a passer he is, and right now he's not good at passing.  

 

As to Allen, as of now he's a one-read QB whose completion % (after his return from injury, so I'm leaving out his worst games) is a perfect 50%, worse than Rosen, Darnold, Jackson, and Mayfield, and that includes those players' entire seasons, so frankly, it's not even an apples-to-apples comparison in Allen's favor.  

 

I have no idea why anyone is arguing this point.  If Allen does not move on from being a 50% completion passer that can pitch on a pace for more than 16 TDs/20 INTs season, for a below 7 YPA (post injury), sorry, but he's not going to become a franchise QB, I don't care if he does run for 1,000 yards/season.  And frankly, I'll be not only surprised, but shocked if he makes it three more years running like that w/o sustaining a very serious injury.  Anyone that can't see that simply doesn't know football.  He got beat up yesterday as it was and there were at least a couple of instances where he could have been seriously hurt.  

 

Otherwise, he ranks worse than Darnold (who just outplayed him, on the road, against a better D, and whose team is not better than Allen's), Rosen (whose team one of the few that is arguably worse than Allen's), Jackson's (also whose team is not notably better), and Mayfield (whose team was 0-16 last season) in just about every relevant statistical indicator out there.  

 

I'll leave out yards because he's been hurt, but he's worse in YPA, rating, Compl. %, TD/INT, and sack % (despite his mobility), and his short-medium pass numbers are bottom-dwelling.  

 

If that doesn't improve, do you expect him to continue to be our franchise QB?  I don't.  WAY too much is being made of his mobility and rushing, which will be short-lived if it continues, I'd put big money on it.  Sorry, but there's not nor ever has been a QB in the modern era that has had such numbers that became a franchise QB, so those WILL HAVE TO IMPROVE if he's to become one.  His rushing isn't going to matter.  It's great for a dual threat, but if it's not part of a DUAL threat, then it's all but irrelevant in the modern NFL. 

 

And by the way, here's something else to chew on, his sack rate is currently one sack every 9.7 attempts, which is horrid.  To add some perspective, Mayfield's sack rate is one sack every 17.3;  Darnold's is 15.9;  Rosen's is 11.8; Jackson's is 11.1.   I mean has anyone even looked at this?  That's Bledsoe-esque.  Actually it's even worse, Bledsoe's career was 15.4.  And frankly, the last threer games against Jax, Miami, and the Jets, which rank 28th, 31st, and 25th in generating sacks, actually pushed that rate up significantly.  

 

What it suggests, and confirms amidst other data, is that Allen struggle to read defenses.  Again, name one QB that can't read Ds with the best of them that is a franchise QB.  There aren't any.  

 

[Disclaimer:  there's ABSOLUTELY NOTHING  in the above post that suggests whether or not he'll improve!  It's purely an analysis as to where he is now .  I have absolutely no idea whether he'll improve and if you're honest you'll say the same thing.]  

 

This is a joke, right? You are really funny. .... The only person taking you seriously is you.

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Looking at ESPN's QBR, Allen has a 57.1 rating, just behind Cam Newton (59.8) and Aaron Rodgers (57.4) and ahead of Prescott (53.8) Mayfield (51.3),  Darnold (34.4) and Rosen (30.5). I agree that he needs to improve his passing, especially when to run vs. pass, how to use a lower velocity when needed, and when to throw the ball away instead of trying to make a hero pass. 

 

Subjectively, Allen has been the most entertaining QB to watch since the early Flutie days for me. I like you that on any given play Allen can beat you with a long pass or a long run and prefer to see him throw some bad interceptions rather that always being captain check-down. I hope that Allen continues to learn and gets better talent around him next year. Honestly, I don't care much if they win or lose games like the Jets game since we are out of the playoffs. If we win, great for the team. If we lose, we get better draft choices. I just want to see the Bills develop Josh and the rest of the team for next year

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27 minutes ago, kevnallen said:

Looking at ESPN's QBR, Allen has a 57.1 rating, just behind Cam Newton (59.8) and Aaron Rodgers (57.4) and ahead of Prescott (53.8) Mayfield (51.3),  Darnold (34.4) and Rosen (30.5). I agree that he needs to improve his passing, especially when to run vs. pass, how to use a lower velocity when needed, and when to throw the ball away instead of trying to make a hero pass. 

 

Subjectively, Allen has been the most entertaining QB to watch since the early Flutie days for me. I like you that on any given play Allen can beat you with a long pass or a long run and prefer to see him throw some bad interceptions rather that always being captain check-down. I hope that Allen continues to learn and gets better talent around him next year. Honestly, I don't care much if they win or lose games like the Jets game since we are out of the playoffs. If we win, great for the team. If we lose, we get better draft choices. I just want to see the Bills develop Josh and the rest of the team for next year

 

Beware the preemptive "QBR is a joke" responses...but that said, it is the one "ranking" that at least tries to incorporate a QB's entire game and not just his passing prowess.  There's no question Josh needs to improve in that area, and I think he will with a better OL and surrounding cast of skill players.  It is indisputable, however, that over the last three games Allen has almost singlehandedly given the Bills a chance to win, and that's what being a "total" QB is all about.

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2 hours ago, eball said:

 

Beware the preemptive "QBR is a joke" responses...but that said, it is the one "ranking" that at least tries to incorporate a QB's entire game and not just his passing prowess.  There's no question Josh needs to improve in that area, and I think he will with a better OL and surrounding cast of skill players.  It is indisputable, however, that over the last three games Allen has almost singlehandedly given the Bills a chance to win, and that's what being a "total" QB is all about.

Stats ...  if they are not used correctly, they paint the wrong picture. 

 

Why ESPN felt special enough to invent their own rankings ....  Attention whoores 

:o:lol:

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2 hours ago, eball said:

 

Beware the preemptive "QBR is a joke" responses...but that said, it is the one "ranking" that at least tries to incorporate a QB's entire game and not just his passing prowess.  There's no question Josh needs to improve in that area, and I think he will with a better OL and surrounding cast of skill players.  It is indisputable, however, that over the last three games Allen has almost singlehandedly given the Bills a chance to win, and that's what being a "total" QB is all about.

The bolded.... simple as that. 

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On 12/3/2018 at 2:51 PM, TaskersGhost said:

 

OK, great then, so we can get the "rushing's going bail him out" out of the picture then, right?  ... for purposes of discussion that is?  Or not?  

 

Secondly, I don't believe that I ever said anything about anyone's first season.  I DID SAY, again, go re-read it, that if Allner WERE EVER TO become a franchise QB that he'd have to vastly improve his short-medium game. 

 

Not sure what that has to do with anyone's (Newton's, Wilson's, etc.) "starting out" since both have far better short-medium passing games than Allen presently has despite the nothing that whether Newton is a franchise QB or not is entirely debatable.  

 

They both improved in that way to become as good as they are whatever that level  is.  

 

And frankly, look at both of their rookie passing splits, BOTH were signifcantly better than Allen's.  

 

So I'm not quite sure what your argument is here.  If we're going on directd head-to-head Allen vs. Wilson & Newton in their rookie seasons, then Allen doesn't stack up.  That's pretty much my point, hence my continual statements that if Allen's EVER going to become a franchise QB then that area of his game will need to improve.  

 

Frankly, I can't believe that ANYONE is even arguing that point here yet there are several that are.  That's the simplest of NFL concepts.  

I wonder if it is because you are a condescending douche bag?

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