THE ROCKPILE REVIEW - “Get Aboard the Josh Allen Train”

[dickleyjones]

11 minutes ago, Mickey said:

Brevity. Embrace it.

Why?

[Shaw66]

22 minutes ago, hondo in seattle said:

 

 

I know what you mean - and generally agree - but still feel a need to comment on your last few words.  I think Allen has multiple rookie moments every game.  He doesn't read coverages as effectively or get the ball out as quickly as a good veteran.  He holds onto the ball longer than a good vet because - as a rookie - he needs more time to process.  

You're talking about not doing some things that veterans do, and I agree about that.   I'm talking about mistakes that only rookies make.  Misreading defenses, bad decisions in the pocket, that sort of stuff.  The stuff rookies do that they either outgrow or they go to the bench.  Allen's not having THOSE moments.

 

He's definitely NOT making all the veteran plays we want him to make.  One that I keep thinking about from yesterday is the throw over the middle to Thompson, the one he caught but the defender knocked the ball out.  Great throw, right on the money.  Brady and Rodgers and Brees don't make that throw.   They throw it a little short, a little lower, so the receiver can come back to the ball a bit and run away from the defender a bit.  A slightly lower throw would have allowed Thompson the chance to catch it and prepare for the hit.  I don't expect Allen to make that throw as a rookie, but I expect he will learn.  

[Kelly the Dog]

Nice call on Fournette and Shady. If McCoy got the exact same carries that Fournette had, I think he goes for about 150 and two TDs. 

 

Yes, Shady dances. Yes there are several plays a game he could pick up 2-3 extra yards. But he rarely gets holes. If he got the holes that Fournette did on about 5-6 carries, he's off to the races on 3-5 of them. 

[Tatonka68]

If add the passes dropped and called back because of penalty his stats should be 11-21- 200 yards 1 TD 0 Int and if you subtract his kneel downs at end of game he rushing stats should be 11 rushes for 101 yards and 1 TD. Josh looked great today. The future is bright.

[Jay_Fixit]

It definitely looked as if the 6 week break helped. He seemed calmer and he made throws when it mattered.

 

The three throws that were called back by penalty were great throws. Too bad they didn’t count.

 

His throw to Foster was phenomenal. The catch was great as well but Allen standing in the pocket and getting it off while surrounded by what seemed to be everyone on the field, was a thing of beauty. .01 of a second later and that’s a fumble.

 

Allen has a ways to go to fully gain my trust but I can see progress and that’s really important. It was nice to see him back.

[HappyDays]

Not enough credit is being given to Allen for 0 sacks and 0 turnovers. Against a defense like Jacksonville that thrives on big plays that was huge. Crazy impressive for a rookie who played at Wyoming and struggled with interceptions there. The turnover differential decided the game yesterday, as it often does.

Edited November 26, 2018 by HappyDays

[Shaw66]

9 minutes ago, Kelly the Dog said:

Nice call on Fournette and Shady. If McCoy got the exact same carries that Fournette had, I think he goes for about 150 and two TDs. 

 

Yes, Shady dances. Yes there are several plays a game he could pick up 2-3 extra yards. But he rarely gets holes. If he got the holes that Fournette did on about 5-6 carries, he's off to the races on 3-5 of them. 

Watching him yesterday I figured out for the first time that Shady doesn't dance.  Shady waits, like LeVeon Bell waits.   But while Shady waits he's pumping his feet so when he decides where he's going he's ready to make the cut.   That is, he doesn't dance out of indecision.   He's just waiting.  And when he realizes there's no place for him to break free, he moves forward to get what he can get.   

 

He's getting no opportunities.   Now, Ivory runs with a different style and had more success yesterday, because he just takes off for the hole and makes the most of it, breaking a tackle here and there.   Ivory's not going to get the big plays we all know Shady is capable of of.  

[Kelly the Dog]

1 minute ago, Shaw66 said:

Watching him yesterday I figured out for the first time that Shady doesn't dance.  Shady waits, like LeVeon Bell waits.   But while Shady waits he's pumping his feet so when he decides where he's going he's ready to make the cut.   That is, he doesn't dance out of indecision.   He's just waiting.  And when he realizes there's no place for him to break free, he moves forward to get what he can get.   

 

He's getting no opportunities.   Now, Ivory runs with a different style and had more success yesterday, because he just takes off for the hole and makes the most of it, breaking a tackle here and there.   Ivory's not going to get the big plays we all know Shady is capable of of.  

Totally agree with that. It's referred to as dancing but it is not the same thing. Plus, on the plays that he does reverse field and make 5-10-20-30 extra yards, people expect him to know the exact time to do it and when not to, which is a ridiculous standard. If he took the 2-3 extra yards on those plays he would have the breakaway runs he has. 

 

He gets terrible blocking for the most part. 

[Warcodered]

10 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

Not enough credit is being given to Allen for 0 sacks and 0 turnovers. Against a defense like Jacksonville that thrives on big plays that was huge. Crazy impressive for a rookie who played at Wyoming and struggled with interceptions there. The turnover differential decided the game yesterday, as it often does.

He's been improving on the INTs he had 1 against the Titans that I don't think was his fault and was still going for 0 against the Texans. I'd thought he'd improved his short throws some but looks like he had some trouble with them again this week. Though that makes some sense to me they were probably more focused on him pushing it with his arm after the injury than a short toss.

[Shaw66]

25 minutes ago, Warcodered said:

He's been improving on the INTs he had 1 against the Titans that I don't think was his fault and was still going for 0 against the Texans. I'd thought he'd improved his short throws some but looks like he had some trouble with them again this week. Though that makes some sense to me they were probably more focused on him pushing it with his arm after the injury than a short toss.

All year he's had trouble with his touch on some of the short throws.  Seems pretty clear to me that with his natural throwing motion gets too much on the ball for short throws, and he hasn't learned yet how to dial it down.   I'd expect that during the off season he'll work on his technique for shorter throws.   

[WhoTom]

1 hour ago, Mickey said:

Brevity. Embrace it.

 

This isn't Twitter. Some thoughts exceed 280 characters.

 

 

[LABILLBACKER]

Good assessment Shaw. Let me just say we don't have a playoff worthy Oline yet. Josh seems to be on a nice pace of improvement. We have to slowly increase his pitch count by letting him throw more. All the passes on the tree. He needs to make 25-30 attempts. If wrs like Deonte & Zay are his future than start throwing to them. Josh also desperately needs that security blanket TE drafted in April. It was a very encouraging game against a top 4 defense. Stay the Course!

[NickelCity]

1 hour ago, Mickey said:

Brevity. Embrace it.

 

Heck no. I look forward to these write ups. Keep it up Shaw.  

[Shaw66]

16 minutes ago, LABILLBACKER said:

Good assessment Shaw. Let me just say we don't have a playoff worthy Oline yet. Josh seems to be on a nice pace of improvement. We have to slowly increase his pitch count by letting him throw more. All the passes on the tree. He needs to make 25-30 attempts. If wrs like Deonte & Zay are his future than start throwing to them. Josh also desperately needs that security blanket TE drafted in April. It was a very encouraging game against a top 4 defense. Stay the Course!

The Bills TRIED to give him 25 attempts yesterday.  Between the throws he had that were called back and the passing plays where he ended up scrambling, he would have had 25.  

6 minutes ago, NickelCity said:

 

Heck no. I look forward to these write ups. Keep it up Shaw.  

Thanks.

 

Reading.  Embrace it. 

[Kelly the Dog]

1 minute ago, Shaw66 said:

The Bills TRIED to give him 25 attempts yesterday.  Between the throws he had that were called back and the passing plays where he ended up scrambling, he would have had 25.  

Yup. Plus when you are playing against a team that racks up 220 yards rushing your own offense loses about 2-3 possessions, which would easily be 5+ additional attempts.  

[Lieutenant Aldo Raine]

Good write up.  Thing to remember is, the kid is raw and his potential is truly untapped - which was to be expected.  Imagine where he can be with a whole offseason of studying defenses and improved weapons.  The future looks extremely bright.  

[Shaw66]

27 minutes ago, Kelly the Dog said:

Yup. Plus when you are playing against a team that racks up 220 yards rushing your own offense loses about 2-3 possessions, which would easily be 5+ additional attempts.  

A good.

 

The coaches aren't stupid.  They know what they have.   With Peterman playing, yeah, they were desperate to run the ball.  They aren't so desperate now.   It wasn't an accident that the speed receivers - Foster, McKenzie and Thompson, and Croom at tight end - were on the field so much.   The coaches know that with Allen on the field, if receivers can get open, they're going to get the ball.  

 

 

 

OOH, OOH, OOH!!!    One more thing I forgot to say.   

 

How cool was the jet sweep touchdown run by McKenzie, when he got to the edge and it was clear he could sprint to the corner without help, and the two receivers out there each cut down their men simultaneously!!!?!?  It looked like a choreographed bowling trick shot, taking down the 7-10 with two balls.   Talk about execution.   

Edited November 26, 2018 by Shaw66

[Kelly the Dog]

2 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

A good.

 

The coaches aren't stupid.  They know what they have.   With Peterman playing, yeah, they were desperate to run the ball.  They aren't so desperate now.   It wasn't an accident that the speed receivers - Foster, McKenzie and Thompson, and Croom at tight end - were on the field so much.   The coaches know that with Allen on the field, if receivers can get open, they're going to get the ball.  

People are hung up on the 8-19 stat. You and others pointed out that the stat was misleading. But even if you took his raw stats and looked at them a different way, he averaged 20 yards a completion, which is off the charts, and averaged 8.4 average per attempt, which would be seventh in the league. 

[Shaw66]

3 minutes ago, Kelly the Dog said:

People are hung up on the 8-19 stat. You and others pointed out that the stat was misleading. But even if you took his raw stats and looked at them a different way, he averaged 20 yards a completion, which is off the charts, and averaged 8.4 average per attempt, which would be seventh in the league. 

You're right.   But the national media will stop their analysis at 8 for 19 and a passer rating under 90.   

 

I realize now that yesterday I was sitting just wanting the defense to hurry up and get the ball back to Allen.   Earlier this season I'd be hoping for a pick 6, because it was the only we'd score.  

[Buddo]

As regards Allen's rushing in this game, apart from it being impressive, I think it was, in part, by design. I think his options often included the possibilty there would be running room available, as I think they identified weakness in the Jags contain.

 

I'm not talking about when he stepped up through the pocket into space, but on a number of his runs that got us another set of downs, he always semed to have room available.

 

As to the TD pass to Foster, it's one of the best I've ever seen tbh. Not only was I surprised it came out from under the Jags whole D line (it seemed like), but that it did so and absolutely on the money, was a thing of beauty. Somewhere on MMQB, Benoit says that he thinks it's the best TD pass he's seen this season, due to the duress he was under, and I'm not going to disagree, for sure.

 

It's about time the Bills stood up for themselves. The fact that it got Fournette ejected, was simply a bonus. I think they had decided to stack the box before it all kicked off, and his numbers were down. It may even be that he was frustrated by that, as well as being an idiot. At least it showed an adjustement to the defensive front that might have been working.

 

I liked McDermotts comments about Lawson not being blamed for defending a teammate, especially as it appeared he didn't even think twice about saying it.

 

While we complain bitterly about the penalties, sometimes you have to just say it's because we aren't talented enough to compete fairly. While 'Disney' Coleman is one of the premier buffoons of Zebradom, his crew got some fairly important calls right, including those 2 consecutive passing plays Allen made beautifully, only to be called back.

 

Progress has been being made, but it could still become of the '2 steps forward, one step back variety.' There are further bumps ion the road, I'm sure. One thing that Allen doesn't lack is the moxy to just go for it - as evidenced by the TD throw to Foster, and deciding to truck over the defender when getting his rushing TD - I bet Kelly was loving that one.

 

I think we need some more patience with the kid, until the game slows down more for him, so he can make more adjustments, and get through all of his reads, as I think the options become ar greater then, with his arm. He just needs to see it, because if he sees it, he slings it.