LSHMEAB Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 46 minutes ago, longtimebillsfan said: You make a lot of assumptions about Allen's development. You realize that your assumptions are your opinion and not fact, right? If you look back to Jared Goff 's rookie year, many were declaring him a bust. We see how that turned out. I believe Allen will be the qb we need. The Bills are right on schedule for following the NFL trend of which you spoke. But thank you for your attempt to ***** defeat out of the jaws of victory. It's kind of funny that the particular s word you used is censored. I would venture a guess that it's used appropriately 90 percent of the time. 5 minutes ago, Ed_Formerly_of_Roch said: And they didn't really stack their offense until after their rookie season. So if he had selected a different coach/GM the results would have been different? For the most part about 30% of QB's elevate to franchise level so if Allen flames out, the only thing you can say about McD and Beane is welcome to the club. My point was had they gone the normal route and fired Whaley well before the draft, we may have taken a quarterback. And it's possible that the 17 draft was grossly underrated and the 18 draft was grossly overrated. Time will tell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
without a drought Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 When did they legalize the forward pass? You have to be able to run the ball in Buffalo with the weather. Defense wins championships. It's kind of dark under this rock. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rochesterfan Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 2 hours ago, Rebel101 said: The new trend in the NFL, and recipe for success. Is to stack your roster around a competent rookie QB. It allows you to spend money on key pieces and spread the wealth throughout the roster while your QB is in a rookie contract. It is clearly a new formula that has worked good for the teams who’s rookie QB has played well. We have wasted atleast a year or 2 of these prime years due to the fact that Allen is so raw. He won’t be ready to lead this team to a super bowl until his rookie contract is up and if he does become great his contract will then end up taking up the money needed to build such a stacked roster. Not saying we can’t end up building a young team through the draft but we lost the opportunity to follow the trend of a lot of successful teams. You are confusing your opinion with what is happening. Chicago/LA Rams - the QBs played their rookie years with subpar offensive talent. They both struggled badly in their rookie year. Year 2 they began amassing offensive talent. Year 3 the Rams went after a ton of defensive help because their offense got them to the playoffs and then knocked right out. KC - they amassed the talent for Alex Smith and then after sitting a year (so again year 2 for Mahomes) they let him play. Cleveland, NY, and Arizona all drafted QBs and do not have a ton of talent around them. Cleveland might have the most, but they have chosen to allow multiple 1st round WRs leave during this season and over paid for Landry and his production. The Bills drafted their QB and will be amassing the offensive talent in year 2 just like all of the other teams with their rookie QB. They have wasted nothing that every other team with a young QB is not going through. The issue is your opinion that he won’t be ready until year 5 to lead the team when he has been just as good or better than Darnold and Rosen and was on par with Mayfield before the injury. Mayfield has pulled away the last couple of weeks. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
row_33 Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 2 hours ago, MJS said: That's nothing new. Been the plan since 1982 in the NfL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 There should be a thread about this.... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PittsforDave Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 It’s all about 2020!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoHuddleKelly12 Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 1 hour ago, Rochesterfan said: You are confusing your opinion with what is happening. Chicago/LA Rams - the QBs played their rookie years with subpar offensive talent. They both struggled badly in their rookie year. Year 2 they began amassing offensive talent. Year 3 the Rams went after a ton of defensive help because their offense got them to the playoffs and then knocked right out. KC - they amassed the talent for Alex Smith and then after sitting a year (so again year 2 for Mahomes) they let him play. Cleveland, NY, and Arizona all drafted QBs and do not have a ton of talent around them. Cleveland might have the most, but they have chosen to allow multiple 1st round WRs leave during this season and over paid for Landry and his production. The Bills drafted their QB and will be amassing the offensive talent in year 2 just like all of the other teams with their rookie QB. They have wasted nothing that every other team with a young QB is not going through. The issue is your opinion that he won’t be ready until year 5 to lead the team when he has been just as good or better than Darnold and Rosen and was on par with Mayfield before the injury. Mayfield has pulled away the last couple of weeks. ^^^^^^This. Also, total side note @Rochesterfan I love the avatar pic, that’s Conlan rocking the fly ‘91 bold zebra duds right? Always wanted some like those as a young Bills fan but never got them—but now not even nostalgia could get me in them willingly ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thurman#1 Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 4 hours ago, Rebel101 said: The new trend in the NFL, and recipe for success. Is to stack your roster around a competent rookie QB. It allows you to spend money on key pieces and spread the wealth throughout the roster while your QB is in a rookie contract. It is clearly a new formula that has worked good for the teams who’s rookie QB has played well. We have wasted atleast a year or 2 of these prime years due to the fact that Allen is so raw. He won’t be ready to lead this team to a super bowl until his rookie contract is up and if he does become great his contract will then end up taking up the money needed to build such a stacked roster. Not saying we can’t end up building a young team through the draft but we lost the opportunity to follow the trend of a lot of successful teams. If you mean a rookie QB, how well has that worked? The last bunch of rookie QBs have produced very few wins, going back to Russell Wilson who did very well. If you mean a QB on a rookie contract, we haven't lost that chance at all. We've got several more years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr.Sack Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 It’s only a trend because the NFL is turning over all QBs born 1977-1988 and replacing them with a bunch of guys 25 and under. In the next next 3 seasons 5 current starters and HOF caliber QBs will be gone: Brady, Brees, E Manning, Rivers & Big Ben. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alphadawg7 Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 How the hell did this stupid thread make it to two pages? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rochesterfan Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 1 hour ago, NoHuddleKelly12 said: ^^^^^^This. Also, total side note @Rochesterfan I love the avatar pic, that’s Conlan rocking the fly ‘91 bold zebra duds right? Always wanted some like those as a young Bills fan but never got them—but now not even nostalgia could get me in them willingly ? Yeah 90’s Zubaz on his Proline Card. Loved them. The fashion sure has changed as we age. ? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longtimebillsfan Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 3 hours ago, LSHMEAB said: It's kind of funny that the particular s word you used is censored. I would venture a guess that it's used appropriately 90 percent of the time. My point was had they gone the normal route and fired Whaley well before the draft, we may have taken a quarterback. And it's possible that the 17 draft was grossly underrated and the 18 draft was grossly overrated. Time will tell. That was funny. Talk about taking it out of context. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloBillsGospel Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 5 hours ago, Rebel101 said: The new trend in the NFL, and recipe for success. Is to stack your roster around a competent rookie QB. It allows you to spend money on key pieces and spread the wealth throughout the roster while your QB is in a rookie contract. It is clearly a new formula that has worked good for the teams who’s rookie QB has played well. We have wasted atleast a year or 2 of these prime years due to the fact that Allen is so raw. He won’t be ready to lead this team to a super bowl until his rookie contract is up and if he does become great his contract will then end up taking up the money needed to build such a stacked roster. Not saying we can’t end up building a young team through the draft but we lost the opportunity to follow the trend of a lot of successful teams. Goff and Trubisky were pretty bad in their 1st year, marginal talent on offense but both had good defenses in place...Sound familiar? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProcessTruster Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 10 hours ago, Rebel101 said: The new trend in the NFL, and recipe for success. Is to stack your roster around a competent rookie QB. It allows you to spend money on key pieces and spread the wealth throughout the roster while your QB is in a rookie contract. It is clearly a new formula that has worked good for the teams who’s rookie QB has played well. We have wasted atleast a year or 2 of these prime years due to the fact that Allen is so raw. He won’t be ready to lead this team to a super bowl until his rookie contract is up and if he does become great his contract will then end up taking up the money needed to build such a stacked roster. Not saying we can’t end up building a young team through the draft but we lost the opportunity to follow the trend of a lot of successful teams. Looks like you've already tossed in the towel: "He won’t be ready to lead this team to a super bowl until his rookie contract is up". Do you give up this quickly in most things? Goff looked like sh-t his first year. Mahomes couldn't even get on the field. Trubisky looked like complete, absolute sh-t his first year. Bills fans are just so beat up.... It's understandable I guess, given the sh-t show Ralph put together this millennium. Trust the Process. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed_Formerly_of_Roch Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 11 hours ago, LSHMEAB said: It's kind of funny that the particular s word you used is censored. I would venture a guess that it's used appropriately 90 percent of the time. My point was had they gone the normal route and fired Whaley well before the draft, we may have taken a quarterback. And it's possible that the 17 draft was grossly underrated and the 18 draft was grossly overrated. Time will tell. Yes but if they wanted to hire a GM in January, you're likely limited to those out of work as doubt teams would give up people on their payroll to another team 3 months prior to the draft. That's the reason front office contracts all expire May 1st. From what I've read here, teams are not required to let front office people under contract take jobs with other teams . So now your choice in GM's is pretty much limited to people other teams have fired oh and 80 yo Bill Polien and his useless son. Seems like every year, next years draft class is always better until you get to that point of the draft, then it's not as good. Agree you could be correct about 17 being better than 18, but are you thinking that somehow the one guy we had hired would have known that and instead drafted Mahomes. None of the other teams 1 thru 9 drafted him, nor were the Bills likely flooded with offers, so basically he wasn't that highly valued. So far he's looked great, but Prescotts best season was his rookie year too when teams had no film on him. So I'll wait at least other season or two to see how good he really is and see how well the class of 18 pans out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Allen Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 How many Super Bowls have been won with quarterbacks on their rookie contracts? Since 2000, I see three - Wilson, Roethlisberger and Brady (I'm sure I'll be corrected if I'm wrong). Each of those three weren't just 'competent' rookies, but guys on the road to the Hall of Fame. It's only a trend worth copying if it works. Building around a rookie contract buys you a short window in which you hope to get lucky. The Bills are trying to build a sustainable Super Bowl contender. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luka Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 Rookie QB? Check. $90 million in cap space this coming off season? Check. 10 draft picks ? Check. Top 10 defense? Check. Not sure what part we're behind in? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ctk232 Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 15 hours ago, quinnearlysghost88 said: “Around a competent rookie QB” Mayfield is the highest rated rookie and he’s still ranked 26th in the league. No one is a sure bet competent QB. You act like this is the easy part. You’re literally basing your “trend” off of Mahomes and Goff. Thank you...exceptional success to be sure, but hardly a full league trend at this point. And to OP's point, both Goff and Mahomes didn't start playing this way til their second years, both for different reasons. While that's certainly a formula some teams are trying to follow, typically, when you draft a QB in the first round to try and be your guy for the long term, you follow that formula regardless. It's nothing new and something every team with a rookie QB will do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
row_33 Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 it's great to hop on the winning horse in a given season i bet you can find stats backing up your opinion that 8-1 teams are playing correctly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris66 Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 12 hours ago, BuffaloBillsGospel said: Goff and Trubisky were pretty bad in their 1st year, marginal talent on offense but both had good defenses in place...Sound familiar? And they both ended up firing their coaches to get there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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