Democratic 2020 Presidential Primary Thread

[LSHMEAB]

1 minute ago, TakeYouToTasker said:

 

The problem with "not wanting to show up" is that many would be students in those areas come from a culture which not only doesn't place a premium on education, but in many cases actually lionizes ignorance, taking open pride in what they don't know.

 

There is no amount of glitter and gold on a school house which can replace parents active and involved in a child's education.

 

 

Which is why I didn't dismiss that point out of hand. Fixing a culture that lionizes ignorance is above anyone's pay grade. I have seen improvements in that regard over the past two decades, but it's painfully slow.

 

 

[Deranged Rhino]

[LSHMEAB]

5 minutes ago, keepthefaith said:

 

I don't think you'll find schools in such poor condition kids can't learn well.  I have close friends who are teachers in low income Chicago areas.  The stories they tell are incredible in terms of the total lack of effort and respect shown to teachers by students in these areas.  There are stories every week about this.  We're talking brutal acts of teacher disrespect and near zero effort on the part of many of the students. Where the schools get some share of the blame IMO is due to district-wide policies that won't allow teachers and administrators to discipline the kids or require that homework is done or give them failing grades.  They simply move the kids along from year to year and allow them to behave horribly and rarely with discipline. 

I ref high school basketball games in Las Vegas. There are schools in "NorthTown" that make prisons look like the Ritz.

 

Whether or not structural improvements would lead to better outcomes is debatable.

[keepthefaith]

10 minutes ago, LSHMEAB said:

I ref high school basketball games in Las Vegas. There are schools in "NorthTown" that make prisons look like the Ritz.

 

Whether or not structural improvements would lead to better outcomes is debatable.

 

I really enjoy high school basketball.  You probably see a lot of great games and some really talented kids. 

 

Off topic but I saw a high school game here several years ago that featured Ryan Boatright, Frank Kaminsky, Ben Sobolewski and Bobby Wehrli all in one game - all pro and/or D1 players.  It was quite a show. 

Edited October 19, 2018 by keepthefaith

[boyst]

On 10/18/2018 at 12:47 PM, LSHMEAB said:

This is a post I can respect.

 

I think when you talk about a city like Newark, ANY improvement should be lauded. It's admittedly difficult to pinpoint major initiatives that lead to Newark becoming some kind of utopia.

 

There was the well publicized 100 million dollar investment into education funded by Zuckerberg with the "Foundation for Newark's Future." It lead to improvements in english, but not math. Zuckerberg has publicly lamented the effort, but it was worth a shot. He's also a proponent of school choice and actually worked with Betsy Devos if I remember correctly. I tend to respect pols willing to go against the prevailing winds in their own party.

 

There's the prisoner re-entry program "Newark Now" that helped thousands of ex-offenders reintegrate into society. What's the alternative? Far too many felons can't gain employment and the result is recidivism which could affect YOUR family. 

 

The city's property taxes decreased 13% due to the budget you referenced. Two new hotels were built in downtown Newark for the first time in 40 years! That's just sad actually.

 

For the first time since the 1960's, the population of Newark actually INCREASED during his run as mayor. 

 

Look, Newark is a disgusting place so it's only fair to judge his mayoral tenure on a curve. I tend to think it was positive.

 

 

Uh, the myth felons can't get a job is one of the greatest lies out there, hoss.  The offender training and re-entry ***** is just that. Nothing more than a lip service facility that operates like a job link to send offenders to low income jobs where they have to work to get ahead.

Edited October 19, 2018 by Boyst62

[LSHMEAB]

11 minutes ago, keepthefaith said:

 

I really enjoy high school basketball.  You probably see a lot of great games and some really talented kids. 

 

Off topic but I saw a high school game here several years ago that featured Ryan Boatright, Frank Kaminsky, Ben Sobolewski and Bobby Wehrli all in one game - all pro and/or D1 players.  It was quite a show. 

Also off topic; I'm a die hard Michigan BASKETBALL fan so Frank Kaminsky was naturally one of my least favorite collegiate players of all time.

 

That's a ton of talent on one high school court! Never done a game that would approach that.

[IDBillzFan]

1 hour ago, LSHMEAB said:

I ref high school basketball games in Las Vegas. There are schools in "NorthTown" that make prisons look like the Ritz.

 

Whether or not structural improvements would lead to better outcomes is debatable.

 

Is there air conditioning in the desert summer? Are the bathrooms clean? Are the locker rooms disgusting? Classrooms smelly? Hallways unsafe? Caferia disgusting?

 

All of that plays a role. All of it.

[LSHMEAB]

1 minute ago, LABillzFan said:

 

Is there air conditioning in the desert summer? Are the bathrooms clean? Are the locker rooms disgusting? Classrooms smelly? Hallways unsafe? Caferia disgusting?

 

All of that plays a role. All of it.

They literally couldn't open the schools without air conditioning in May, June, or September, so even the bad ones have that.

 

As far as the other criteria, it's all trash. All of it. While I don't disagree with the premise that parents are failing their kids, I think about those that could possibly thrive if the conditions weren't so bad. 

 

The whole teacher salary argument doesn't appeal to me. You shouldn't go into primary or secondary education if you want to get rich. Classroom size has proven to be a myth. Countries that far outpace us in education don't necessarily have smaller classes.

 

A modest investment in infrastructure seems like a practical one. 

 

 

[IDBillzFan]

4 minutes ago, LSHMEAB said:

A modest investment in infrastructure seems like a practical one. 

 

You're not going to get a modest infrastructure investment until the teacher unions are gone because the unions rule the school.

 

Edited October 19, 2018 by LABillzFan

[TakeYouToTasker]

18 minutes ago, LSHMEAB said:

They literally couldn't open the schools without air conditioning in May, June, or September, so even the bad ones have that.

 

As far as the other criteria, it's all trash. All of it. While I don't disagree with the premise that parents are failing their kids, I think about those that could possibly thrive if the conditions weren't so bad. 

 

The whole teacher salary argument doesn't appeal to me. You shouldn't go into primary or secondary education if you want to get rich. Classroom size has proven to be a myth. Countries that far outpace us in education don't necessarily have smaller classes.

 

A modest investment in infrastructure seems like a practical one. 

 

You don't throw good money after bad.

 

Change the culture surrounding education in these communities so that the overwhelming majority of the parents are involved and clamoring for upgraded infrastructure, and we can have that conversation.

 

Prove to me first that the money won't be wasted.

[Foxx]

1 minute ago, TakeYouToTasker said:

 

You don't throw good money after bad.

 

Change the culture surrounding education in these communities so that the overwhelming majority of the parents are involved and clamoring for upgraded infrastructure, and we can have that conversation.

 

Prove to me first that the money won't be wasted.

hey now... that would be setting precedent for all the other wasteful .gov programs.

can't have that....

[Buffalo_Gal]

Et tu, Spartacus? 
 

You can read it on the google drive. (Does #metoo care about gay men also?)

[Nanker]

On 10/19/2018 at 1:44 PM, LSHMEAB said:

I don't entirely buy that argument, although it has some merit. 

 

Have you been to schools in low income urban areas? The dilapidation alone make it a less than ideal situation for education.

 

I don't blame kids for not wanting to show up.

 

They could at the very least invest in the infrastructure. Maybe they'd be crap again in 10 years, but a just society makes the effort.

One wonders how this nation and indeed the entire western world was able to advance to the greatness that it is when our ancestors had to get their learning from a single teacher in one-room school houses made of non-insulated wooden walls with a pot bellied Franklin stove to keep the students warm in the winter. 

 

***** that entitlement attitude that you can’t learn unless you’re in a Beaux Art palace like the NY Public library. 

 

I went to school in a building that was built by the WPA.  It had radiators for heat and no stalls in the bathrooms. And, we swam in the nude in gym class. (Simmer down Boyst and BLarge) 

 

Suck my nuts if you need a multimillion dollar palace to learn how to succeed in life in America. 

 

Motivation is the critical component to success. 

[keepthefaith]

1 hour ago, Nanker said:

One wonders how this nation and indeed the entire western world was able to advance to the greatness that it is when our ancestors had to get their learning from a single teacher in one-room school houses made of non-insulated wooden walls with a pot bellied Franklin stove to keep the students warm in the winter. 

 

***** that entitlement attitude that you can’t learn unless you’re in a Beaux Art palace like the NY Public library. 

 

I went to school in a building that was built by the WPA.  It had radiators for heat and no stalls in the bathrooms. And, we swam in the nude in gym class. (Simmer down Boyst and BLarge) 

 

Suck my nuts if you need a multimillion dollar palace to learn how to succeed in life in America. 

 

Motivation is the critical component to success. 

 

Yeah we swam nude too.  Was that a Buffalo thing?  I've told many friends not from Buffalo about that and they all think it's pretty ridick-ulous.  Nobody I know not from Buffalo did that. 

[MILFHUNTER#518]

This will be ignored. Supplement to Buffalo_Gals post.

 

https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2018/10/breaking-man-steps-forward-with-sexual-assault-allegations-against-sen-cory-booker-with-lawyer-response-to-gateway-pundit/

 

[Koko78]

21 minutes ago, MILFHUNTER#518 said:

This will be ignored. Supplement to Buffalo_Gals post.

 

https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2018/10/breaking-man-steps-forward-with-sexual-assault-allegations-against-sen-cory-booker-with-lawyer-response-to-gateway-pundit/

 

 

The Democrats will want indisputable physical evidence, backed by an affidavit from God, notarized by Jesus Christ, but only after the existence of God is proven.

[/dev/null]

14 minutes ago, Koko78 said:

 

The Democrats will want indisputable physical evidence, backed by an affidavit from God, notarized by Jesus Christ, but only after the existence of God is proven.

 

Democrats have already set the precedent that accusations matter more than proof.  Accusations like this against a sitting Senator merits an inquiry by the Senate Ethics Committee

 

But don't expect to hear anything soon, too close to the election.

If the Democrats take the Senate, these allegations will vanish like a fart in the wind

If the Republicans keep the Senate, Cocaine Mitch is going to hold this in his pocket and slow roll Booker's re-election in 2020

[Koko78]

2 minutes ago, /dev/null said:

 

Democrats have already set the precedent that accusations matter more than proof.  Accusations like this against a sitting Senator merits an inquiry by the Senate Ethics Committee

 

But don't expect to hear anything soon, too close to the election.

If the Democrats take the Senate, these allegations will vanish like a fart in the wind

If the Republicans keep the Senate, Cocaine Mitch is going to hold this in his pocket and slow roll Booker's re-election in 2020

 

Yes, allegations matter more than proof - but only if you're a Republican. Look at Ellison, for example. There's actual proof that he beats his women, but it's swept under the carpet by their media allies. Can't have the #2 guy at the DNC going down, after all.

[/dev/null]

Just now, Koko78 said:

 

Yes, allegations matter more than proof - but only if you're a Republican. Look at Ellison, for example. There's actual proof that he beats his women, but it's swept under the carpet by their media allies. Can't have the #2 guy at the DNC going down, after all.

 

True, the media does their best to sweep accusations against Democrats under the rug.

 

But the media does not control the Senate Ethics Committee.  If Cocaine Mitch calls an inquiry, these allegations become a part of the Senate record. 

[Deranged Rhino]

Uncle Joe's crowd didn't break 200 people. 45's crowd was much bigger. 

 

It won't be Joe.