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The Draft Network - Josh Allen's Struggles Go Beyond Lackluster Supporting Cast

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4 games started....known raw prospect.... Thats enough....bust

 

 

 

:sarcasm:

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1 hour ago, No Place To Hyde said:

Ok, and we knew he would take time to learn back BEFORE he was drafted. Why do the expectations change? Right now he is as advertised. Since we drafted him we have:

 

Given him 3rd and 2nd team reps mostly in TC and preseason

 

Not upgraded anything on offense to support a very inexperienced rookie

 

Given him a QB coach in Culley that before last year hadn't coached QBs since the 80s

 

Have him play behind a Castillo led oline.

 

Had we moved up for Darnold or taken Rosen instead I truly believe neither one would look any better in this offense. We Will have a much better feel for what we have in Allen about 8 games into next season. 

 

Let the kid get all the 1st team reps in the off season. Let him hold some private workouts with newly signed receivers and get timing and trust down. He may sink or he may swim, but calling him a failure this soon after knowing he would take time is just idiotic.

4

Culley as QB coach isn't as bad as the Eagles having Castillo as DC.  

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19 minutes ago, BuffaloBillsGospel said:

I tend to disagree with most fans not for just the sake of argument but I think Josh is progressing nicely, beating a stout Minnesota defense and another top notch defense in the Titans, he also was behind towards the end and hit on a few plays to get them into FG range. Signs are all pointing in the right direction that we found our QB of the present and future and I'm not really sure why others are doubting, just my opinions though.

Agreed.

 

I guess I’m just not a big stats guy.  I was pretty thrilled with how he played Sunday, and actually surprised to see so much criticism here afterwards.

 

Most of his mistakes are things that can be coached and fixed.  The good stuff - toughness, that TD run, the poise in that game winning drive - cannot be taught.

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I write this with no agenda or narrative, but I expected more out of Joe Marino, it’s discouraging that he doesn’t understand  what a clean pocket is at this stage.  

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1 hour ago, Chris66 said:

Watching Allen try to play qb is brutal. 

 

Is school out again today in New England?...

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1 hour ago, Ramza86 said:

This is a good video. I thought this was Allens worst game. 

 

Lets not forget the Titans are a very well run defense

 

Im not hitting the panic button. I think the second half of the season will say more about Allen and his ability to get acclimated with the position. 

With Woodyard healthy maybe, but he was out that game. Casey was the only notable run stuffer playing on Sunday. Not to mention a few outlets have the Titans run defense in the bottom half of the league: ESPN has them at 26 currently against the run, PFF has them at 13 fwiw

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12 minutes ago, Mrbojanglezs said:

4 games started....known raw prospect.... Thats enough....bust

 

 

 

:sarcasm:


Bills fans seriously need to get thicker skin. It's embarrassing. 

No one said he's a bust. No one denied that he was already known to be raw.

It's a simple article. It states that Allen hasn't played particularly well so far and lists some areas in which he can improve. 

Toughen. The. !@#$. Up.

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1 hour ago, Cash said:

Good article.  Allen is straight-up bad right now.  Will be interesting to see if he ends the season better than he is now.

You're not allowed to say that! Just look at my thread.

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29 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

Right on cue!  This is objective and fair analysis.  Just because you never heard of Marino it doesn't mean his assessment isn't accurate. 

 

May be accurate, but he's still just another guy sitting in his basement.  :bag:

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4 minutes ago, bobblehead said:

I write this with no agenda or narrative, but I expected more out of Joe Marino, it’s discouraging that he doesn’t understand  what a clean pocket is at this stage.  

 

I’m sure Marino’s willingness to criticize Allen with pieces like this have absolutely nothing to do with the fact that he was a huge Allen skeptic before the draft.

 

Nope. None whatsoever.

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These analysts can throw out a lot of statistics to support their conclusions.  However, consider that Allen has faced 3 top 10 defensive units (in yards allowed) while Darnold has faced 1 (Jacksonville looking like a rookie) and Mayfield has faced 1 (Baltimore and squeezed out a 12-9 OT win).  That doesn't prove anything about how Allen is performing vs. his peers in the draft class but it does point out a big disparity in the quality of the opposing defenses they've faced.  In baseball parlance, Allen has faced a lot of 'major league pitching' and has a 2-2 record.  His peers are hitting a lot of homers in the minors.  With the strength of schedule becoming more favorable to the Bills the rest of the way I'm expecting Allen's QB stats to reflect that factor. 

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3 minutes ago, John from Riverside said:

A raw rookie that needed a year is raw

shocker

A raw rookie that had limited reps with the 1st unit during preseason and 4 actual game starts up to now. Bills are 2 - 2 in those starts defeating 2 playoff caliber football teams. The fact that Allen is about as raw as they get and still managed the Titans game like a savvy veteran speaks volumes IMO. 

 

Josh Allens ability to run the football will help carry him to where he needs to be in the passing game.

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14 minutes ago, The Monk said:

Culley as QB coach isn't as bad as the Eagles having Castillo as DC.  

That's like saying a kick in the gonads isnt as bad as a knife to the gonads. 

 

Neither are desirable and both are really bad for production.

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1 minute ago, Wayne Arnold said:

 

I’m sure Marino’s willingness to criticize Allen with pieces like this have absolutely nothing to do with the fact that he was a huge Allen skeptic before the draft.

 

Nope. None whatsoever.


Jesus Christ.

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34 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

Right on cue!  This is objective and fair analysis.  Just because you never heard of Marino it doesn't mean his assessment isn't accurate. 

Correct.  But instead of just throwing out some snarky comment, why not actually give me some data in what the guy's background is so I can judge whether he has expertise?  maybe it's because he doesn't.

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1 minute ago, Logic said:


Jesus Christ.

 

Triggered?

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Just now, oldmanfan said:

Correct.  But instead of just throwing out some snarky comment, why not actually give me some data in what the guy's background is so I can judge whether he has expertise?  maybe it's because he doesn't.

 

Do your own research before throwing shade at him.  The bottom line is you'd have the same reaction based on your previous history irrespective of whose analysis it is. 

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28 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

The visceral reactionary Josh Allen defenses without even reading the analysis are pretty sad. 

To be honest corner your attacking of josh Allen supporter because you didn’t agree with the pick is pretty sad

 

never saw you do that before this year you have always seemed very level headed now you go out of your way to do this

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2 minutes ago, Wayne Arnold said:

 

Triggered?


Bills fans any time anyone says ANYTHING bad about Allen, you mean?

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, No Place To Hyde said:

Ok, and we knew he would take time to learn back BEFORE he was drafted. Why do the expectations change? Right now he is as advertised. Since we drafted him we have:

 

Given him 3rd and 2nd team reps mostly in TC and preseason

 

Not upgraded anything on offense to support a very inexperienced rookie

 

Given him a QB coach in Culley that before last year hadn't coached QBs since the 80s.

 

Have him play behind a Castillo led oline.

 

Had we moved up for Darnold or taken Rosen instead I truly believe neither one would look any better in this offense. We Will have a much better feel for what we have in Allen about 8 games into next season. 

 

Let the kid get all the 1st team reps in the off season. Let him hold some private workouts with newly signed receivers and get timing and trust down. He may sink or he may swim, but calling him a failure this soon after knowing he would take time is just idiotic.

Thank you...to be honest, I was not an Allen fan pre-draft, and my conclusions on him are still in the air until next season. Not that we should be expecting the worst, but let's humor the hypothetical right now: 

 

We go into this offseason with draft capital (10 picks) and a hefty purse to spend. We use this to build a team around Allen and address position needs. We give Allen this team to take into next season and get a better sense of how he will progress in later years and determine if drafting another QB is going to be necessary. What's actually a silver lining here is his raw, undeveloped potential - where if he doesn't develop at all, we're looking at a high draft pick we can likely use on another QB in 2020. If he does develop, then awesome, we have a QB of the future and what we hope to be a strong team having upgraded multiple positions the year before.

 

By no way in means have I cashed in my Allen ticket just yet - I think it's ridiculous to speculate at all how this kid may turn out after only 4 games. One thing we do know is this isn't unfamiliar for him. He's been the "raw" "undeveloped" QB his whole life, and supposedly has the mental toughness to deal with early struggles and external pressure. But there's no reason Allen sends us down another 18 year drought, we just need to enjoy the process, however it ends up.

 

Update: the one piece in relation to the article that really has me behind the "let go of Culley" train is that it is evidently clear Allen needs to develop beyond x's and o's with footwork, pocket presence, and mechanics to properly maximize his physical traits. This is why the Andersen signing has me scratching my head - footwork and mechanics should be taught from the QB coach, and I just don't trust Culley to be the guy Allen needs right now. Do we really think Andersen is going to sit down with Allen and walk him through proper footwork mechanics to maximize his arm strength? Please...let's invest in our future and bring in a true QB coach to help this kid along. Andersen likely can't hurt (I say with caution), but the greater need here is guidance from a coach.

Edited by ctk232
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Just now, John from Riverside said:

To be honest corner your attacking of josh Allen supporter because you didn’t agree with the pick is pretty sad

 

never saw you do that before this year you have always seemed very level headed now you go out of your way to do this

 

I'm not a cheerleading homer . I say what I see just as I did with Peterman when people gave me crap about it.  The difference is Allen has real talent and he can be good if he puts it all together. 

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5 minutes ago, Figster said:

A raw rookie that had limited reps with the 1st unit during preseason and 4 actual game starts up to now. Bills are 2 - 2 in those starts defeating 2 playoff caliber football teams. The fact that Allen is about as raw as they get and still managed the Titans game like a savvy veteran speaks volumes IMO. 

 

Josh Allens ability to run the football will help carry him to where he needs to be in the passing game.

I fully expect josh to get better as the season goes on

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2 minutes ago, Wayne Arnold said:

 

Triggered?

Yeah no kidding.  That response was a bit much.  Trolling and crusading is rampant here. It’s  a problem. Regardless of what you think of a particular player.  

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1 minute ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

Do your own research before throwing shade at him.  The bottom line is you'd have the same reaction based on your previous history irrespective of whose analysis it is. 

Why do you refuse to read?  Why?  One of the first things I wrote was that I tried to Google the guy to see what his background was, and couldn't find anything.  So I asked folks here about it so I can judge.

 

Instead of giving me info, all you want to do is throw out snarky crap.  If you know about his background, why not share it?  He breaks down this 22 film stuff as if he's a pro.  It would be helpful to me to know something about his background to evaluate his critique.

 

 

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