Domdab99 Posted October 8, 2018 Share Posted October 8, 2018 2 minutes ago, oldmanfan said: I'm a bottom line guy. And I win a lot at poker. You would rather your team lose so you can watch the young QB get killed. That makes sense. lol sure you do. And you're turning this into a black or white issue when it's not. I didn't say anything like what you just said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldmanfan Posted October 8, 2018 Share Posted October 8, 2018 1 minute ago, Domdab99 said: lol sure you do. And you're turning this into a black or white issue when it's not. I didn't say anything like what you just said. I'll dial it back a bit. The question was the Bills beat the Titans but at what cost. I believe that was intended to ask whether winning with a more conservative game plan was somehow negative in stunting Allen's development. You said, I believe, you would rather him throw the ball all day and lose, you just want him to throw. He was forced into that somewhat in Green Bay and you saw the outcome, a lot of sacks and such. So my question is simple: how does him getting sacked like that, losing like that, truly contribute to his development? 4 minutes ago, Domdab99 said: lol sure you do. And you're turning this into a black or white issue when it's not. I didn't say anything like what you just said. Oh, and bring the cards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Domdab99 Posted October 8, 2018 Share Posted October 8, 2018 (edited) 25 minutes ago, oldmanfan said: I'll dial it back a bit. The question was the Bills beat the Titans but at what cost. I believe that was intended to ask whether winning with a more conservative game plan was somehow negative in stunting Allen's development. You said, I believe, you would rather him throw the ball all day and lose, you just want him to throw. He was forced into that somewhat in Green Bay and you saw the outcome, a lot of sacks and such. So my question is simple: how does him getting sacked like that, losing like that, truly contribute to his development? Oh, and bring the cards. I didn't say I wanted him to lose, I said I wouldn't mind the Bills losing if Allen is obviously progressing as a QB. As for the GB game, I thought the game plan was horrendous and did not help Allen at all. But yes, we didn't see him make an obviously awful throw and INT like he did in GB, so that's progress. I want to make it clear: I love Allen and want to give him the best chance at succeeding - now and in the future. Being a poker player, you should know what being "results oriented" means. That's saying that McD's punting against the Colts in OT was obviously correct because it worked. THAT'S first-level thinking. If I determine the best way to cross five lanes of high-speed traffic is to close my eyes and rush head-long across the highway - and I make it - that doesn't mean that my strategy was the right decision. Well, I live in Las Vegas. You can usually find me at the Aria or Wynn/Encore 5/10 games, sometimes the 2/5 games. I love hosting players who are sharks in their local game and think they actually know what they are doing. Come on out! ? Edited October 8, 2018 by Domdab99 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted October 8, 2018 Author Share Posted October 8, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMF2006 Posted October 8, 2018 Share Posted October 8, 2018 6 hours ago, Domdab99 said: Only in Bills country are fans this !@#$ing clueless about what's good for the team, the new QB, and the long run. Can't believe you'd want to trade wins this season for Josh Allen's development. If that Titan's receiver doesn't drop a gift TD, the Bills lose that game, and the pitchforks would be out over how pathetic the offense was. Especially poorly Josh Allen played. And you really think Josh Allen got a lot of confidence when his offensive coordinator tells him, "We're putting the game on the offensive line. Run the ball"?? Know what would give him confidence? "Go sling it. We live or die by what you do. And we'll take the result, either way." This is how bad Josh Allen was: his QB rating was around a 42. Our punter, who thought he was doing a fake FG when no one else did, had a QB rating of around 39. This is not giving Allen confidence. But he did pull a Stevie Johnson and all the Bills needed was a FG. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted October 9, 2018 Author Share Posted October 9, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TigerJ Posted October 9, 2018 Share Posted October 9, 2018 18 hours ago, billsfan1959 said: In listening to the podcast, my take is that the "cost" they are referring to is limiting the development of Allen. Their argument is that, because of decisions made by the FO, they have put themselves in the position of having to start Allen on a very bad offensive team. However, the team's desire to stay competitive is now coming at he expense of Allen's development. They believed the offensive game plan, at least against the Titans, was as much about limiting the potential for mistakes from Allen as it was about running the football. Even given the lack of talent at the WR position and Allen's inexperience as a rookie, he needs to throw more than 9-10 times (mostly short passes with an emphasis on not turning the ball over) in a half in order to develop. IMO, they are saying If the offensive game plan going forward is the same as the Titans game, then it comes at the cost of limiting Allen's development and ending up with a less accurate version of Tyrod Taylor. That is my take. I don't necessarily disagree. I like Allen and I think he has been placed in a very difficult position. His play has been what I expected, as a rookie and given the lack of offensive talent around him - and no worse than the play of Darnold and Rosen, to this point. I don't think the desire to stay competitive and the desire to develop a young QB are necessarily mutually exclusive, if you can find innovative ways to use him given his lack of experience and lack of offensive talent. However, if their answer to how to stay competitive is to just limit his number and types of throws simply to avoid mistakes, then they are limiting his development. Whadayaknow! That was similar to my thought in a thread yesterday when I said Daboll seemed to lack confidence in Josh Allen. I thought there times they could have opened up a bit more. There will be times this season when last Sunday's offensive game plan just won't succeed. If they don't open up a little more when they have the opportunity to do so, there's no way for Josh Allen to develop confidence and skill to run a passing offense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BB@Shooter Posted October 9, 2018 Share Posted October 9, 2018 17 hours ago, Domdab99 said: I actually agree with you on this some....Allen is amazingly confident, and maybe he's just happy to win. But I'm sure it also bothered him a little bit that the game wasn't put on his shoulders - like you would expect every QB in the league to do. But yes, he's incredibly poised and I love that about him. Allen wasn't bothered by that. I watched the coaches at Wyoming make a potential 1st pick in the draft, hand the ball off all day long. I was so pissed off at how they used Josh last year. Here is a guy who has this great arm reduced to handing the ball off because the coaches only cared that they could become bowl eligible. He had a horrible cast around him and he was the leading rusher on the team. The staff at Wyoming did a disservice to Josh by not molding the offense around his talent. Instead used him like a QB in an option type offense. They called it a Pro set, but in name only. The offense they have installed at Wyoming is in the mold of a jr. high team. No sophistication in the pass patterns at all. The OC was predictable to the point that the other teams defense stacked the line with an 8 man front. They ran the ball on 1st and 2nd down and passed on 3rd. On 3rd down the defense blitzed every time. Our Oline was horrid, starting 3 freshman in year 4 of the coaching staff. Woody Hayes would have been proud of this team, 2 yards and a cloud of dust. What Allen did in 2016 is more of what he can be going forward.. He actually had a few players around him that could make some plays. I would put his receivers that year up against what he is throwing to this year. If you look at the Wyoming offense in the 5 years Bohl and Vigen have been there, they have been near the bottom of the FBS offensive stats every year except 2016. The staff at Wyoming has not adapted from the FCS to the FBS, even though they won 3 straight FCS titles at North Dakota State before coming to Wyoming. Josh took those two Wyoming teams on his back and carried them to 8 win seasons. It was actually quite an accomplishment. Allen is used to winning ugly. The game against Tennessee was right up his alley. The reason he was so calm is he does that stuff all the time. It might not be pretty enough for some on this board, but all Allen cares about is the win, not his stats. If he can survive the Wyoming staff, he will thrive with a decent staff. Sorry about the long post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted October 9, 2018 Author Share Posted October 9, 2018 Same beat here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted October 9, 2018 Share Posted October 9, 2018 At what cost? SMH. Misery loves company even after a WIN. yuze guys love your click bait thats for sure They limited the passing game because JA was making too many mistakes. That IS a good thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fan in Chicago Posted October 9, 2018 Share Posted October 9, 2018 11 hours ago, 26CornerBlitz said: This line of thinking is really annoying. I am critical of the roster in general but do appreciate maximizing what we have. The fact the Allen didn't panic, fumble, throw an ill-advised pass or miss the easy throws . All while draining the clock in the process must be given kudos. Yet, many in here and in the article above lament what amounts to Allen not measuring up to an established QB. Sure the coaches don't trust him yet but does anyone really want him to gun it to the likes of doink-Holmes or dropsie-Benjamin and risk an interception ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted October 9, 2018 Author Share Posted October 9, 2018 2 minutes ago, Fan in Chicago said: This line of thinking is really annoying. I am critical of the roster in general but do appreciate maximizing what we have. The fact the Allen didn't panic, fumble, throw an ill-advised pass or miss the easy throws . All while draining the clock in the process must be given kudos. Yet, many in here and in the article above lament what amounts to Allen not measuring up to an established QB. Sure the coaches don't trust him yet but does anyone really want him to gun it to the likes of doink-Holmes or dropsie-Benjamin and risk an interception ? What's annoying about the objective analysis that they didn't put the game in Allen's hands at crunch time? He made two easy throws with the remainder of the drive being running plays. It's a snap shot of where his game is right now as a raw rookie QB with a lot of improving to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DuckyBoys Posted October 9, 2018 Share Posted October 9, 2018 I agree with the pod cast but going 3-13 and letting him get killed might not be the answer either. My thinking is they take the governor off the motor when the games get out of hand If they can run play good D and keep the games close they do it. Lets see how it looks when they are down by two scores or more or the run game is shut down early How much consistent success could he have throwing 35-40 times a game with this supporting cast? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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