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Tre White is the Best Player On the Bills Now


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4 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I forgot about Williams and couldn't remember if Shields was there by then or not. But with Woodson I seem to recall him missing time early that year and Green Bay's pass defense struggling and then there being a real spike when he came back and they made a playoff run. I am pretty sure that was the Superbowl year. 

 

 

Ignore that last bit on Woodson. Wrong season. I blame old age.

 

Still the point stands. He was a star corner probable HoFer and was on that Superbowl team. 

Woodson is one of the best corners ever! A HOF lock!

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5 hours ago, colin said:

 

i'd rank them

QB

Pass rusher (generally DE, could be OLB or even DT but that's more rare)

CB

offensive play maker (now it's usually WR, could be RB or TE)

OL (generally, LT, LG, RT, RG, C)

DT
LB (non pass rusher)

  Safety

I think Safety position is watered down since the talent pretty much goes to CB and LB early on in football.. but having those elite safeties are huge. 

 

I'd watch Troy Polamalu and don't think I've ever seen a defensive player have the impact he did given his freedom due to his position to make judgement calls, his intelligence, and athleticism. Dude was everywhere on the field, would see a Quarterback indecisive and run faster than lightning for a sack, reads a run play and gobbles it up waaay behind where the runninback normally goes cause he's charging unblocked. 

 

I've seen them be the real difference makers on a team. But no they don't HAVE to be with a good supporting caste. I'd say if I could only have 1 great defensive player on a team, I'd give it safety, because they're freedom can't be game planned around. You can always run away from a run stuffer, double a pass rusher, but nothing you can do about a Troy Polamalu diagnosing your play and running wild with the whole field in front of him and no blockers

 

I ****ing loved that Hyde play on 4th and 1. Mancrush on Hyde. Favorite Bill.

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54 minutes ago, colin said:

  

 

I choose to believe that this is not a typo, and that QBs and DE's are the Brahmins of football.

I'm obviously partial with Hyde love. Also talking strictly defense. Main point is that the best DE's can be chipped, game planned for, and if you were to have ONE good player on defense, might as well be your wildcard Safety running amok. Hard to game plan for a Safety with Ed Reed or Polamalu instincts. If ONE good player on defense is your defensive end, he can get neutralized like Mack appeared to be on a bad defense, even though he was still playing like a monster.. Their defense still was getting owned.

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On 9/25/2018 at 6:56 AM, CaptnCoke11 said:

I’m as excited about Josh Allen as the next guy but not going to anoint him after one good game.  We’ve seen Manuel/Edwards have good games and people started anointing them the franchise.  Let’s wait and see 

EJ didn't show as much football sense in his career as JA has shown in his pair of starts.

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On 9/25/2018 at 11:50 AM, BullBuchanan said:

Who was Philly's star corner on their super bowl team? New England? Green Bay? 

 

Having a shutdown corner is like having an elite defensive tackle. They're neat and all, but they won't win you a championship unless you have an otherwise all time great defense.

 

Um, GB won ages ago...and had the best QB in the NFL.  Philly got lit up for 500+ yards and the bad secondary almost cost them the SB had it not had been Foles played the game of his life.  And NE has had some really good corners in the Brady era...Ty Law, Revis, Samuel, Butler, Aqib Talib, etc...so I have no idea why you would try and put Pats on that list.  

 

Deion Sanders shifted the power from SF to Dallas when he moved from one to the other.  The strength of the Seattle SB team was the secondary.

 

I don't know why people do this stuff.  I mean there is no exact blueprint to win the SB in the NFL.  Teams with great D's and a bad Offense have won, teams with Great offenses and terrible D's have won...balanced teams have won.  So to hand pick a couple examples to prove you don't need a corner is absurd.  You win the SB with talent...period.  You keep talent where you have it, and its one heck of an advantage to have a shut down corner shadowing the other teams top WR.  

 

If we don't keep Tre then that would be absurd.  He is an elite player, you keep him.  And this notion you said you would rather have 4 good corners than 1 elite one...hate to break it to you, but you aren't getting 4 good corners for the same price of Tre.  Good corners don't make 25% the salary of Elite corners, so thats just nonsense.  4 good corners would cost you more than double what Tre would cost, maybe triple if we got them through FA.   

Edited by Alphadawg7
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7 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Um, GB won ages ago...and had the best QB in the NFL.  Philly got lit up for 500+ yards and the bad secondary almost cost them the SB had it not had been Foles played the game of his life.  And NE has had some really good corners in the Brady era...Ty Law, Revis, Samuel, Butler, Aqib Talib, etc...so I have no idea why you would try and put Pats on that list.  

 

Deion Sanders shifted the power from SF to Dallas when he moved from one to the other.  The strength of the Seattle SB team was the secondary.

 

I don't know why people do this stuff.  I mean there is no exact blueprint to win the SB in the NFL.  Teams with great D's and a bad Offense have won, teams with Great offenses and terrible D's have won...balanced teams have won.  So to hand pick a couple examples to prove you don't need a corner is absurd.  You win the SB with talent...period.  You keep talent where you have it, and its one heck of an advantage to have a shut down corner shadowing the other teams top WR.  

 

If we don't keep Tre then that would be absurd.  He is an elite player, you keep him.  And this notion you said you would rather have 4 good corners than 1 elite one...hate to break it to you, but you aren't getting 4 good corners for the same price of Tre.  Good corners don't make 25% the salary of Elite corners, so thats just nonsense.  4 good corners would cost you more than double what Tre would cost, maybe triple if we got them through FA.   

 

dude, for real.

 

the rub comes in how you pay for the people tho.  seattle got a lot of millage out of the LOB by having the first and second big contracts early in the cycle, so salary cap increases helped them along the way.  you really want to stagger out the big contracts you sign, so that you don't get jabbed all at once.  look at the bills w watkins and woods.  if they were a couple of years apart we may have been able to sign at least one of them, maybe even two.

 

another idea i have on nfl D's is that except for the two starting corners, talent on D is complimentary.  a great pass rusher makes the guy beside him better.  an MLB who can go side line to side line makes the OLB have less space to cover so they can play faster, DT soaks up blockers, etc.  

 

The difference w a starting corner is, his job is very binary.  he either removes the WR as an option on a given pass play, or he is letting a guy be open.  the saying "being on an island" is very true.  for that reason, i think you really need to over invest in corners, because the difference between a B+ and an A corner on a given play can be 6 points.

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On 9/26/2018 at 11:53 PM, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Um, GB won ages ago...and had the best QB in the NFL.  Philly got lit up for 500+ yards and the bad secondary almost cost them the SB had it not had been Foles played the game of his life.  And NE has had some really good corners in the Brady era...Ty Law, Revis, Samuel, Butler, Aqib Talib, etc...so I have no idea why you would try and put Pats on that list.  

 

Deion Sanders shifted the power from SF to Dallas when he moved from one to the other.  The strength of the Seattle SB team was the secondary.

 

I don't know why people do this stuff.  I mean there is no exact blueprint to win the SB in the NFL.  Teams with great D's and a bad Offense have won, teams with Great offenses and terrible D's have won...balanced teams have won.  So to hand pick a couple examples to prove you don't need a corner is absurd.  You win the SB with talent...period.  You keep talent where you have it, and its one heck of an advantage to have a shut down corner shadowing the other teams top WR.  

 

If we don't keep Tre then that would be absurd.  He is an elite player, you keep him.  And this notion you said you would rather have 4 good corners than 1 elite one...hate to break it to you, but you aren't getting 4 good corners for the same price of Tre.  Good corners don't make 25% the salary of Elite corners, so thats just nonsense.  4 good corners would cost you more than double what Tre would cost, maybe triple if we got them through FA.   

You can get good corners for 4-5 million per year. If you pay $20 million to one corner, now you have trash at the other 3 spots and any QB worth his salt will just ignore the one threat out of 5 that you shut down. Good luck with that.

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On 9/27/2018 at 5:53 AM, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Um, GB won ages ago...and had the best QB in the NFL.  Philly got lit up for 500+ yards and the bad secondary almost cost them the SB had it not had been Foles played the game of his life.  And NE has had some really good corners in the Brady era...Ty Law, Revis, Samuel, Butler, Aqib Talib, etc...so I have no idea why you would try and put Pats on that list.  

 

Deion Sanders shifted the power from SF to Dallas when he moved from one to the other.  The strength of the Seattle SB team was the secondary.

 

I don't know why people do this stuff.  I mean there is no exact blueprint to win the SB in the NFL.  Teams with great D's and a bad Offense have won, teams with Great offenses and terrible D's have won...balanced teams have won.  So to hand pick a couple examples to prove you don't need a corner is absurd.  You win the SB with talent...period.  You keep talent where you have it, and its one heck of an advantage to have a shut down corner shadowing the other teams top WR.  

 

If we don't keep Tre then that would be absurd.  He is an elite player, you keep him.  And this notion you said you would rather have 4 good corners than 1 elite one...hate to break it to you, but you aren't getting 4 good corners for the same price of Tre.  Good corners don't make 25% the salary of Elite corners, so thats just nonsense.  4 good corners would cost you more than double what Tre would cost, maybe triple if we got them through FA.   

 

Missed this post last week but it is absolutely right. Teams that win the Superbowl have elite talent. Normally 4 or 5 of them on the team and some other very good non-elite players around them. And there is no absolute model. Normally the QB is one of the elite players, but not always. Teams with elite corners have won it and teams with average corners have won it. But every Superbowl team has a core of 4 or 5 key difference makers. When you get one you keep him.

 

The Bills have not been good at A - finding those guys in the draft and B - keeping them. Tre White may well be elite (isn't quite there yet but pretty close 4 games into year two) the last player we drafted who I would even put in that close to elite category was Cordy Glenn who at his peak was just a tick below the elite LTs in this league. We don't get them very often. We sure as hell better keep Tre when the time comes. 

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On ‎9‎/‎25‎/‎2018 at 2:53 PM, BringBackOrton said:

Gilmore.    

 

I didn't say you needed star corners.  I said you needed stars, which Tre is.  The Eagles had a ton of stars last year.

 

Green Bay hasn't won in Super Bowl in almost a decade so that's kind of a weird comment.  They actually have had a garbage defense devoid of stars which is pretty much the reason why they can't win another one with a top 3 QB in NFL history.

 

 

Do you seriously believe that Gilmore was a shut down corner in Buffalo?

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I think since we ain’t winning now we need to trade white to create cap space and get some draft picks.  

On 9/25/2018 at 2:46 PM, FeelingOnYouboty said:

Our one elite player and he's getting better

 

Yeah the future looks bright!  We got 1. 

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