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This Year's Bears = Next Year's Bills?


jethro_tull

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23 minutes ago, klos63 said:

So basically if we add someone like Mack on defense, add all new WR and TE, and have a line equal to the Bears line, which was fairly well rated in 2017, we'll be like the Bears 2018 team? That's all we need?

 

 

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I'm very pessimistic that the Bills fix all of their issues they currently have in one offseason, I do believe there will be some significant strides towards being more competitive next season. It will really depend on the draft, seeing how much those draft picks are used on offense or defense. 

Hopefully they don't re-sign KB this offseason and possibly bring in a veteran WR who isn't going to look so lazy when he is on the field. Not even trying to block on that DiMarco  pass against the Chargers was just poor effort. I don't want to see him on this roster next year. 

I think Allen and Edmunds will improve after a year of playing significant time this year and having another full OTAs and training camp next year. And most likely be able to open up some more from the playbook as they grow some experience.  

And as long as no one retires at halftime....

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1 hour ago, Happy Gilmore said:

 

From what little I saw of Trubisky, it looks like the game is a little slower for him than for Allen at this point.  I do think Allen has better physical tools, but needs to recognize the defense and be able to adjust at the snap count.  In a year from now, I would think JA >> Trubisky.

Ya I agree but something getting severely overlooked in Allens first start is that Daboll and the offense had to basically scrap the playbook and go pass heavy after going down 28 points on 4 straight possessions. 

So I'm sorta putting an asterisk next to that start , as the offense was shackled and the defense knew a rookie , first time starter had to go into a pass heavy offense. 

I'm very intrigued by how the O will look this week. That's 2 straight games the defense failed miserably and forced the O to go pass heavy. Our running game has looked surprisingly encouraging, especially Ivory ,who looks to have a burst I didn't expect.

Allen or any rookie QB needs a run game to be successful . As long as he progresses, this season is a success imo

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If this turns into a season where they get a top 2 pick AND Allen is progressing, then I won't be disappointed.  They could use one of Bosa/Oliver to take the D to the next level.  Yes, they need more weapons on O, but they need a REAL stud who can get after the passer.

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4 hours ago, jethro_tull said:

Last year the Bears just started integrating their rookie QB after a disastrous start with Mike Glennon.  

They went on to a  5 and 12 record behind a shaky offensive line,  poor receiving corp and decent defense.  

The defense obviously developed well and received some upgraded juice in the form of Kahlil Mack.  The offensive line revamped only one starting position and seems to have developed nicely.  The staring receivers and TE are all new from last year.  

Arguably the Bears are looking like a legit playoff contender this year.   This year's Bills seem to be in a similar position as least year's Bears and might be on a 5 and 12 path (or slightly less).  The point is that with some off season moves and additional player development the Bears have improved their position from a 5-12 team to a legit contender and the same thing could easily happen to the Bills next year.  

Don't think so, but perhaps this year's Bills will be next year's Bears!

 

 

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In order for the Bills to be like 2018 Bears in 2019, they have to can McDermott, give control of player selection to Beane, hire an offensive minded HC, and finally trade for Von Miller or some other game changer on defense.  That ain't happening, which is probably just as well because after seeing the crap McDermott and Beane have put on the field in the form of FAs in 2018 and the stupid trades the Bills have made under Beane, putting Beane totally in charge of player personnel would make the Browns FO at their very worse look astute.

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6 hours ago, jethro_tull said:

Last year the Bears just started integrating their rookie QB after a disastrous start with Mike Glennon.  

They went on to a  5 and 12 record behind a shaky offensive line,  poor receiving corp and decent defense.  

The defense obviously developed well and received some upgraded juice in the form of Kahlil Mack.  The offensive line revamped only one starting position and seems to have developed nicely.  The staring receivers and TE are all new from last year.  

Arguably the Bears are looking like a legit playoff contender this year.   This year's Bills seem to be in a similar position as least year's Bears and might be on a 5 and 12 path (or slightly less).  The point is that with some off season moves and additional player development the Bears have improved their position from a 5-12 team to a legit contender and the same thing could easily happen to the Bills next year.  

 

I hope not, Mitch doesn’t look good.  

 

I’m hoping last years Rams is the better example.  Rams going into last year revamped the OL and added Watkins, Woods, Kupp, and Everett.  Goff took a big jump forward, Gurley became a stud again, and they made the playoffs.

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30 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

I hope not, Mitch doesn’t look good.  

 

I’m hoping last years Rams is the better example.  Rams going into last year revamped the OL and added Watkins, Woods, Kupp, and Everett.  Goff took a big jump forward, Gurley became a stud again, and they made the playoffs.

They took a big jump when they had a big dump and got rid of Fisher.  McVay is the reason that offense completely turned around and they brought in Wade Phillips who can take almost any group and make it awesome on defense.  The difference is that they finally have great coaching on both sides of the ball.  The significant investment in WR's didn't hurt either.  Woods, Cupp, and Cooks (Watkins last year) also didn't hurt either.  I'm even leaving out Reynolds who was great in the senior bowl but lost in their depth chart.  We haven't made the investment in our offense anywhere near that level.  I would imagine this year is already a lost cause but if they make a large investment in the offense next year and this years picks (Allen and Edmunds) pan out then we could take a nice big step forward next year.  I would at this point think we almost have to or McDermott will not last.

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1 hour ago, Maine-iac said:

They took a big jump when they had a big dump and got rid of Fisher.  McVay is the reason that offense completely turned around and they brought in Wade Phillips who can take almost any group and make it awesome on defense.  The difference is that they finally have great coaching on both sides of the ball.  The significant investment in WR's didn't hurt either.  Woods, Cupp, and Cooks (Watkins last year) also didn't hurt either.  I'm even leaving out Reynolds who was great in the senior bowl but lost in their depth chart.  We haven't made the investment in our offense anywhere near that level.  I would imagine this year is already a lost cause but if they make a large investment in the offense next year and this years picks (Allen and Edmunds) pan out then we could take a nice big step forward next year.  I would at this point think we almost have to or McDermott will not last.

 

No denying McVay is a great young coach, however, this is when fans give coaches too much credit.  To give him all or the majority of the credit is crazy.  I live here in Los Angeles, and Rams are my second team.  The year before McVay, Rams had the worst OL in the NFL and even Gurley struggled.  They had no weapons to throw to either.  Then in the offseason, they completely rebuilt the OL which was night and day different from the year before, so not only would they pass protect for Goff, they were able to get Gurley rolling again too which further took pressure off Goff.  Then they got rid of all their WR's except Tavon (which they finally dumped his bad contract this offseason) and brought in Sammy, Woods, Kupp and also the rookie TE Everett who is a receiving threat to go with the other solid TE.  All of a sudden they had a good OL and a ton of weapons around Goff.  

 

Had McVay been the coach the last year Fisher was there, that Rams team would not have been much better than it was as it just didn't have the talent on the offense.  I have seen this many times here on this board where people give almost all the credit to McVay.  That tells me they didn't follow the team closely enough to know just how much offensive turnover they did in one offseason. Their offensive weapons and OL were on the level ours is this year during Fishers last year.  And dont get me wrong, I think Fisher should have been fired a long long time ago and think McVay is an great young coach right now.  But their turn around was significantly impacted by the major over haul of the personnel on the offense as well.

 

And thats why I said I want us to be the Rams of last year, not the Bears of this year because the Bears of this year have a young QB they invested a lot of draft picks in to get who isn't playing well still.  I want to be like the Rams of last year, where we rebuild the OL and WR group in a major overhaul in one off season (and we have the draft picks and cap space to do it) and see Josh take a big step forward in year 2 like Goff did.  

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5 and 11, thanks for all corrections.

I have watched each Bears game and am impressed enough with this team to call them a legitimate contender with room to grow.  By rights they had the packers except for an asinine 3rd down pass play when they were running the ball at will and a first down with a yard to go would have iced the game. 

Trubisky is playing good enough for the team to win, not great but you (I) can see the talent and potential though.  Running game is solid, OL is much better and the defense is outstanding.  Too early to tell just how good the Seahawks are but the Bears shut them down into the ground.   The Bears are legit and could fight for their division IMHO.  

The Bills do seem behind in talent vs. last year's Bears at this point- but the Bears were somewhat similarly awful out of the gate going 1 and 5.  

The Bills taking a leap to legit playoff contention next season is predicated on lots of development this season on both sides of the ball and our coaching definitely has to be better.  I think each will happen and doubt we will see the same Bills team by mid season that we do now.  

They also have to "win" next year's off season, not just in boastful terms but actual talent upgrades at many positions (unfortunately).  

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22 hours ago, jethro_tull said:

Last year the Bears just started integrating their rookie QB after a disastrous start with Mike Glennon.  

They went on to a  5 and 12 record behind a shaky offensive line,  poor receiving corp and decent defense.  

The defense obviously developed well and received some upgraded juice in the form of Kahlil Mack.  The offensive line revamped only one starting position and seems to have developed nicely.  The staring receivers and TE are all new from last year.  

Arguably the Bears are looking like a legit playoff contender this year.   This year's Bills seem to be in a similar position as least year's Bears and might be on a 5 and 12 path (or slightly less).  The point is that with some off season moves and additional player development the Bears have improved their position from a 5-12 team to a legit contender and the same thing could easily happen to the Bills next year.  

Certainly not impossible. The Bears aren't the first and won't be the last on quick turnarounds.

Bills problems are a bit more deep. They probably need 10-12 starters, and need too find capable depth.

Not the trash they have this season. Also, it's too early to tell but an assistant coach or two Could be gone . Hopefully.

 

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23 hours ago, billsfan5121 said:

I’m sure it’ll get pointed out several times, so I’ll be the first.  There’s only 16 games in a season.

 

But to the point of your post.  We can all certainly hope that the turnaround is quick. I think we all realize this year, from a win/loss perspective, is going to be tough to watch.  Regardless of record, if Allen shows signs of growth from now till December, I’ll be optimistic for next season no matter what happens.  

 

There are only two things that would make me pessimistic next season.

 

1: Allen looks terrible this year.  Even this is a stretch though.  If he looks bad all year, I’ll still probably be optimistic, unless number 2 happens, which is.....

 

2: Benjamin is our number one receiver next year.  If he is the best of the bunch next year, I will be pessimistic heading into the season.  He’s a guy who has a place in this league, but not as a number 1.  Or if he is the number 1, he needs a quality #2 for it to work.  Like Golden Tate in Detroit.  He isn’t a great number 1 receiver by himself, but it works with Marvin jones as the 2

 

Wait a second?  Who outside of Joe “Mr. Nobody” Ledyard thinks that Allen looked “terrible?”  Most correctly identified his performance as inconsistent - having good and bad moments.  This is what typically happens with rookie QB’s as demonstrated by Sam Darnold

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14 minutes ago, BuffaloRush said:

 

Wait a second?  Who outside of Joe “Mr. Nobody” Ledyard thinks that Allen looked “terrible?”  Most correctly identified his performance as inconsistent - having good and bad moments.  This is what typically happens with rookie QB’s as demonstrated by Sam Darnold

I didn’t say Allen looked terrible. I said only two things would cause me to be pessimistic next season, with one of those being IF Allen looked terrible.  I even followed that up by saying that alone probably still isn’t enough for me to be pessimistic 

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