Doc Posted September 22, 2018 Share Posted September 22, 2018 6 hours ago, FearLess Price said: Not really. Its well documented a lot of us were annoyed that we didnt try to resign EJG in FA that year. He ended up on the Browns I would be they offered him a reasonable deal for several years and he wanted a lot more than they were willing to give him, probably a lot more than even the $3.5M for 1 year the Browns gave him and he settled for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColoradoBills Posted September 22, 2018 Share Posted September 22, 2018 On 9/21/2018 at 8:27 AM, Tuco said: Was bored at work. My boss would be so proud. Great job Tuco! I got a question for you. In July this year the Bills signed OLB Keenan Robinson to a 1 year contract. In August Robinson left by claiming he is retiring. The Bills were on the hook for his salary and his cap money. Do you know why Robinson and Davis situations are different? It's bugging me not knowing why. https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/buffalo-bills/keenan-robinson-9938/ https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/buffalo-bills/cap/ 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted September 22, 2018 Share Posted September 22, 2018 On 9/21/2018 at 7:20 AM, Cripple Creek said: This is a well reasoned and articulate response. You must be lost. Where is Cuddly to refute all this...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tuco Posted September 22, 2018 Share Posted September 22, 2018 24 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said: Great job Tuco! I got a question for you. In July this year the Bills signed OLB Keenan Robinson to a 1 year contract. In August Robinson left by claiming he is retiring. The Bills were on the hook for his salary and his cap money. Do you know why Robinson and Davis situations are different? It's bugging me not knowing why. https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/buffalo-bills/keenan-robinson-9938/ https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/buffalo-bills/cap/ That's a damned good question. The only thing I've been able to find is the Over The Cap site has KR listed as on injured reserve. Spotrac has him as reverve/did not report, and the Bills don't have him listed at all. I have a feeler out to try to find out more, but here's my best guess(es). The fact the Over The Cap site lists Robinson on injured reserve makes me think possibly he was injured. If he was headed to injured reserve he would still be entitled to his salary paid through the season. Of course we all know teams like to reach injury settlements with players on IR they know won't be coming back. It frees the team from having to provide medical care throughout the season and giving the player access to facilities, etc. And it helps tie up loose ends not having the player on their books for anything any more. Now I'm really guessing here, but I do know KR signed what's called a qualifying contract. Briefly, a qualifying contract is a one year deal that vested veterans can sign for the minimum amount while having a slightly lesser amount charged to the cap. If you look on Spotrac it shows KRs bonus plus salary as $835,000, while his cap charge is only $675,000. The idea is it's a way for teams to be able to keep old pros around by paying them the minimum salary for their accrued years while getting charged a little less against the cap. But qualifying contracts are very specific and have numerous limitations. One of those is that it can't be renegotiated during the season. I wonder if reaching a settlement with a player who's being paid all season on IR is still considered a renegotiation. I guess technically that's what it is. So maybe the Bills, knowing KR was headed for IR but wouldn't be coming back in the future, and maybe since KR also realized he wouldn't be coming back, he was allowed to announce retirement while the Bills still agreed to pay him what he would have coming on injured reserve anyway. Seeking reimbursement for salary and cap charges when a player retires is a team discretion. The team is only forced to do it if the player's forfeitable breach was due to substance abuse violation. So possibly since KR would have to be paid on IR, and since maybe they wouldn't be allowed to reach an injury settlement as mentioned above, it may have just been in everybody's best interest to go ahead and let him announce his retirement while agreeing to still pay what he had coming if put on IR. He would still get paid what he had coming for being on IR, but the team wouldn't have to provide any further medical access or be forced to allow access to training facilities, etc. Outside of KR being sent a check each week during the season, the Bills would effectively have him off their books. This is mostly conjecture, fueled by the fact the one site lists him on injured reserve, which makes me think all the above could have happened. And if it all happened at once then that would explain the news reports about retirement but not anything about injury or injured reserve. But I don't really know at this point. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColoradoBills Posted September 22, 2018 Share Posted September 22, 2018 5 minutes ago, Tuco said: That's a damned good question. The only thing I've been able to find is the Over The Cap site has KR listed as on injured reserve. Spotrac has him as reverve/did not report, and the Bills don't have him listed at all. I have a feeler out to try to find out more, but here's my best guess(es). The fact the Over The Cap site lists Robinson on injured reserve makes me think possibly he was injured. If he was headed to injured reserve he would still be entitled to his salary paid through the season. Of course we all know teams like to reach injury settlements with players on IR they know won't be coming back. It frees the team from having to provide medical care throughout the season and giving the player access to facilities, etc. And it helps tie up loose ends not having the player on their books for anything any more. Now I'm really guessing here, but I do know KR signed what's called a qualifying contract. Briefly, a qualifying contract is a one year deal that vested veterans can sign for the minimum amount while having a slightly lesser amount charged to the cap. If you look on Spotrac it shows KRs bonus plus salary as $835,000, while his cap charge is only $675,000. The idea is it's a way for teams to be able to keep old pros around by paying them the minimum salary for their accrued years while getting charged a little less against the cap. But qualifying contracts are very specific and have numerous limitations. One of those is that it can't be renegotiated during the season. I wonder if reaching a settlement with a player who's being paid all season on IR is still considered a renegotiation. I guess technically that's what it is. So maybe the Bills, knowing KR was headed for IR but wouldn't be coming back in the future, and maybe since KR also realized he wouldn't be coming back, he was allowed to announce retirement while the Bills still agreed to pay him what he would have coming on injured reserve anyway. Seeking reimbursement for salary and cap charges when a player retires is a team discretion. The team is only forced to do it if the player's forfeitable breach was due to substance abuse violation. So possibly since KR would have to be paid on IR, and since maybe they wouldn't be allowed to reach an injury settlement as mentioned above, it may have just been in everybody's best interest to go ahead and let him announce his retirement while agreeing to still pay what he had coming if put on IR. He would still get paid what he had coming for being on IR, but the team wouldn't have to provide any further medical access or be forced to allow access to training facilities, etc. Outside of KR being sent a check each week during the season, the Bills would effectively have him off their books. This is mostly conjecture, fueled by the fact the one site lists him on injured reserve, which makes me think all the above could have happened. And if it all happened at once then that would explain the news reports about retirement but not anything about injury or injured reserve. But I don't really know at this point. Thanks for the reply. Part of my confusion is I use Spotrac which had him on Reserve/Did Not Report (which in itself is confusing). The official Buffalo Bills release report said he retired and did not mention anything about injury. There may have been a medical exam at time of retirement and found an injury but I'm speculating. I knew a "qualifying contract" was a way to keep older lower talent vets but it's interesting you mention they have specific and numerous limitations. That definitely could have something to do with this and I'm gong to check out some more info on those type of contracts. The notion the Bills might have just allowed his full paid retirement makes sense too. The money (cap hit) wasn't that much and why fight it if the player has another avenue to get the money. Thanks again for sharing your knowledge on the subject and for your post on the VD situation! Go Bills. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJS Posted September 22, 2018 Share Posted September 22, 2018 On 9/19/2018 at 12:49 PM, mattynh said: If he "unretires" the Bills will probably be forced to just waive him and then he would get most of the money. No, he would go on some kind of "Did not report" list or something, and then the Bills could fine him for not showing up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mead107 Posted September 22, 2018 Share Posted September 22, 2018 He sent me a text asking if he could invest in meadcoins in the morning. Probably should have waited till after the game to tell him he could. ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt_In_NH Posted September 22, 2018 Share Posted September 22, 2018 4 hours ago, MJS said: No, he would go on some kind of "Did not report" list or something, and then the Bills could fine him for not showing up. not if he showed up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted September 23, 2018 Share Posted September 23, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted September 23, 2018 Share Posted September 23, 2018 4 hours ago, mead107 said: He sent me a text asking if he could invest in meadcoins in the morning. Probably should have waited till after the game to tell him he could. ? These are a better investment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJS Posted September 23, 2018 Share Posted September 23, 2018 3 hours ago, mattynh said: not if he showed up Well, he was put on the reserve/left the squad list, so no, he can't just show up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted September 23, 2018 Share Posted September 23, 2018 4 minutes ago, MJS said: Well, he was put on the reserve/left the squad list, so no, he can't just show up. He's actually still listed on the Bills website on the Active roster, but they have 54 players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJS Posted September 23, 2018 Share Posted September 23, 2018 38 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: He's actually still listed on the Bills website on the Active roster, but they have 54 players. He's on the reserve/left the team list. I don't think it matters what the website shows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted September 23, 2018 Share Posted September 23, 2018 6 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: He's actually still listed on the Bills website on the Active roster, but they have 54 players. NFL League Transactions | NFL.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted September 23, 2018 Share Posted September 23, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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