BeginnersMind Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 The Bills 2-3 year regime change cycle has worked so well for the last 3 decades. It's no surprise that the fans want to keep up that track record of success. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAJBobby Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 Just now, vorpma said: And part of a losing culture and attitude! Ahhh the losing culture thing. Well this year will bring that right back. Man the undefinable crap this fanbase loves to talk about Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batman1876 Posted September 17, 2018 Author Share Posted September 17, 2018 5 minutes ago, MAJBobby said: Got it. So there wasnt only 12 roster spots and 42 spots needed for 50M to get to 53. There was 46 players and only 5 needed to get to 51 kick the top 51 rule in. So yes they could have got to 90 with the draft picks and This number thing you are doing without the purge. Not to mention they spent 32.7M in cap space that year and 8.3M in cap space going to Holmes, Boldin, Tate, Streeter, Brown, Butler. (wouldnt Wood look good there??) I have no idea what you are trying to say here. You want to keep all the talent we had but you ignore the cost of doing so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAJBobby Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 3 minutes ago, Batman1876 said: I have no idea what you are trying to say here. You want to keep all the talent we had but you ignore the cost of doing so. Again you have to lay out how there is only 12 players going into 2017 offseason and 120M on the Books. Should be fun considering there was 46 on the roster going into that offseason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batman1876 Posted September 17, 2018 Author Share Posted September 17, 2018 7 minutes ago, MAJBobby said: Again you have to lay out how there is only 12 players going into 2017 offseason and 120M on the Books. Should be fun considering there was 46 on the roster going into that offseason That’s not what I was doing. I simply pointed out the 2018 cost of those 12. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubs Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, CountDorkula said: They created this Cap Mess, just an FYI. The restructured Taylors contract. Then traded Him. They needed o-line and traded away Glenn Dareus is the Center of the best defense in football, that just beat the Pats. They traded for Coelman, and then cut him. They renegotiated Incognitos contract which caused that spiral. Just because I disagree with you now means I am uneducated. I wonder what insult you will throw at me / the uneducated next. I think you should just skip to "Go become a Pats fan" That's my favorite. Serious question, are Taylor, Glenn, Dareus and Coleman part of the core you want to build a team around? Because Dareus’s contract was a disaster and they traded Glenn to get more draft capital to eventually get up to take Allen. Look at the next two years of cap hits (2019, 2020) and tell me who on there do the Bills have big commitments to? Star is the only one and even his cap hit isn’t that big. The FO is tearing it down to the studs and rebuilding with a QB, MLB, and CB to start and future flexibility. It may not work, but I get it and I give them credit for actually doing it. I happen to believe it will pay off quicker than what the org had been doing for the past two decades. Just my two cents, obviously I could be totally wrong. Edited September 17, 2018 by dubs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAJBobby Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 (edited) 10 minutes ago, Batman1876 said: That’s not what I was doing. I simply pointed out the 2018 cost of those 12. Thanks for clarifying, Ahhh so then really doing Nothing, because contracts get adjust all the time and structured in a way where bigger cap hits land on more space years. You know like GOOD NFL teams do.. And some (like Dareus) could have been moved this year instead of last for lesser impact... But you know that is Chess and here at OBD we play checkers 9 minutes ago, dubs said: Serious question, are Taylor, Glenn, Dareus and Coleman part of the core you want to build a team around? Because Dareus’s contract was a disaster and they traded Glenn to get more draft capital to eventually get up to take Allen. Look at the next two years of cap hits (2019, 2020) and tell me who on there do the Bills have big commitments to? Star is the only one really and even he isn’t that big. And you trust this regime to smartly use that money. I mean the only two they same to be right on are Hyde and Poyer and the Kicker, out of 35M in cap space spent in 2017 and who out of this class? Edited September 17, 2018 by MAJBobby Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogblitz Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 1 minute ago, MAJBobby said: Thanks for clarifying and structured in a way where bigger cap hits land on more space years. You know like GOOD NFL teams do. Yet somehow the Minnesota Vikings, Phoenix Cardinals, Denver Broncos, and Washington were all able to spend $30 mil for a QB. Did they all have this cap space laying around? Washington? Really? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubs Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 (edited) 8 minutes ago, MAJBobby said: And you trust this regime to smartly use that money. I mean the only two they same to be right on are Hyde and Poyer and the Kicker, out of 35M in cap space spent in 2017 and who out of this class? I wouldn’t put my life on it but yes, for the purpose of sports entertainment I trust them at this point. At least willing to see how it plays out. Edited September 17, 2018 by dubs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rico Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 2 hours ago, Fadingpain said: The fun part is that many of the know it alls who dominate this forum with their wisdom were fairly strong supporters of Whaley during his time as GM here, often citing, for example, his shrewd ability to find replacement talent around the league and patch holes. Now that he is gone and his mistakes are being magnified, the same people dismiss Whaley as a part of the Bills misguided past. Brilliant post! Whaley was the chump of all chumps, seven years of FAILURE. He left a huge mess behind, but it’s no coincidence that the drought was broken the season after he was fired. The people on here who defended him right up to the end and even after have all been appropriately labeled. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CountDorkula Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 32 minutes ago, vorpma said: And part of a losing culture and attitude! How is that culture thing going this year? I mean the Bills Just has a dude quit mid game and are the worst team in the league. but hey if we say “trust the process” enough eventually it comes true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldmanfan Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 10 minutes ago, Batman1876 said: That’s not what I was doing. I simply pointed out the 2018 cost of those 12. Right. It's simple. You're saying if those guys were not traded/let go and kept on those contracts it would have cost X leaving Y to spend on about 50 other players. Now , could you have restructured some contracts, etc? Sure. But of course Whaley was criticized for that very thing. And it would assume the players would have been amenable to such. It it is simple. The current regime simply did not think some of these guys were good enough to merit the big bucks, and said good bye. I don't necessarily agree with each move but that's the plan. And looking at the roster now you have some young talent to groom and rely on in critical positions.0 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CountDorkula Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 1 minute ago, Rico said: Brilliant post! Whaley was the chump of all chumps, seven years of FAILURE. He left a huge mess behind, but it’s no coincidence that the drought was broken the season after he was fired. The people on here who defended him right up to the end and even after have all been appropriately labeled. The Bills roster that made the playoffs was mostly constructed by Doug Whaley........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogblitz Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 Just now, Rico said: Brilliant post! Whaley was the chump of all chumps, seven years of FAILURE. He left a huge mess behind, but it’s no coincidence that the drought was broken the season after he was fired. He left a team behind that made the playoffs the following year with players he selected leading the way. The problem was the coaching, not the talent. Had Rex been able to coach D the drought would have ended in 205 or 2016 and he'd still be here. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PlayoffsPlease Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 2 hours ago, Rigotz said: There are educated fans and uneducated fans. The educated fans understand the financial side of things and the reasonable expectation that you don't build a super bowl winner over night. The uneducated fans want to GIT ER DONE OBD every single season, which leads to a 7-9 record for two decades. Thank god this franchise is finally aligned with educated fans. We all knew this season would be bad. It's only surprising to the Git Er Done crew. A bit pompous. 8 minutes ago, oldmanfan said: Right. It's simple. You're saying if those guys were not traded/let go and kept on those contracts it would have cost X leaving Y to spend on about 50 other players. Now , could you have restructured some contracts, etc? Sure. But of course Whaley was criticized for that very thing. And it would assume the players would have been amenable to such. It it is simple. The current regime simply did not think some of these guys were good enough to merit the big bucks, and said good bye. I don't necessarily agree with each move but that's the plan. And looking at the roster now you have some young talent to groom and rely on in critical positions.0 The Bills have the fifth oldest roster in the NFL. It doesn't have any more "young players" than the average team. That part of he apologist narrative does not stand up to scrutiny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bing Bong Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 1 hour ago, joesixpack said: Sigh. I'm losing faith that you can be redeemed. Some numbers in the win column will soon redeem us both Joe. And we shall be friends again. Until them, we shall fight incessantly. Beane is a godawful GM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldmanfan Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 2 minutes ago, PlayoffsPlease said: A bit pompous. The Bills have the fifth oldest roster in the NFL. It doesn't have any more "young players" than the average team. That part of he apologist narrative does not stand up to scrutiny. They have some vets to guide younger guys. Vets like Kyle and Zo and Shady. In the next year or two some if not all of those guys will be gone as they bring in you get talent. Now they may bring some vets in then too for experience. But by then guys like Allen and White will be your leaders. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihilarian Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 4 minutes ago, Rico said: Brilliant post! Whaley was the chump of all chumps, seven years of FAILURE. He left a huge mess behind, but it’s no coincidence that the drought was broken the season after he was fired. The people on here who defended him right up to the end and even after have all been appropriately labeled. While I thought Whaley was a bad GM and made many mistakes. This new regime is following right in his footsteps the way they brought in a bunch of bums in free agency and basically ignored the offensive line in the draft. While I'm not going to criticize the drafting of Edmunds with a #1 pick or Phillips with a #3 pick because the team needed them. I have to look at the offensive line and ask wouldn't those two draft picks be better made on an actual NFL center, an OG or two, or a RT. I mean protecting the most important position on the team (QB) should have been a number one priority. Plus, it would help the run game and the defense by keeping them off the field. What's surprising is that the defense is so much worse this year!! Right now the 2018 Buffalo Bills are 31st on offense and 31st on defense! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogblitz Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 Just now, Nihilarian said: While I thought Whaley was a bad GM and made many mistakes. This new regime is following right in his footsteps the way they brought in a bunch of bums in free agency and basically ignored the offensive line in the draft. While I'm not going to criticize the drafting of Edmunds with a #1 pick or Phillips with a #3 pick because the team needed them. I have to look at the offensive line and ask wouldn't those two draft picks be better made on an actual NFL center, an OG or two, or a RT. I mean protecting the most important position on the team (QB) should have been a number one priority. Plus, it would help the run game and the defense by keeping them off the field. What's surprising is that the defense is so much worse this year!! Right now the 2018 Buffalo Bills are 31st on offense and 31st on defense! In the AFC the Bills have scored less points that any other team and give up more points than any other team. If you count the whole league, one team scored less and one other team has given up the same amount of points as us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsredneck1 Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 2 hours ago, Bockeye said: turn on investment: Star Lotul 2 hours ago, Bockeye said: Negative return on investment: Star Lotulelei Trent Murphy Corey Coleman Vonte Davis Kelvin Benjamin Zay Jones Tremaine Edmunds others??? sorry i screwed up the first time, but i think trent is going to be a very key player. i tried to pay close attention to him and he gives me the feeling that he's starting to get in the groove and back in the game. he's gonna make some huge,huge plays this year....and if nate orchard can contribute, we could get badass real quick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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