Chicken Boo Posted September 18, 2018 Share Posted September 18, 2018 14 hours ago, Doc said: Randy Moss. LOL. Laugh now. Cry later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted September 18, 2018 Share Posted September 18, 2018 (edited) 12 hours ago, PlayoffsPlease said: Why does anyone posting on this board think they are smarter about football personnel decisions than then New England Patriots? You don’t think their WR decisions should be questioned? Why? Maybe it works out for them, maybe it won’t. But assuming that it will just because they are a successful franchise is ignoring a lot of reality on the team’s history and the player’s history. Quote By my count, the Patriots have acquired 51 receivers just since 2009 (we won’t even go back to the drought from Deion Branch and David Givens in ’02 to the trades for Moss and Wes Welker in ’07). Judging generously, you could say that four of those moves have been great (Edelman, Danny Amendola, Hogan and Brandin Cooks), and six have been solid to good (Brandon LaFell, Malcolm Mitchell, Dorsett, Patterson and Braxton Berrios — like we said, we’re being generous). The rest — 80.4 percent — have been abject failures. YEAR ACQ GREAT MOVES 2009 Draft Julian Edelman 2013 FA Danny Amendola 2016 FA Chris Hogan 2017 Trade Brandin Cooks YEAR ACQ SOLID MOVES 2012 FA Brandon Lloyd 2014 FA Brandon LaFell 2016 Draft Malcolm Mitchell 2017 Trade Phillip Dorsett 2018 Trade Cordarrelle Patterson 2018 Draft Braxton Berrios YEAR ACQ FAILURES 2009 Draft Brandon Tate 2009 FA Joey Galloway 2009 Trade Greg Lewis 2010 Draft Taylor Price 2010 FA Torry Holt 2011 Trade Chad Ochocinco 2011 FA Tiquan Underwood 2012 Draft Jeremy Ebert 2012 FA Anthony Gonzalez 2012 FA Jesse Holley 2012 Claim Kerry Taylor 2012 Trade Greg Salas 2013 Draft Aaron Dobson 2013 Draft Josh Boyce 2013 FA Michael Jenkins 2013 FA Lavelle Hawkins 2013 FA Austin Collie 2013 FA LaQuan Williams 2014 Draft Jeremy Gallon 2014 FA Brian Tyms 2015 FA Reggie Wayne 2015 Trade Jalen Saunders 2015 Claim DaVaris Daniels 2015 Trade Keshawn Martin 2015 FA Chris Harper 2015 Claim Leonard Hankerson 2016 Draft Devin Lucien 2016 FA Nate Washington 2016 FA Griff Whalen 2016 Claim Michael Floyd 2017 Claim Devin Street 2017 FA Tony Washington 2017 FA K.J. Maye 2017 FA Bernard Reedy 2017 FA Kenny Britt 2018 FA Jordan Matthews 2018 FA Eric Decker 2018 Claim Amara Darboh 2018 Claim Chad Hansen 2018 FA Bennie Fowler 2018 FA Corey Coleman With 12 of those players, the Patriots used actual capital to acquire them with either draft picks or trades. That’s to say nothing of the time wasted on the practice field, in meeting rooms, and with reps from Brady that turned out to be fruitless. That the Patriots are even this position where they need to trade for a player as suspect as Gordon is an indictment on the Patriots’ entire system around the receiver position — and we shouldn’t just whistle past the graveyard about it. https://www.bostonsportsjournal.com/2018/09/18/bedard-trade-josh-gordon-patriots-reached-bottom-wr-years-neglect/ Edited September 18, 2018 by YoloinOhio 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted September 18, 2018 Share Posted September 18, 2018 12 hours ago, Mr. WEO said: I think it would make more sense to see what happens with Allen. Let him throw the bombs. Someone will catch them at Gordon's 25, 35, 50% rate. Word. People overlook that even in his very best NFL season, he was catching passes at a 50% rate. Now I'll grant you Brandon Weedon but Jason Campbell and Brian Hoyer at the time could actually play some. 12 hours ago, Mr. WEO said: Hogan Woods and Goodwin were gone before Beane was hired. True. And yet in hindsight, it seems probable that the decision to hire Beane was made sub rosa when McDermott was brought in. If that's true, it would seem unreasonable to think that Beane lacked input into the decision to hold back from serious negotiations with Woods and Goodwin. Hogan of course left in 2016 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted September 18, 2018 Share Posted September 18, 2018 10 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Word. People overlook that even in his very best NFL season, he was catching passes at a 50% rate. Now I'll grant you Brandon Weedon but Jason Campbell and Brian Hoyer at the time could actually play some. True. And yet in hindsight, it seems probable that the decision to hire Beane was made sub rosa when McDermott was brought in. If that's true, it would seem unreasonable to think that Beane lacked input into the decision to hold back from serious negotiations with Woods and Goodwin. Hogan of course left in 2016 Yes Pete was way off on blaming Beane for those moves. Hard to affect the roster before you have been hired as GM... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PatsFanNH Posted September 18, 2018 Share Posted September 18, 2018 31 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said: “Desperate” is the word I used yesterday Bedard: With trade for Josh Gordon, Patriots have reached bottom at WR after years of neglect Ugh Bedard is an idiot! Pats have White,Gronk,Edelman all top targets for the passing game. Also the Patriots have pretty much always had outside WR talent as they rarely draft WR and when they do they usually sucked! (What happens when your drafting 29th or later all the time) as for his comments on Gordon, first it’s a very very low risk move. Second he has been in Cleveland his entire career and they have sucked his entire career so who would give great effort after awhile. Does that mean he will here? Nope but it doesn’t mean he won’t either. this move was a no brainer for the Pats if he pans out it’s a steal. If he doesn’t you basically lost a 5th and gained a high 6 or high 7. Only people finding fault with it are dumb sports guys with zero clue like Bedard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted September 18, 2018 Share Posted September 18, 2018 Brady doesn't want to heap expectations on Gordon The New England Patriots traded for a much-needed deep threat in Josh Gordon on Monday, which has the fan base dreaming of the Randy Moss years. Quarterback Tom Brady, however, pumped the brakes on Gordon stepping in to become a world-beating presence immediately. "You know, I hate to make projections and expectations. That's not fair," Brady told Jim Gray on Westwood One on Monday night. "I've never met Josh personally, just like I hadn't met some of the guys that have come in the last couple weeks. So we'll see how it goes this week and hopefully he can work hard, put the team first and end up helping us in any role that he can find for himself on the team." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted September 18, 2018 Share Posted September 18, 2018 Right as the Division Championship was in our grasp, we get out-maneuvered by the Pats* again! McBeane asleep at the wheel! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne Cubed Posted September 18, 2018 Share Posted September 18, 2018 35 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said: You don’t think their WR decisions should be questioned? Why? Maybe it works out for them, maybe it won’t. But assuming that it will just because they are a successful franchise is ignoring a lot of reality on the team’s history and the player’s history. https://www.bostonsportsjournal.com/2018/09/18/bedard-trade-josh-gordon-patriots-reached-bottom-wr-years-neglect/ Is Chris Hogan a great move?!?! I'd put it in the solid section, it's not like he became this star receiver there. I'd probably also put Cooks in the solid section too, wasn't even his best season as a pro and again they traded for him for 1 season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PatsFanNH Posted September 18, 2018 Share Posted September 18, 2018 35 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said: You don’t think their WR decisions should be questioned? Why? Maybe it works out for them, maybe it won’t. But assuming that it will just because they are a successful franchise is ignoring a lot of reality on the team’s history and the player’s history. https://www.bostonsportsjournal.com/2018/09/18/bedard-trade-josh-gordon-patriots-reached-bottom-wr-years-neglect/ Meanwhile in the same time span they are one of the top Offenses in the NFL. ? could it be you will strike out more than you hit home runs? Probably.. but you need take the swing to find out if it will work.. (and some of those failures were not even on the team longer than a week lol) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlottebillsfan2 Posted September 18, 2018 Share Posted September 18, 2018 The Browns are still the Browns, why in the world would you trade him to the Pat?. Trade him to an nfc team. Good lord I hate the Browns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billsatlastin2018 Posted September 18, 2018 Share Posted September 18, 2018 Let's see now... 1) A 5 Alarm Tire Fire ? 2) An inside shot of going to the Super Bowl? Even on a WEED jag, I can figure this one out! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted September 18, 2018 Share Posted September 18, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, PatsFanNH said: Meanwhile in the same time span they are one of the top Offenses in the NFL. ? could it be you will strike out more than you hit home runs? Probably.. but you need take the swing to find out if it will work.. (and some of those failures were not even on the team longer than a week lol) Both can be true - they can have a high performing offense, and still strike out at WR personnel decisions. As a fan of the team you know why that is. Even if you take away all of the lazy prep, apathy about winning, drug use, suspension possibility - josh gordon ran the wrong route about half the time he played in game 1 per the all-22. Which is nothing new with him. That happens with Brady and he will not see the field. It’s a low risk move for the Pats because they don’t care about the draft pick. They are in short-term mode. It’s a higher risk move for teams who need the draft pick, who they are in long-term mode. Because the odds are so low it will work out. Edited September 18, 2018 by YoloinOhio 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted September 18, 2018 Share Posted September 18, 2018 So apologies if this was linked upthread and I missed it. The Athletic has an article up (pay, but free trial) claiming that Gordon misled the Browns about the photo session in which he injured his hamstring. He sought and obtained permission to conduct a still-photo shoot for his clothing line in the stadium Friday night. Instead, Gordon brought in personnel to shoot a social media "hype video", for which he did 90 minutes of football-related drills before pulling up lame clutching his hamstring. He showed up 10 minutes late Saturday, went directly to the training room, and was ruled out for Sunday - after which the Browns Braintrust decided "enough, already". So it wasn't the lateness, or the hamstring injury per se, but the fact that he told them he was gonna do a still photo clothing shoot, then was injured doing something completely different. Here's a CBS article quoting the Athletic 18 hours ago, Charlottebillsfan2 said: The best part is they released coleman to make room for him. Yet some fans were going nuts when we released him and they signed him. I'm still going nuts that the Bills traded for then released him so quickly, and were basically paying him $2.9M to play for the Pats. I like it only slightly better now that the Pats and Bills are both paying him to either sit home or play for someone else. Look, Coleman was Bad Attitude Boy at the Browns. If the Bills didn't know that when they traded for him, their pro-personnel evaluation and scouting is no where near what it should be. You got a guy with two years of bad attitude, you might consider if he can turn it around, it's gonna take more than a month. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PatsFanNH Posted September 18, 2018 Share Posted September 18, 2018 11 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said: Both can be true - they can have a high performing offense, and still strike out at WR personnel decisions. As a fan of the team you know why that is. Even if you take away all of the lazy prep, apathy about winning, drug use, suspension possibility - josh gordon ran the wrong route about half the time he played in game 1 per the all-22. Which is nothing new with him. That happens with Brady and he will not see the field. It’s a low risk move for the Pats because they don’t care about the draft pick. They are in short-term mode. It’s a higher risk move for teams who need the draft pick, who they are in long-term mode. Because the odds are so low it will work out. I absolutely agree with everything you said. The Pats are in a win now mode, and a 5th rounder isn’t going make that big of a difference one way or another. Very few teams have the luxury the patriots do, by that I mean that even if this ends up a huge huge bust. (Which it may)’fans wont care. They won’t be burning BB online or in forums.. because they have won for so long the man is pretty much untouchable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted September 18, 2018 Share Posted September 18, 2018 2 hours ago, Chicken Boo said: Laugh now. Cry later. Crying from laughing? OK. 2 hours ago, Charlottebillsfan2 said: The Browns are still the Browns, why in the world would you trade him to the Pat?. Trade him to an nfc team. Good lord I hate the Browns. Word was that there was a bigger market for Dan Bailey than Gordon. Considering only 2 teams were looking for a new kicker... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CommonCents Posted September 18, 2018 Share Posted September 18, 2018 Gordon looks to be in the best shape of any WR in the league, I saw a picture of him running in a tank and shorts, the size and definition of his arms is incredible. How is a guy that keeps himself in such good shape so uninterested in the game. It boggles my mind a bit, he has easily cost himself 50+ million bucks. It’s obviously not a lazy man issue. Everything I hear about him is that he isn’t stupid. I don’t get it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted September 18, 2018 Share Posted September 18, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PlayoffsPlease Posted September 18, 2018 Share Posted September 18, 2018 9 hours ago, YoloinOhio said: You don’t think their WR decisions should be questioned? Why? Maybe it works out for them, maybe it won’t. But assuming that it will just because they are a successful franchise is ignoring a lot of reality on the team’s history and the player’s history. https://www.bostonsportsjournal.com/2018/09/18/bedard-trade-josh-gordon-patriots-reached-bottom-wr-years-neglect/ Based on your post, I am quite confident you are not smarter than the Patriots front office. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bing Bong Posted September 18, 2018 Share Posted September 18, 2018 8 hours ago, YoloinOhio said: they can have a high performing offense, and still strike out at WR personnel decisions. Pretty sure Beli wouldn't care if he strikes out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted September 19, 2018 Share Posted September 19, 2018 (edited) 2 hours ago, PetermanThrew5Picks said: Pretty sure Beli wouldn't care if he strikes out. No he doesn’t care about the draft pick. Gave a 5th for a year of Gillislee, he had one good game and cut. Hasn’t cared in a few years; has favored trading picks for established players. He has no investment in the future of that team. Can’t really blame him Edited September 19, 2018 by YoloinOhio 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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