Training Camp Experience

[Virgil]

Took the daughter and some friends to training camp on Sunday, which was my first trip in probably 6-8 years.  Some of this is going to come off like a "Get of my Lawn!" post, but I was really disappointed with the changes that have occurred.  

 

Let me just start with the VIP guests because that's my biggest overall gripe.  First off, the places I used to park and get the quickest shuttle in is now a VIP parking lot.  They can park and walk right in without a shuttle.  Then, when you get to the field, you can't be right up on the fence on the home side, because again, it's been blocked off for the VIP members.  Then you also have the tent areas, which were like gold on a hot day, only for the VIP areas.  In fact, there was almost no areas of shade for regular visitors.  

 

Then we have player access.  They did have their normal tent with 2 players signing and another note about which positions would visit the fence for autographs, so good for them.  But overall, they've now completely blocked off access to the players from the facility to the field.  I don't know why this matters to me, but it just felt strange to me.  The only place you could see a player up close was if you happened to sit on the overlook on the bleachers where they walked out on the field.  Kudos to Tre White for stopping to sign autographs, but that area maybe fit 10 total people and they obviously weren't going to move.  So these people just locked themselves to the fence right there and didn't let any kids get close.  Judging the amount of stuff they had to sign, I believe they knew what they were doing and were sellers.  

 

The kids area was weaker than I remember.  They had a large beer pong setup where the balls kept deflecting off the cups and hitting the kids around them.  They got rid of the field goal kick and the going out for a pass experience.  It's also all on pavement now.  Overall, just a weaker experience and the kids were disappointed.  

 

Lastly, and this pissed me off the most in the moment but it's probably from me having a kid.  The whole point in me wanting to go was to have my daughter meet some players, get some signatures, and start her fandom off right.  She was all excited.  All I wanted was a White Bills Shirt or Jersey.  Just something she could get signed.  Do you know what they don't sell there?  White Bills apparel for kids.  No hats, no visors, no shirts, no jerseys.  I about lost it.  Not only had I shopped the Rochester area for the past few days at no less than 10 stores, but even they didn't have anything.  Am I crazy for thinking a generic white Bills jersey for kids would be a basic item at training camp?  I mean, c'mon?  They had mini-helmets for $32, seriously?

 

Oh yeah, and they didn't even collect the tickets you supposedly needed to get into the practice.  So that was a wasted trip by my friends to get them.

 

Sorry for the rant.  I feel like a grumpy old man, but it all pissed me off.  

 

Actual Practice Notes:

• We have some tiny WR's out there.  
• Shaq is slow
• All of the QB's showed some solid accuracy and made me even better about the position after the preseason game.
• If I had to pick a starter right now, and I'll change my mind the minute he's in a game and sees any real pressure, it would be Peterman
• McCoy still looks fast and versatile as ever
• This offense is all about quick release, spreading the field, and placing the ball all over the field.  Lot's of wheel routes too.

 

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

10 minutes ago, Virgil said:

Took the daughter and some friends to training camp on Sunday, which was my first trip in probably 6-8 years.  Some of this is going to come off like a "Get of my Lawn!" post, but I was really disappointed with the changes that have occurred.  

 

Let me just start with the VIP guests because that's my biggest overall gripe.  First off, the places I used to park and get the quickest shuttle in is now a VIP parking lot.  They can park and walk right in without a shuttle.  Then, when you get to the field, you can't be right up on the fence on the home side, because again, it's been blocked off for the VIP members.  Then you also have the tent areas, which were like gold on a hot day, only for the VIP areas.  In fact, there was almost no areas of shade for regular visitors.  

 

Then we have player access.  They did have their normal tent with 2 players signing and another note about which positions would visit the fence for autographs, so good for them.  But overall, they've now completely blocked off access to the players from the facility to the field.  I don't know why this matters to me, but it just felt strange to me.  The only place you could see a player up close was if you happened to sit on the overlook on the bleachers where they walked out on the field.  Kudos to Tre White for stopping to sign autographs, but that area maybe fit 10 total people and they obviously weren't going to move.  So these people just locked themselves to the fence right there and didn't let any kids get close.  Judging the amount of stuff they had to sign, I believe they knew what they were doing and were sellers.  

 

The kids area was weaker than I remember.  They had a large beer pong setup where the balls kept deflecting off the cups and hitting the kids around them.  They got rid of the field goal kick and the going out for a pass experience.  It's also all on pavement now.  Overall, just a weaker experience and the kids were disappointed.  

 

Lastly, and this pissed me off the most in the moment but it's probably from me having a kid.  The whole point in me wanting to go was to have my daughter meet some players, get some signatures, and start her fandom off right.  She was all excited.  All I wanted was a White Bills Shirt or Jersey.  Just something she could get signed.  Do you know what they don't sell there?  White Bills apparel for kids.  No hats, no visors, no shirts, no jerseys.  I about lost it.  Not only had I shopped the Rochester area for the past few days at no less than 10 stores, but even they didn't have anything.  Am I crazy for thinking a generic white Bills jersey for kids would be a basic item at training camp?  I mean, c'mon?  They had mini-helmets for $32, seriously?

 

Oh yeah, and they didn't even collect the tickets you supposedly needed to get into the practice.  So that was a wasted trip by my friends to get them.

 

Sorry for the rant.  I feel like a grumpy old man, but it all pissed me off.  

 

Actual Practice Notes:

• We have some tiny WR's out there.  
• Shaq is slow
• All of the QB's showed some solid accuracy and made me even better about the position after the preseason game.
• If I had to pick a starter right now, and I'll change my mind the minute he's in a game and sees any real pressure, it would be Peterman
• McCoy still looks fast and versatile as ever
• This offense is all about quick release, spreading the field, and placing the ball all over the field.  Lot's of wheel routes too.

 

 

Thoughts of Shady wheeling are a beautiful thing 

 

sorry about the rest of it bei g a let down for the kiddos 

[White Linen]

7 of our 13 WR's at camp are 6'2" or taller.

Edited August 13, 2018 by White Linen

[Johnny Hammersticks]

Interesting observations.  Must have been a bad day for autographs.  The past two TC visits, I have purchased the TC program for my son to get autographs.  Last year, he only got one from Tyrod.  This year, he got like 9 or 10.  Just put his program/sharpie through the fence along the bleachers, and the players just kept coming.

 

Bummer you had a bad experience.

[Virgil]

3 minutes ago, Johnny Hammersticks said:

Interesting observations.  Must have been a bad day for autographs.  The past two TC visits, I have purchased the TC program for my son to get autographs.  Last year, he only got one from Tyrod.  This year, he got like 9 or 10.  Just put his program/sharpie through the fence along the bleachers, and the players just kept coming.

 

Bummer you had a bad experience.

 

Yeah, there were two large groups that wouldn't let anyone past them.  I wasn't going to try shove my 5 year old daughter in there.  It was ridiculous

7 minutes ago, White Linen said:

7 of our 13 WR's at camp are 6'2" or taller.

 

And 6 under 4'

[Johnny Hammersticks]

2 minutes ago, Virgil said:

 

Yeah, there were two large groups that wouldn't let anyone past them.  I wasn't going to try shove my 5 year old daughter in there.  It was ridiculous

 

Yeah, the adults who push and shove kids aside to get their autographs (that they are likely to put up for sale on EBay) are ridiculous.  

 

I’ve done this a couple times recently, so as soon as the final horn sounds I am already making my way down with my son to the fence.  I stand right behind him and box him in, so none of the jerks can nudge him aside.  

[stevewin]

I went for a few days a couple weeks ago - first time I had gone in probably 10 years - and also noticed less easy access to be closer to the field (I remember being able to wander around the fence close to the field and being able to pick and choose and get close to various drills/players over the course of practice). 

 

At the end of one of the practices we ended up talking to a guy who has worked the camp for years - he mentioned that McD is much more focused on actual effective practice for the players than "fan experience".  He mentioned the clusterF last year where players were off on the other fan-inaccesible field to give the main field a break where fans who showed up couldn't even see the players and people who worked there were like "really coach?" but he stuck to his guns (the reason for the closed to the public practices this year).  He implied that the new regime is pretty demanding and very specific on their requirements during the camp.  Not sure why fan accessibility and effective practice need to be exclusive - but imagine some of it is to try to minimize distractions - and I'm sure there is probably an amped up security aspect in this day and age.

 

BTW - one of the days I actually had VIP tickets - and the actual view of practice (other perks notwithstanding) from those areas wasn't necessarily better than just being in the stands.  Being on the field but restricted to small area makes it hard to see all that is going on (overall view of practice was much better from the stands)

[eball]

[Augie]

I blame Russ. 

[fansince88]

And @Virgil, Astro wasnt there.....you didnt mention that.

[Ned Flanders]

10 minutes ago, stevewin said:

McD is much more focused on actual effective practice for the players than "fan experience".  He mentioned the clusterF last year where players were off on the other fan-inaccesible field to give the main field a break where fans who showed up couldn't even see the players and people who worked there were like "really coach?" but he stuck to his guns (the reason for the closed to the public practices this year).

I think there's two more years on the SJF contract?  After the contract runs out, the Bills will be holding camp at OBD.  With the new facilities coming and all, and with most teams now using their own practice fields, I believe McBeane, or whoever's in charge at the time, will look to get the Bills having camp locally.  As a Rochester native, I hope I'm wrong, but I think the Bills are not too long for SJF.

[eball]

1 minute ago, Ned Flanders said:

I think there's two more years on the SJF contract?  After the contract runs out, the Bills will be holding camp at OBD.  With the new facilities coming and all, and with most teams now using their own practice fields, I believe McBeane, or whoever's in charge at the time, will look to get the Bills having camp locally.  As a Rochester native, I hope I'm wrong, but I think the Bills are not too long for SJF.

 

I agree, this is clearly where they are headed.  Look no further than the SOTA workout facility they are building next to the fieldhouse.  I presume they will finish out the deal with SJF but I don't seen a renewal in the works.

[stevewin]

5 minutes ago, Ned Flanders said:

I think there's two more years on the SJF contract?  After the contract runs out, the Bills will be holding camp at OBD.  With the new facilities coming and all, and with most teams now using their own practice fields, I believe McBeane, or whoever's in charge at the time, will look to get the Bills having camp locally.  As a Rochester native, I hope I'm wrong, but I think the Bills are not too long for SJF.

One interesting thing I heard Beane mention recently in an interview was some of the benefits of having camp away from home - players immersed and not distracted by family obligations etc, forced bonding in close quarters etc.  

 

Edited August 13, 2018 by stevewin

[corta765]

So I understand your gripes and frustrations and will react to those in a second. BUT please please please remember NFL teams are moving away from doing training camps instead preferring to do it at the main training facility with limited fan access. I don't disagree on a lot of what you said but please remember that there could very possibly be a day when we don't get this access or you have to pay for it etc.. That would super duper suck. I have a kid on the way in January and can't wait in a few years to go to camp especailly living here in Rochester. It's free and a great first football experience then the chaos of a real game.

 

That said:

-Crowd/Autograph: You may have just went on a bad day crowd wise. When I went Thursday August 1st in the morning there was a crowd but I got Poyer's autograph after. Basically if you hang at a certain place (depending on the player granted) a lot of times it's easier to get an autograph. I know Allen stayed late and signed a lot for people. Eddie Yarborough and Harrison Phillips also were there and you easily could've got there's if you wanted it. But this was all not a ticketed practice. Ticketed practices I will say are a zoo and unfortunately a lot of adults could give two craps about a kids experience sadly. I have found to try and avoid those at this point because of the chaos and lack of respect to others.

-Merchandise: 1000% agree. Back in the Marrone era you could by a ton of different stuff and they really had a nice diversified amount of gear. Now it is not only more expensive, but the gear is so basic it's like their not trying. I've been going to camp since 2009 and I have seen the shift with gear. I completely get your frustration.

-Kids Setup: So the day we were there they had pony's for kids to ride where they use to do the Pass and Kick thing because it was Wild West theme'd day. Additionally they were giving out cowboy hats for fans. I actually thought the setup was better then previous for everyone, although I do agree the beer pong probably should've been elsewhere. Perhaps on non-theme day's they could utilize the area better with more kids stuff.

-VIP: This I also agree with and is sad reality of the NFL now where it's corporate 100% of the time. The Bills like every team have made a concerted effort to the VIP crowd and at points its frustrating because a lot of the autograph stuff is now favored for them first and makes it very hard to get those players. I actually called about the VIP thing to see the cost and basically it's like $1000, doesn't include food or drink, and just gives you access to that area. Now if you can gather enough people that's not awful, but are you really wanting to spend even $50 at a free event because you might get a better autograph or picture?

6 minutes ago, eball said:

 

I agree, this is clearly where they are headed.  Look no further than the SOTA workout facility they are building next to the fieldhouse.  I presume they will finish out the deal with SJF but I don't seen a renewal in the works.

 

As a Rochester resident I sadly agree. Having camp here is awesome because of the energy it brings to the area for the team, but literally everyone is now doing practice in house and I just can't see this lasting.

 

The real shame of it is the amount of fans here in Rochester who actually get the team for a bit rather then having to go to Buffalo for everything. Say what you want about R. Brandon but he did a great job giving us in Rochester opportunities to see the team and the feeling it was part of our region not just Buffalo. I am nervous if camp leaves that the interest won't be as high here but I could be wrong.

[Virgil]

27 minutes ago, fansince88 said:

And @Virgil, Astro wasnt there.....you didnt mention that.

 

I know, I left the airport for this and probably missed Mack.  I’m sorry 

[CodeMonkey]

48 minutes ago, Ned Flanders said:

I think there's two more years on the SJF contract?  After the contract runs out, the Bills will be holding camp at OBD.  With the new facilities coming and all, and with most teams now using their own practice fields, I believe McBeane, or whoever's in charge at the time, will look to get the Bills having camp locally.  As a Rochester native, I hope I'm wrong, but I think the Bills are not too long for SJF.

Kim Pegula statement back in May ...

“We really enjoy our summers at training camp at St. John Fisher and the relationship we continue to have with the school. We have four years remaining on our current agreement with them and preparations are already underway for camp this summer. Rochester is an important market for the Bills, our entire company, and for me personally, being that it’s my hometown.”

1 hour ago, Virgil said:

Took the daughter and some friends to training camp on Sunday, which was my first trip in probably 6-8 years.  Some of this is going to come off like a "Get of my Lawn!" post, but I was really disappointed with the changes that have occurred.  

 

Let me just start with the VIP guests because that's my biggest overall gripe.  First off, the places I used to park and get the quickest shuttle in is now a VIP parking lot.  They can park and walk right in without a shuttle.  Then, when you get to the field, you can't be right up on the fence on the home side, because again, it's been blocked off for the VIP members.  Then you also have the tent areas, which were like gold on a hot day, only for the VIP areas.  In fact, there was almost no areas of shade for regular visitors.  

 

Then we have player access.  They did have their normal tent with 2 players signing and another note about which positions would visit the fence for autographs, so good for them.  But overall, they've now completely blocked off access to the players from the facility to the field.  I don't know why this matters to me, but it just felt strange to me.  The only place you could see a player up close was if you happened to sit on the overlook on the bleachers where they walked out on the field.  Kudos to Tre White for stopping to sign autographs, but that area maybe fit 10 total people and they obviously weren't going to move.  So these people just locked themselves to the fence right there and didn't let any kids get close.  Judging the amount of stuff they had to sign, I believe they knew what they were doing and were sellers.  

 

The kids area was weaker than I remember.  They had a large beer pong setup where the balls kept deflecting off the cups and hitting the kids around them.  They got rid of the field goal kick and the going out for a pass experience.  It's also all on pavement now.  Overall, just a weaker experience and the kids were disappointed.  

 

Lastly, and this pissed me off the most in the moment but it's probably from me having a kid.  The whole point in me wanting to go was to have my daughter meet some players, get some signatures, and start her fandom off right.  She was all excited.  All I wanted was a White Bills Shirt or Jersey.  Just something she could get signed.  Do you know what they don't sell there?  White Bills apparel for kids.  No hats, no visors, no shirts, no jerseys.  I about lost it.  Not only had I shopped the Rochester area for the past few days at no less than 10 stores, but even they didn't have anything.  Am I crazy for thinking a generic white Bills jersey for kids would be a basic item at training camp?  I mean, c'mon?  They had mini-helmets for $32, seriously?

 

Oh yeah, and they didn't even collect the tickets you supposedly needed to get into the practice.  So that was a wasted trip by my friends to get them.

 

Sorry for the rant.  I feel like a grumpy old man, but it all pissed me off.  

 

Actual Practice Notes:

• We have some tiny WR's out there.  
• Shaq is slow
• All of the QB's showed some solid accuracy and made me even better about the position after the preseason game.
• If I had to pick a starter right now, and I'll change my mind the minute he's in a game and sees any real pressure, it would be Peterman
• McCoy still looks fast and versatile as ever
• This offense is all about quick release, spreading the field, and placing the ball all over the field.  Lot's of wheel routes too.

 

Seems like things have changed since I last went.  My kids are all older now so I haven't been.  The VIP area wasn't nearly as invasive then as now it seems.

I suggest going on the last day of camp if possible.  At least back then, and I think they still do this, the players go to the fences all around and give away stuff they used in camp.  We have a Fitz autographed shoe around somewhere, plus QB hand towels (the ones they hang off their belts) and other stuff.

Edited August 13, 2018 by CodeMonkey

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

1 hour ago, Augie said:

I blame Russ. 

Unsubstantiated reports claim he was working on a 'VERY VIP' experience, but particulars cannot be discussed in a family friendly forum.

[thenorthremembers]

2 hours ago, Virgil said:

Took the daughter and some friends to training camp on Sunday, which was my first trip in probably 6-8 years.  Some of this is going to come off like a "Get of my Lawn!" post, but I was really disappointed with the changes that have occurred.  

 

Let me just start with the VIP guests because that's my biggest overall gripe.  First off, the places I used to park and get the quickest shuttle in is now a VIP parking lot.  They can park and walk right in without a shuttle.  Then, when you get to the field, you can't be right up on the fence on the home side, because again, it's been blocked off for the VIP members.  Then you also have the tent areas, which were like gold on a hot day, only for the VIP areas.  In fact, there was almost no areas of shade for regular visitors.  

 

Then we have player access.  They did have their normal tent with 2 players signing and another note about which positions would visit the fence for autographs, so good for them.  But overall, they've now completely blocked off access to the players from the facility to the field.  I don't know why this matters to me, but it just felt strange to me.  The only place you could see a player up close was if you happened to sit on the overlook on the bleachers where they walked out on the field.  Kudos to Tre White for stopping to sign autographs, but that area maybe fit 10 total people and they obviously weren't going to move.  So these people just locked themselves to the fence right there and didn't let any kids get close.  Judging the amount of stuff they had to sign, I believe they knew what they were doing and were sellers.  

 

The kids area was weaker than I remember.  They had a large beer pong setup where the balls kept deflecting off the cups and hitting the kids around them.  They got rid of the field goal kick and the going out for a pass experience.  It's also all on pavement now.  Overall, just a weaker experience and the kids were disappointed.  

 

Lastly, and this pissed me off the most in the moment but it's probably from me having a kid.  The whole point in me wanting to go was to have my daughter meet some players, get some signatures, and start her fandom off right.  She was all excited.  All I wanted was a White Bills Shirt or Jersey.  Just something she could get signed.  Do you know what they don't sell there?  White Bills apparel for kids.  No hats, no visors, no shirts, no jerseys.  I about lost it.  Not only had I shopped the Rochester area for the past few days at no less than 10 stores, but even they didn't have anything.  Am I crazy for thinking a generic white Bills jersey for kids would be a basic item at training camp?  I mean, c'mon?  They had mini-helmets for $32, seriously?

 

Oh yeah, and they didn't even collect the tickets you supposedly needed to get into the practice.  So that was a wasted trip by my friends to get them.

 

Sorry for the rant.  I feel like a grumpy old man, but it all pissed me off.  

 

Actual Practice Notes:

• We have some tiny WR's out there.  
• Shaq is slow
• All of the QB's showed some solid accuracy and made me even better about the position after the preseason game.
• If I had to pick a starter right now, and I'll change my mind the minute he's in a game and sees any real pressure, it would be Peterman
• McCoy still looks fast and versatile as ever
• This offense is all about quick release, spreading the field, and placing the ball all over the field.  Lot's of wheel routes too.

 

I share all the sentiments here.  I used to go 3-4 times a year when I was still in college, mid two thousands.  I did go two years ago with my then five year old son, and even before McDermott the changes had started as far as player access and visibility. 

 

I also share the sentiment about the public access to the team since McDermott has taken over.   In a way it kind of stinks because I'd like my son to experience similar things to what I did growing up and becoming a fan.  However, if the added focus has results like last year my son won't have to watch crap football his entire life.  So I take the good with the bad.   I think you're from out of town, but Kyle Williams is doing a signing at Dave and Adams soon.  No better example of a player to meet with you and your daughter if you have time.

[Just Jack]

38 minutes ago, Ridgewaycynic2013 said:

Unsubstantiated reports claim he was working on a 'VERY VIP' experience, but particulars cannot be discussed in a family friendly forum.

 

Unfortunatly the plan ended when they ended the Jills program. 

[section122]

I have sat in the VIP areas a coupe of times and was there for the national MS society.  I talked with the staff there on both occasions and the VIP sections are regularly used/utilized by groups that are non-profit or work with people with disabilities.  It isn't (wasn't) common that they were just private groups.  The best part was being shaded and being able to see both fields.  The VIP parking was nice as it allowed me to only have to transfer my mom once instead of multiple times and on/off the bus.

 

Just a little different perspective on them.  Not saying it is always the case but again there may be more than meets the eye there.