Step-by-step, how the Bills knew Josh Allen was right for them

[Hapless Bills Fan]

5 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

I know where Rudolph was drafted, but I don’t know where other teams had them ranked. Steelers said they had a 1st rd grade on him.

 

Fair point in general, but if the Steelers had a 1st round grade on Rudolph why did they wait to take him until the 3rd?

[Shaw66]

1 hour ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

There was a thread about Darnold sometime back and how the NYJ had all this QB work done while Brandon Beane was saying "we're not ready to rank them yet..." blah blah at the Combine.  I called "shenanigans" and said they'd done the work, Beane might not be ready to do a final ranking but they'd been doing homework, watching film, live games as much as any team in need of a QB.

 

From this, it would appear "shenanigans" was the right call.

 

 

I thought the same thing.  People here really misconstrued what Beane said.  

 

However, I also didn't trust people here who said his accuracy problems, to the extent he actually has any, we're due to footwork.  Beane confirms that that IS the problem and that he's already gone a long way toward fixing it. 

 

Thanks Yolo!

[Sky Diver]

2 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Fair point in general, but if the Steelers had a 1st round grade on Rudolph why did they wait to take him until the 3rd?

 

They liked him and had him graded as a 1st rd talent, but QB wasn't a pressing need, however, they couldn't resist when he fell to the 3rd?

[Shaw66]

34 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

He says more than McDermott.  There are little nuggets in Beane's pressers.  You have to read between the lines but they are there.  McDermott speaks for 18 minutes, give or take, every Monday of the season and says absolutely nothing at all.  It is quite a skill. 

I agree, except that McD DOES say some things about the "process" that are revealing.  Never anything about players.  

[YoloinOhio]

10 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Fair point in general, but if the Steelers had a 1st round grade on Rudolph why did they wait to take him until the 3rd?

They lied? Or they knew he would be there later based on intel from other teams. I also don’t think they wanted to take a qb in the 1st for Ben’s psyche. They did well by getting him a WR first to replace pothead (but it was Rudolph’s WR from ok state so)

9 minutes ago, Sky Diver said:

 

They liked him and had him graded as a 1st rd talent, but QB wasn't a pressing need, however, they couldn't resist when he fell to the 3rd?

They took a S in the first, no? They had no choice there. Their secondary has doomed them since Polamalu retired. 

[GunnerBill]

26 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Apparently they also had Jackson off their board then?

 

Interesting QB scouting evaluations per your source considering that Mayfield went 1st overall and Mason Rudolph fell to the 3rd.

 

 

Why were Jackson, Mayfield, and Rosen off their board, and why did they have Rudolph ranked 2 rounds higher than anyone else?

 

 

My source was that Mayfield and Rosen were both subject to concerns about their fit in the organisation and willingness to buy into the process.  I don't know that they had a 1st round grade on Rudolph either (though I have heard since that 5 franchises did) but just that they were willing to take him later in the first.  He would not have been the pick at 12.  I understand the Bills were not high on Jackson at any stage.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

9 minutes ago, Sky Diver said:

They liked him and had him graded as a 1st rd talent, but QB wasn't a pressing need, however, they couldn't resist when he fell to the 3rd?

 

Haha good point.  NYGiants, Steelers, and Baltimore - three teams whose "pressing" need for QB may appear different externally than internally.  I may think their need is more pressing than they do.  Big Ben is a beast, but he's getting flakier and flakier - "maybe I'll retire" is an increasing crescendo, and he essentially just ran their highly successful OC out of town (and they let him).   Baltimore took Jackson at the bottom of the 1st.   If the Steelers really liked Rudolph, had him graded as a 1st, I would kind of have expected them to trade up and take him in the 2nd - but maybe it's as Yolo says, they were catering to Big Ben and his Ego (doesn't that sound like a punk Rock Band?).

 

On the other hand, they got James Washington in the 2nd and OMG do I have a thing for that guy as a WR.  He made Rudolph look like a 1st round grade QB IMO.

[Jay_Fixit]

I always thought they read jrober38’s posts and did the opposite.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

6 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

They lied? Or they knew he would be there later based on intel from other teams. I also don’t think they wanted to take a qb in the 1st for Ben’s psyche. They did well by getting him a WR first to replace pothead (but it was Rudolph’s WR from ok state so)

They took a S in the first, no? They had no choice there. Their secondary has doomed them since Polamalu retired. 

 

Hey, hey.  I thought all these teams drafted BPA because doing otherwise dooms a team to mediocrity.  Think I read that here, or in a Buddy Nix interview, or somewhere.

 

They drafted Terrel Edmunds, Tremaine's brother.

[C.Biscuit97]

1 hour ago, eball said:

But, but, but...COMPLETION PERCENTAGE!!!!!

Yup!  Who cares how a qb performed in college??? I only want good guys who clean the city of Buffalo!

2 hours ago, Sky Diver said:

That's all fine and good, but where is his plan to fix the NCAA?

He was too busy tweeting racist stuff!

[Shaw66]

19 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

My source was that Mayfield and Rosen were both subject to concerns about their fit in the organisation and willingness to buy into the process.  I don't know that they had a 1st round grade on Rudolph either (though I have heard since that 5 franchises did) but just that they were willing to take him later in the first.  He would not have been the pick at 12.  I understand the Bills were not high on Jackson at any stage.

This doesn't surprise me. I listen pretty carefully to what they say about the process, and Mayfield and Rosen each had issues that suggested they wouldn't fit. McB have been clear that fitting the system is a critical component in their decision making. 

 

So Darnold and Allen at the top of their board makes sense. 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

35 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

I thought the same thing.  People here really misconstrued what Beane said.  

 

However, I also didn't trust people here who said his accuracy problems, to the extent he actually has any, we're due to footwork.  Beane confirms that that IS the problem and that he's already gone a long way toward fixing it. 

 

Thanks Yolo!

 

See, here's my thing about that and FWIW I believe Buffalo716 has said similar....Bandit thinks footwork IIRC.

 

With Lamar Jackson, if I stop the film just before he throws, if I can see his feet and hips I can tell you right then if it will be an accurate throw or not.

With Josh Allen, I could NOT do that.  That said....the Bills brass should have an added dimension where they could rule out throws that went "WTF?" because they were anticipation throws and the WR or RB did not run the route Allen expected, as he expected it.  In "The Wakeup Call" series with Kirk Cousins, Allen and Cousins break down a play where IIRC Allen said he and the RB were not on the same page reacting to the coverage.   Also, Palmer said something about Allen overstrides with his front foot and the mechanics issues that follow - I would NOT see an "overstride" from an appropriate stride in a 6'5" guy.

 

But really Shaw...would you expect anything but positivity from Beane at this point?  I mean, I wouldn't expect Beane to say "yeah, he ran a pro-style offense, but his line was such crap and the offense so simplified that we really have no clue if he can progress in his reads like a real NFL pocket passer needs to, or not"

 

 

 

 

[GunnerBill]

7 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

 

With Lamar Jackson, if I stop the film just before he throws, if I can see his feet and hips I can tell you right then if it will be an accurate throw or not.

With Josh Allen, I could NOT do that. 

 

 

And I was exactly the same Hapless.  That is why I called it "natural inaccuracy".

[eball]

24 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Yup!  Who cares how a qb performed in college??? I only want good guys who clean the city of Buffalo!

 

 

As far as I know Josh Allen hasn't so much as picked up a broom.  Bust!

[26CornerBlitz]

7 minutes ago, eball said:

 

As far as I know Josh Allen hasn't so much as picked up a broom.  Bust!

 

Broom or bust!

[Shaw66]

29 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

See, .

 

But really Shaw...would you expect anything but positivity from Beane at this point?  I mean, I wouldn't expect Beane to say "yeah, he ran a pro-style offense, but his line was such crap and the offense so simplified that we really have no clue if he can progress in his reads like a real NFL pocket passer needs to, or not"

 

 

 

 

I DO believe Beane.  Everything I have heard from him seems like he is completely straight when he talks.  McD is all coach-speak, but not Beane. 

 

Particularly in this case.  Beane is VERY serious about how he uses his picks, and if he had major problems with Allen, he wouldn't have moved up for him.  It's obvious by  where they took him that they really liked him,  so what he says in this interview is totally believable to me.  

[Sky Diver]

49 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Yup!  Who cares how a qb performed in college??? I only want good guys who clean the city of Buffalo!

He was too busy tweeting racist stuff!

 

His teammates don’t think what he did as a young teen has any significance, but you seem awfully concerned about it. If I thought my QB was a racist, I would be looking for another team. Curious how you can support the Bills given your malice towards Allen.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

1 minute ago, Shaw66 said:

I DO believe Beane.  Everything I have heard from him seems like he is completely straight when he talks.  McD is all coach-speak, but not Beane. 

 

Particularly in this case.  Beane is VERY serious about how he uses his picks, and if he had major problems with Allen, he wouldn't have moved up for him.  It's obvious by  where they took him that they really liked him,  so what he says in this interview is totally believable to me.  

 

I think you're missing a distinction here, Shaw.  I'm not saying that Beane isn't straight when he talks.  I think he is.

But he is *careful* what he says, and very precise.

 

[John from Riverside]

There is some really good stuff in that article.......

 

It is as I always thought about the completion percentage.....they didnt give him a lot of stuff that is easy to complete to keep that up.....pro style offense......

 

The only thing is....now we need to see him complete the easy stuff so we know he can do it....i will trust our staff

[TigerJ]

1 hour ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Fair point in general, but if the Steelers had a 1st round grade on Rudolph why did they wait to take him until the 3rd?

They also had first round grades on the guys they drafted in the first and second rounds?  Rudolph was drafted to be developed for the future and not to play right away, while the priority in the first couple rounds was to draft players who would contribute immediately?  I don't know, but that's what I would speculate.