JohnC Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 7 hours ago, Mr. WEO said: Reports at the time were the at least 6 other teams passed on him for this reason. How many more teams do you think were considering using their top 1-18 pick on Shaq's position? It's easy to conclude that every team picking before the Bills passed on Shaq for the medical clearance. As for the timing --sooner when?? The admission that he would, after all, need surgery was announced less than 3 weeks after the draft. It's clear to me that Whaley figured that other teams would pass on his for this reason and he wanted Shaq so badly, he happily took him in the first round thinking "sure, he'll need this surgery ASAP, we will schedule it as soon in the off season as possible (after some 'occurrence'), and he will be ready to go in a few months and he will be a STEAL and I will be seen as a GENIUS!". 2 seasons later the fully functional Shaq may not even make the roster because he, with or without an injury/surgery, isn't that good. Whaley's drafting, in a nutshell.... As you noted the real issue wasn't so much about his injury status as it was how he was evaluated. To a lesser extent than with EJ Manuel he was over-valued as a prospect. This regime has demonstrated that they are not committed to the players that the previous regime brought in. Signing Trent Murphy may indicate that this staff has a replacement player already in place if Lawson doesn't elevate his game. Where I disagree with you in this discussion is that I don't believe that the injury issue that plagued the player in college was as influential in other teams bypassing him in the draft. It was simply a case that there was simply a case where their evaluations were different from Whaley's evaluation. If Lawson can improve his game to the point where he becomes a dependable rotational lineman then I will be more than satisfied. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColoradoBills Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 9 hours ago, billsfan89 said: Would any team be willing to trade for him if he isn't lighting it up in camp? Does he have a whole lot of value if he comes off 2 bad seasons and a training camp/pre-season so bad that his team is willing to trade him for a 7th? If Shaq is really bad I suspect he is more than likely cut. Unless that former third-round pick from the Giants (whose name escapes me at the moment) and the rest of the other 3 DE's outperform Shaq at an amazing level where the Bills are trading Shaq out of luxury. So in my mind this training camp is it for him do or die. I hear what you're saying '89 but I don't think Shaq has performed poorly, just not to 1st round talent level. I believe he stays as depth this year with Buffalo or is traded. I guess we all find out during TC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4merper4mer Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 14 hours ago, Mr. WEO said: Can I consult the two other "will Shaq be on the roster?' threads and get back to you on this? As long as you are a prick about it when you come back to report. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4merper4mer Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 26 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said: Reports at the time were the at least 6 other teams passed on him for this reason. How many more teams do you think were considering using their top 1-18 pick on Shaq's position? It's easy to conclude that every team picking before the Bills passed on Shaq for the medical clearance. As for the timing --sooner when?? The admission that he would, after all, need surgery was announced less than 3 weeks after the draft. It's clear to me that Whaley figured that other teams would pass on his for this reason and he wanted Shaq so badly, he happily took him in the first round thinking "sure, he'll need this surgery ASAP, we will schedule it as soon in the off season as possible (after some 'occurrence'), and he will be ready to go in a few months and he will be a STEAL and I will be seen as a GENIUS!". 2 seasons later the fully functional Shaq may not even make the roster because he, with or without an injury/surgery, isn't that good. Whaley's drafting, in a nutshell.... Are you going to completely leave out the look the rest of that draft had while you discuss Lawson? You know....crappy players that only Rex could love? Pin it all on Whaley. Maybe he thought our medical staff could be like yours and give them all the TB12 juice. BTW, Rex and Whaley are both gone, you can just feel the Bills gaining on your beloved Pats, so your reaction is to talk about Shawn Merriman? Well, the Pats cleared Ted Johnson didn't they? It does happen with other staffs you know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed_Formerly_of_Roch Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 14 hours ago, BuffaloRush said: If you look at the depth chart at OTA’s Shaq is probably the 4th DE on the roster behind Hughes, Murphy and Yarborough. He’s really going to have to work his way on the field. I can see a Reggie Ragland type trade unless Shaq has a big preseason. The one thing Lawson has going for him is a cheap contract. Think he may have to outplay Hughes, they then keep Shaq and cut Hughes for $$ reasons. I also do agree not likely at all he gets cut, but do see him getting traded. Which may also play into the first part I stated, do we cut Hughes to save money or trade Shaq. Think if it came down to those two options they trade him, assuming he doesn't light things up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lfod Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 58 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said: Reports at the time were the at least 6 other teams passed on him for this reason. How many more teams do you think were considering using their top 1-18 pick on Shaq's position? It's easy to conclude that every team picking before the Bills passed on Shaq for the medical clearance. As for the timing --sooner when?? The admission that he would, after all, need surgery was announced less than 3 weeks after the draft. It's clear to me that Whaley figured that other teams would pass on his for this reason and he wanted Shaq so badly, he happily took him in the first round thinking "sure, he'll need this surgery ASAP, we will schedule it as soon in the off season as possible (after some 'occurrence'), and he will be ready to go in a few months and he will be a STEAL and I will be seen as a GENIUS!". 2 seasons later the fully functional Shaq may not even make the roster because he, with or without an injury/surgery, isn't that good. Whaley's drafting, in a nutshell.... You make good points. I'd have to agree Whaley made a mistake on Shaq based on the timing aspect alone. Why wait around for a player when you can draft a guy like Tre White that contributes immediately. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloRush Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 17 minutes ago, Ed_Formerly_of_Roch said: The one thing Lawson has going for him is a cheap contract. Think he may have to outplay Hughes, they then keep Shaq and cut Hughes for $$ reasons. I also do agree not likely at all he gets cut, but do see him getting traded. Which may also play into the first part I stated, do we cut Hughes to save money or trade Shaq. Think if it came down to those two options they trade him, assuming he doesn't light things up. The problem is, if they are thinking about trading Shaq, he probably will have higher value this off-season that he would after another subpar year. So I think you might be able to trade him for a 4th round pick this year, next year it would be hard to get more than a 6th rounder for a 4th string DE. I think the preseason is really going to dictate Shaq’s future. With a good showing he can start to climb the depth chart and get more reps or potentially finding a new opportunity on another team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Call_Of_Ktulu Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 I still think his best shot at being effective in the NFL is to bulk up to around 285/290 and play DT. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frostbitmic Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 Shaq will be the starting LDE this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HOUSE Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 Sure, he'll make the roster, play well then ask big money in free agency AFTER ONE DECENT season The Beaner is too smart for this, A player motivate by money Let him go sign with Jacksonville, they love this type of player.... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wppete Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 Yes. Great rotation at DE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BurpleBull Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 Don't be surprised if Mike Love ends up on the 53 man roster or practice squad. He looks like the edge setter that Lawson is, with the potential to grow into more. Love could have been brought in with potentially moving Lawson in mind. Never know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victory Formation Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 9 hours ago, BigDingus said: Like Ragland? Yeah, we didn't even give him a chance, then let him go for nothing. Kansas City is really high on Ragland too, I'm not sure if that's just media propaganda but they think he has All Pro potential. I personally think Shaq should be kept on for a bit, Jerry Hughes is not getting any younger, Murphy/Lawson could be the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted June 24, 2018 Share Posted June 24, 2018 6 hours ago, NewDayBills said: Kansas City is really high on Ragland too, I'm not sure if that's just media propaganda but they think he has All Pro potential. I personally think Shaq should be kept on for a bit, Jerry Hughes is not getting any younger, Murphy/Lawson could be the future. They're praying and better hope he is. That defense is going to be horrible this year. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freddie's Dead Posted June 24, 2018 Share Posted June 24, 2018 I'm a little more pessimistic on Shaq. He needs to show sumpthin', or he's gone. I give him a 50/50 coin flip. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elite Poster Posted June 24, 2018 Share Posted June 24, 2018 I've been off the board for a few days. Came back to this. And people told me this was significantly better than the BBMB. Uh huh. Yep. 13 hours ago, THE SLAMMER said: Sure, he'll make the roster, play well then ask big money in free agency AFTER ONE DECENT season The Beaner is too smart for this, A player motivate by money Let him go sign with Jacksonville, they love this type of player.... I'm not sure if the Jacksonville dig is really appropriate. They have won a playoff game this century. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swnybillsfan Posted June 24, 2018 Share Posted June 24, 2018 On 6/23/2018 at 9:39 AM, buffalobloodfloridahome said: All the talk of him slimming down and getting quicker off the ball may of just been smoke for trade bait it could very well be. but in conjunction with the way Beane was speaking of their conversations...it sounds more like a "poop or get off the pot" wake up call. and the slimming down and getting quicker off the ball is hopefully a talented young man rededicating himself to his craft in hopes of having a long and successful career. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldTimeAFLGuy Posted June 24, 2018 Share Posted June 24, 2018 On 6/23/2018 at 9:43 AM, ColoradoBills said: I hear what you're saying '89 but I don't think Shaq has performed poorly, just not to 1st round talent level. I believe he stays as depth this year with Buffalo or is traded. I guess we all find out during TC. ...probably his last hurrah......shoulder surgery and ankle injury didn't help, but pretty sure that is all behind him now...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 On 6/23/2018 at 7:38 AM, Lfod said: You make good points. I'd have to agree Whaley made a mistake on Shaq based on the timing aspect alone. Why wait around for a player when you can draft a guy like Tre White that contributes immediately. In retrospect it looks like a bad pick. You do this when the talent is so incredible that when healed the player is going to be a incredible force...... I love his run stop game I am dismayed by his lack of pass rush I became very nervous when I hear all this talk of "now Im going to take it seriously".....REALLY......why are you not taking it seriously in that second year? The first year I gave a pass because of the injury and surgery......in year 2 he should have had this huge chip on his shoulder with something to prove....now...he is "taking it seriously" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Hindsight Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 3 minutes ago, John from Riverside said: In retrospect it looks like a bad pick. You do this when the talent is so incredible that when healed the player is going to be a incredible force...... I love his run stop game I am dismayed by his lack of pass rush I became very nervous when I hear all this talk of "now Im going to take it seriously".....REALLY......why are you not taking it seriously in that second year? The first year I gave a pass because of the injury and surgery......in year 2 he should have had this huge chip on his shoulder with something to prove....now...he is "taking it seriously" To be fair to Shaq, Aaron Williams said something similar after he retired. He was relying on skill alone and it wasn't enough. Once he figured that out, he became a much better player I'm sure we all put in max effort at our jobs too everyday Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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