77% were wrong believing our HC wouldn't be fooled by the mirage of preseason, but the Allen Era begins week 2!

[prissythecat]

Amazing that only 11% believe Peterman will win the starting role after that epic thread.

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

3 hours ago, prissythecat said:

Amazing that only 11% believe Peterman will win the starting role after that epic thread.

Considering how many people believed Dunkirk Don..... 

 

 

Connect the dots 

[transplantbillsfan]

7 hours ago, Call_Of_Ktulu said:

If I had to choose between signing McCarron after 4 years or Taylor I would choose McCarron 10 out of 10 times. He should've won that playoff gave vs the Steelers and he performed a lot better than Taylor in the 1 playoff game that they have both played in.

 

The sheer irrelevance of this post is incredible.

 

Soooo... McCarron? Are you saying you believe McCarron starts week 1?

[transplantbillsfan]

https://www.google.com/amp/s/billswire.usatoday.com/2018/06/19/buffalo-bills-adam-schein-nathan-peterman-josh-allen/amp/

CBS Sports host says Nathan Peterman is 'terrible at football,' thinks he'll lose QB competition

"I could not believe my eyes this weekend when I saw a report that Nathan Peterman–yeah, Nathan Peterman–who threw five interceptions in the first half of his first NFL start, still in the mix to win the Bills’ starting quarterback job. Wait, what?” Schein said. “I mean, first of all, Mike Rodak, who had this story, is a superb reporter. I have a better chance to start in Week 1 for the Buffalo Bills than Nathan Peterman. It’s not going to happen. Mainly because Nathan Peterman is terrible at football.

 

“Josh Allen? He’s never thrown a pass in the NFL and he’s already better. This is why they traded up and gave up everything to get Josh Allen. Josh Allen is going to be the Week 1 starter. I’ve been saying that for a long time. And by the way, AJ McCarron, and I’m not a big AJ McCarron fan at all you guys know that, but he’s better than Nathan Peterman."

[Foxx]

i predict that if trans quit resurrecting this thread everyday, it would die a peaceful death and just fade into the ether.

[transplantbillsfan]

I think this is an interesting tidbit... pretty good indication of his room to grow:

https://buffalonews.com/2018/06/22/josh-allen-says-michael-strahan-give-him-the-best-pre-draft-advice/

The most interesting answer from Allen came when the quarterbacks talked about the rise in personal quarterback coaches and a growing camp circuit.

 

“I never did that growing up,” Allen told host Robert Klemko. “I came from a small town. I didn’t really go the camps. I was too busy playing different sports. … Watching kids grow up and play different sports, allowing them to develop different parts of their athleticism, to me was a big part of my success in college."

[BigDingus]

On ‎6‎/‎21‎/‎2018 at 12:44 PM, transplantbillsfan said:

 

1) Yep

 

2) Not when you don't have base-level NFL QB arm strength like Peterman. Rumors are he strengthened his arm in the offseason. Let's hope he did a lot, because otherwise he's never going to have a chance to start more than a handful of games in the NFL as a backup. And Allen is reported to have extremely high Football IQ.

 

3) I remember Peterman was called "Nate Favre" by Hyde. That, while seemingly intended as praise, to me seemed more like a Freudian slip of an insult, because that's exactly what Peterman seems to be, half of Favre, just not the talented half.

 

About #2... I've been reading the exact opposite when it comes to Peterman's football IQ. I guess if you're just referencing his ability to learn a playbook, he may be alright, but if you're referring to his ability to read a defense, that's usually one of his biggest knocks for as long as he's been playing.

He tends to get easily confused, and hasn't ever been known to dissect defenses on the fly. He might understand the plays that we're running, but doesn't understand how to find the opponents' weakness on the fly. Going through his progressions and finding the most advantageous matchups has not been a strength of his.

And it's unlikely that he'll suddenly get not only better at it, but actually "good" or "great" at it, at the highest professional level for the first time ever. Miracles can happen, but believing the Bills will be the team to finally solve is problems seems like a hell of a longshot considering our history with developing QB's (and our fanbase's desperation to finally have a franchise guy putting mounting pressure to see results now).

I dunno, I read any & every article, breakdown, and analysis I can find on Allen as they come out, and outside of these forums & the typical fluff comments from coaches/players that come around every year, consensus is he is the riskiest QB in the class by far, and his stock is based purely on what he "might" be able to do if x, y & z fall into place, rather than what he actually DID do on the field, whether in HS or College.

[transplantbillsfan]

5 hours ago, BigDingus said:

 

About #2... I've been reading the exact opposite when it comes to Peterman's football IQ. I guess if you're just referencing his ability to learn a playbook, he may be alright, but if you're referring to his ability to read a defense, that's usually one of his biggest knocks for as long as he's been playing.

He tends to get easily confused, and hasn't ever been known to dissect defenses on the fly. He might understand the plays that we're running, but doesn't understand how to find the opponents' weakness on the fly. Going through his progressions and finding the most advantageous matchups has not been a strength of his.

And it's unlikely that he'll suddenly get not only better at it, but actually "good" or "great" at it, at the highest professional level for the first time ever. Miracles can happen, but believing the Bills will be the team to finally solve is problems seems like a hell of a longshot considering our history with developing QB's (and our fanbase's desperation to finally have a franchise guy putting mounting pressure to see results now).

I dunno, I read any & every article, breakdown, and analysis I can find on Allen as they come out, and outside of these forums & the typical fluff comments from coaches/players that come around every year, consensus is he is the riskiest QB in the class by far, and his stock is based purely on what he "might" be able to do if x, y & z fall into place, rather than what he actually DID do on the field, whether in HS or College.

 

Obviously all is TBD, but there's no doubt that Allen is very smart and handles himself well. He also operated an NFL style offense at Wyoming. I would say my long term excitement about him largely stems from (and I've said this time and time again) just how much of a late-bloomer he was, and not just physically but also in terms of how late it was he was truly immersed in high-level Football. He played in college, but he was a 3 sport athlete rather than concentrating year-round on learning and honing his skills and knowledge as a QB. He played at a JuCo, so he didn't get a ton there. Then he was at Wyoming where he really was exposed full-steam ahead to the game.

 

I already posted that quote at the top of the page from the Buffalo News article regarding Allen talking about never going to QB camps the way the other prospects did, but I think a couple of these quotes from an interview with Brent Vigen are also telling and respond a bit to what you bring up:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/draftwire.usatoday.com/2018/05/07/josh-allen-nfl-draft-bills-wyoming-brent-vigen/amp/

JM: You’ve worked very closely with him for a number of years now. He’s had his fair share of ups and downs as a player. How do you feel he grew during his time at Wyoming?

BV: I would say he grew in every which way. When he arrived here, he was about 205 pounds. He was probably still 6-foot-4. He grew physically. That was significant, because he’s about 240 pounds now. He hadn’t really found himself in the weight room before he got to Wyoming. Once he got more comfortable in there, it made a significant impact on his physical ability. Mentally, having played just one season in junior college, that was small-school ball in California. His baseline for what they did wasn’t very significant. His understanding of the game and the nuances of both offense and defense, those ideas in his mind really grew in his time here.

 

I would say maturity-wise, as well, but that’s probably the same for all our guys. You just see them through that phase of life where they mature and start to figure things out. I think it was a great benefit in a lot of ways for Josh coming back for an additional season. I think the biggest thing was maturity. It was about having to deal with the expectations that were placed upon him from the early part of last year. It doesn’t always go as planned, but you learn how to deal with those things. I would say that he grew a tremendous amount physically, mentally and emotionally throughout his three years at Wyoming.

 

JM: At this point in time, which aspects of his game would you say are the most developed?

His understanding of a fairly sophisticated offense that we ran at Wyoming is there. There’s not gonna be this dramatic shift for him. He can speak the language. He can recite a play. He can make decisions at the line of scrimmage. These are all things he’s already done. For some kids who go from college to the pros, that’s a transition for them. He is not perfect by any means, but he’s already been exposed to a lot of things. I don’t think the transition is gonna be great as a lot of people out there seem to think.

[transplantbillsfan]

https://www.newyorkupstate.com/expo/sports/erry-2018/06/8e6296d4ed1573/will_buffalo_bills_qb_josh_all.html

Will Buffalo Bills QB Josh Allen record any starts as rookie? History says yes

 

By the numbers

First-round quarterbacks to start in last 20 years: 46-of-55

Top-10 quarterbacks who did not record at least one start as rookies: Jake Locker, Philip Rivers, Carson Palmer

Based on history, Josh Allen is likely to start at some point as a rookie. In the last 20 seasons, 84 percent of first round quarterbacks have started for their respective teams. Top 10 quarterback selections are even more likely to see the field. The only cases of top 10 picks not starting as rookies were Locker, Rivers and Palmer. The Tennessee Titans, San Diego Chargers and Cincinnati Bengals were all in playoff contention during with veterans starting (Hasselbeck, Brees, Kitna) during those seasons. Buffalo does not have an established veteran on their roster so Allen's odds of starting at some point this season should be seen as very high.

[transplantbillsfan]

On 6/13/2018 at 1:56 PM, ShadyBillsFan said:

10 whole snaps with the 1’s = super bowl!!!!!

 

catch the fever!!!

 

 

10 whole snaps???

 

Geez, talk about a misrepresentation... as though it was a "let's just throw him a bone" attitude that got him snaps with the 1s.

 

Allen got significant time with the 1s through Minicamp, and it was more than just a handful of snaps... day 1:

https://www.cover1.net/josh-allen-buffalo-bills-micah-hyde/

Allen played a handful of snaps with the first-team Tuesday, getting a series in 11-on-11 drills and another in nine-on-nine.

 

day 2:

https://www.buffalobills.com/news/5-things-we-learned-from-day-2-of-minicamp-20727276

For the second straight day, rookie Josh Allen was rotated in with the ones for a series or two here and there through the course of practice.

 

And then day 3 there simply weren't many 1st string reps at all for any of the QBs because it seemed almost like the 1st team had a bit of a rest day, but even with that, Allen got the Lion's share of reps overall that day and took advantage of it:

https://www.buffalobills.com/news/5-things-we-learned-from-day-3-of-minicamp-20731093

He’s had his share of plays in the passing game through the course of the spring, but most of Josh Allen’s more eye-opening passes have been surfacing every so often. On Thursday, Allen delivered quality plays on a more consistent basis.

 

Part of it was due to the fact that he saw the most reps at quarterback with the second and third team units seeing the bulk of the 11-on-11 and 9-on-9 team work in practice. But you can’t fault Allen for taking advantage of the additional reps.

 

It's pretty obvious to anyone who doesn't have his/her head strapped at the beginning of a narrow tunnel faced permanently towards the small light at the end of the tunnel that Allen is very much in the mix for the starting QB job and is pretty significantly ahead of where most thought he'd be.

 

And the kid is constantly and actively learning:

 

“Micah Hyde broke one of my passes up so I went up to him after practice and just asked what he saw,” said Allen. “He said he saw my eyes. So being able to talk to the defense like that and pick up on keys that they’re looking at to help them make plays on the football is valuable. So I’m just trying to learn from all the reps that I get.”

[ColoradoBills]

16 hours ago, transplantbillsfan said:

 

Geez, talk about a misrepresentation... as though it was a "let's just throw him a bone" attitude that got him snaps with the 1s.

 

Allen got significant time with the 1s through Minicamp, and it was more than just a handful of snaps... day 1:

 

It's pretty obvious to anyone who doesn't have his/her head strapped at the beginning of a narrow tunnel faced permanently towards the small light at the end of the tunnel that Allen is very much in the mix for the starting QB job and is pretty significantly ahead of where most thought he'd be.

 

 

 

 

While I applaud your passion and tenacity over Allen starting week #1,  Allen is still getting significantly less reps than AJ and Nate.

If this trend continues through the first 8-10 practices in training camp I see the other 2 QB's getting the starts for the 1st 2 preseason games.

 

I still believe the assigned starting QB for the 3rd preseason game will be the odds on favorite to start the season.

[HappyDays]

1 hour ago, ColoradoBills said:

I still believe the assigned starting QB for the 3rd preseason game will be the odds on favorite to start the season.

 

McDermott said at one of his OTA pressers they need to know the starting QB as soon as possible. He all but confirmed they'll name a starter during training camp. That's one reason I doubt Allen ends up starting. He only just started taking 1st team reps and it's a short month and a half until preseason. I'd be surprised if they haven't named Peterman or McCarron the starter by preseason game 1. If the competition goes into August I'll start to think Allen has a shot.

[transplantbillsfan]

3 hours ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

While I applaud your passion and tenacity over Allen starting week #1,  Allen is still getting significantly less reps than AJ and Nate.

If this trend continues through the first 8-10 practices in training camp I see the other 2 QB's getting the starts for the 1st 2 preseason games.

 

I still believe the assigned starting QB for the 3rd preseason game will be the odds on favorite to start the season.

 

Well, of course the starting QB for the 3rd preseason game will be the odds favorite to start the season. Right?

 

Yep, Allen is getting less 1st string reps than Peterman or McCarron, but McDermott and Dabol keep on bringing up that OTAs and Minicamp was more a rep chart than a depth chart, and Allen's reps seemed to increase consistently, particularly on the last day of Minicamp.

 

I think Allen's chances of starting week 1 are the same as I thought they were initially simply because of that increase in reps and his incremental improvements thus far.

 

After a week or so of Training Camp, we're going to have a much better idea, but the longer Allen is actually in this QB competition and actually getting #1 reps, the greater I think his chances become of starting week 1.

 

I think McDermott is going to name his week 1 starting QB before game #3 of the preseason.

Edited June 26, 2018 by transplantbillsfan

[transplantbillsfan]

2 hours ago, HappyDays said:

 

McDermott said at one of his OTA pressers they need to know the starting QB as soon as possible. He all but confirmed they'll name a starter during training camp. That's one reason I doubt Allen ends up starting. He only just started taking 1st team reps and it's a short month and a half until preseason. I'd be surprised if they haven't named Peterman or McCarron the starter by preseason game 1. If the competition goes into August I'll start to think Allen has a shot.

 

I agree that McDermott will likely name his QB pretty quickly.

 

Again, he and Dabol did say multiple times that OTAs and Minicamp were more about a rep chart than depth chart, and considering Allen progressively got more and more reps until the last day of Minicamp, the idea that Allen is so much more behind the eight ball seems a bit misguided.

 

I think we know if Allen's truly in the mix still within the first week of Training Camp. If he's relegated solely or primarily to the 3rd string reps at that point, I think it'll be pretty clear McDermott isn'tfactoring him into the competition.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

7 minutes ago, transplantbillsfan said:

 

I agree that McDermott will likely name his QB pretty quickly.

 

Again, he and Dabol did say multiple times that OTAs and Minicamp were more about a rep chart than depth chart, and considering Allen progressively got more and more reps until the last day of Minicamp, the idea that Allen is so much more behind the eight ball seems a bit misguided.

 

I think we know if Allen's truly in the mix still within the first week of Training Camp. If he's relegated solely or primarily to the 3rd string reps at that point, I think it'll be pretty clear McDermott isn'tfactoring him into the competition.

 

...doubtful.....rash decisions contradict his deliberate, well thought out "processes"......just a speculative opinion from what I've seen so far......

[transplantbillsfan]

7 minutes ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

 

...doubtful.....rash decisions contradict his deliberate, well thought out "processes"......just a speculative opinion from what I've seen so far......

 

Quick doesn't necessarily mean rash.

 

Naming the starting QB within a week would be rash given how close they are right now.

 

On the other hand, naming the starting QB by preseason game #2 would be quick, but not necessarily rash.

 

After all, the season's already coming up pretty quickly.

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

What fan fiction is this?  Allen got significant time with the 1s?  

 

Wow, I guess I missed out on som breaking news.   

I don’t concider 4 then up to 10 snaps significant.   

Edited June 26, 2018 by ShadyBillsFan

[ColoradoBills]

4 hours ago, HappyDays said:

 

McDermott said at one of his OTA pressers they need to know the starting QB as soon as possible. He all but confirmed they'll name a starter during training camp. That's one reason I doubt Allen ends up starting. He only just started taking 1st team reps and it's a short month and a half until preseason. I'd be surprised if they haven't named Peterman or McCarron the starter by preseason game 1. If the competition goes into August I'll start to think Allen has a shot.

 

I agree with naming the starter as early as possible.  I think it could go as long as after preseason game 2 if both AJ and Nate are both playing well

and both get a stating shot of a preseason game.

 

I really do think Josh Allen is not a realistic choice for starter week 1 as of now and if he is not getting an equal share of 1st team snaps in the

beginning of camp it will about seal it. 

1 hour ago, transplantbillsfan said:

 

Quick doesn't necessarily mean rash.

 

Naming the starting QB within a week would be rash given how close they are right now.

 

On the other hand, naming the starting QB by preseason game #2 would be quick, but not necessarily rash.

 

After all, the season's already coming up pretty quickly.

 

As I replied to HappyDays I can see it going as far as after game #2 IF it's close between the 2.

[transplantbillsfan]

4 minutes ago, ShadyBillsFan said:

What fan fiction is this?  Allen got significant time with the 1s?  

 

Wow, I guess I missed out on som breaking news.   

I don’t concider 4 then up to 10 snaps significant.   

 

Soooo... 4 snaps?

 

Link?

 

Here, I'll follow CoC and provide you with a link to the practice where you think he had 4 snaps:

https://www.buffalobills.com/news/5-things-we-learned-from-day-1-of-minicamp-20724711

Allen got a series with the first team during an 11-on-11 team segment and for a series during a nine-on-nine segment when two of the defensive linemen are on the field taking a knee and do not rush the passer.

 

In what world does 2 series equal 4 snaps???

 

 

And what do the words "som" and "concider" mean? I see you're not ignoring me anymore, so I'll have to give you a big thanks  for that, but I look forward to an explanation.

[HappyDays]

2 hours ago, transplantbillsfan said:

 

I agree that McDermott will likely name his QB pretty quickly.

 

Again, he and Dabol did say multiple times that OTAs and Minicamp were more about a rep chart than depth chart, and considering Allen progressively got more and more reps until the last day of Minicamp, the idea that Allen is so much more behind the eight ball seems a bit misguided.

 

I think we know if Allen's truly in the mix still within the first week of Training Camp. If he's relegated solely or primarily to the 3rd string reps at that point, I think it'll be pretty clear McDermott isn'tfactoring him into the competition.

 

Benjamin Allbright reported that his inside source said Peterman is leading the competition and Allen is "distantly in 3rd." If that's true, combined with what McDermott said about picking a QB early, I don't think he'll make up the ground against the 2 veterans. That's no slight against Allen. I think every rookie QB should sit for at least 4 games to get a feel for what the game looks like up close. I'm sure they will give Allen a legitimate chance to win the starting role, I just don't think he'll win it. I would be excited if he does though. But I see this year as a throwaway for the offense so I would rather see Peterman or McCarron taking the hits.