jkirchofer Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 I do worry about coaching....while Culley's experience with wide receivers is fantastic, last year aside, he hasn't worked with quarterbacks since the late 80's and Daboll has a less than stellar track record with drafted quarterbacks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted April 27, 2018 Author Share Posted April 27, 2018 Just now, jkirchofer said: I do worry about coaching....while Culley's experience with wide receivers is fantastic, last year aside, he hasn't worked with quarterbacks since the late 80's and Daboll has a less than stellar track record with drafted quarterbacks. Daboll hasn't had much to work with in his time as an NFL OC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoBills808 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 1 minute ago, 26CornerBlitz said: Discussing strengths and weaknesses of a 1st round QB (who was just selected about 16 hours ago) on a Bills' Fan Forum? What?!?! I think 'Bills Fans' is the key term. Not 'Amateur Youtube Scouts Anonymous'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck Wagon Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 The days of QBs standing back and going through several reads are just done, defenses are too smart and pass rushers are too good. The majority of "good" offenses in the league operate off just a few reads, it's what got Matt Ryan & the Falcons to the SB with Shanahan, Foles to the SB with Reich, and Goff's turnaround with McVey. Frankly I'm more concerned with our offensive coaches / skill talent than Allen as a prospect. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CommonCents Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 2 minutes ago, jkirchofer said: I do worry about coaching....while Culley's experience with wide receivers is fantastic, last year aside, he hasn't worked with quarterbacks since the late 80's and Daboll has a less than stellar track record with drafted quarterbacks. This has been and remains my biggest concern. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted April 27, 2018 Author Share Posted April 27, 2018 Just now, GoBills808 said: I think 'Bills Fans' is the key term. Not 'Amateur Youtube Scouts Anonymous'. Is that what you did with a long evidenced based diatribe I remember? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jahnyc Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 Whether you focus on Allen's ability to process (feel for the game) or the ability of our coaching staff to mold Allen, there is a lot to be concerned about here. Unfortunately, I am not optimistic. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jkirchofer Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 2 minutes ago, Chuck Wagon said: The days of QBs standing back and going through several reads are just done, defenses are too smart and pass rushers are too good. The majority of "good" offenses in the league operate off just a few reads, it's what got Matt Ryan & the Falcons to the SB with Shanahan, Foles to the SB with Reich, and Goff's turnaround with McVey. Frankly I'm more concerned with our offensive coaches / skill talent than Allen as a prospect. Exactly, Foles was almost out of the league and Goff was almost labeled a bust until they got the right coaching and system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xxxxxxxx Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 (edited) The frusterating thing, for me, is the cockiness and unwillingness to learn from mistakes. He looks good throwing in a t-shirt and shorts, and it is presumed that he is cleaning up his footwork issues. But here's the problem: lots of QB's show improvement with regards to mechanics during workouts, but when its time to step on the field they can easily go back to bad habits, especially if the game is too fast for them. Even if he shows better touch in workouts, the over striding and overthrowing could easily return during key game situations when the intensity ramps up. Expect it to, because he has 0 experince against the level of competition that the NFL has. Plus, our coaching staff has already overevaluated one QB in practice, and put him in when he wasn't ready. So now we now have another 5 pick disaster waiting to happen. All of this 'our guys' character nonsense is going to get ugly, real fast. And the nepotism starts at the top. You don't trade up for a project when your coach is a glorified Defensive Coordinator, and your offensive coordinator is coming out of college. McD can easily ruin this guy by putting him in too soon. And when the team starts loosing, because we got rid of all our talent, he'll probably do it to try and save his Job. And then maybe this guy pans out somewhere down the line after we've gotten rid of him, and a team who knows how to develop QB's gets him. I don't trust this process, at all. And I hope that I'm wrong. Edited April 27, 2018 by MURPHD6 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoBills808 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 Just now, 26CornerBlitz said: Is that what you did with a long evidenced based diatribe I remember? ...possibly. Point being, I have no issue with going over Allen's pros and cons. That's what we're here for. I just don't see the point in getting upset over a pick you (the royal 'you', not you personally) didn't like when the people who do this for a living obviously disagree. If you don't like him, that's entirely your prerogative, but don't pretend you can predict how he'll be as a pro because you can't. There's nothing about this staff that suggests they would just blindly rush headlong into a bad decision. Folks' personal opinion of Allen needs to be put into the proper context. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4merper4mer Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 37 minutes ago, Chris66 said: Ryan Mallet. Except Mallet actually played top level defenses. 1000 times more athletic and also not a crack head. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted April 27, 2018 Author Share Posted April 27, 2018 (edited) Just now, GoBills808 said: ...possibly. Point being, I have no issue with going over Allen's pros and cons. That's what we're here for. I just don't see the point in getting upset over a pick you (the royal 'you', not you personally) didn't like when the people who do this for a living obviously disagree. If you don't like him, that's entirely your prerogative, but don't pretend you can predict how he'll be as a pro because you can't. There's nothing about this staff that suggests they would just blindly rush headlong into a bad decision. Folks' personal opinion of Allen needs to be put into the proper context. I'm not upset, it seems that you and some others are however. Edited April 27, 2018 by 26CornerBlitz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 46 minutes ago, Coach Tuesday said: "He has to become quicker mentally to develop into a quality NFL quarterback." Sure, that's happened, ever. This part, I'm a bit puzzled on why you doubt it can happen? Mental processing naturally speeds up as a combination of understanding what one sees, what it means, and how to react to it - then practice. Given the right coaching/explanation and then repetition, repetition, repetition it's not that unlikely. Examples of QB who struggled early and vastly improved their ability to read a defense, interpret what they read, and react would be Drew Brees and Alex Smith. It does depend upon good quality coaching, someone who can really explain plainly and clearly - which is one of my ?s for the Bills in the QB room Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoBills808 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 Just now, 26CornerBlitz said: I'm not upset, it seems that you and some other are however. I am not upset in the slightest. I am pumped. What I am is tickled that the same people killing the Allen pick are the same ones who thought we'd need to trade multiple firsts to get to Rosen. Maybe a little humility is in order. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo Barbarian Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 I believe Dabol will mold an offense around Allen and not force a system like whatshisname did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted April 27, 2018 Author Share Posted April 27, 2018 Just now, GoBills808 said: I am not upset in the slightest. I am pumped. What I am is tickled that the same people killing the Allen pick are the same ones who thought we'd need to trade multiple firsts to get to Rosen. Maybe a little humility is in order. The priced paid to move up isn't what's at issue for most and you shouldn't bring up humility based on how vociferously you make points since you joined this forum that I would describe as anything but humble. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 16 minutes ago, Chuck Wagon said: The days of QBs standing back and going through several reads are just done, defenses are too smart and pass rushers are too good. The majority of "good" offenses in the league operate off just a few reads, it's what got Matt Ryan & the Falcons to the SB with Shanahan, Foles to the SB with Reich, and Goff's turnaround with McVey. Frankly I'm more concerned with our offensive coaches / skill talent than Allen as a prospect. A good point IMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xxxxxxxx Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 (edited) 13 minutes ago, GoBills808 said: ...possibly. Point being, I have no issue with going over Allen's pros and cons. That's what we're here for. I just don't see the point in getting upset over a pick you (the royal 'you', not you personally) didn't like when the people who do this for a living obviously disagree. If you don't like him, that's entirely your prerogative, but don't pretend you can predict how he'll be as a pro because you can't. There's nothing about this staff that suggests they would just blindly rush headlong into a bad decision. Folks' personal opinion of Allen needs to be put into the proper context. With regard to your last point, they benched a starter for a 5th round rookie while they were in playoff contention and that rookie threw 5 picks. I can't think of a better example of blindly rushing headlong into a bad decision, or evidence of the head coach's inability to evaluate QB play. But forget about the tape. Allen is... tall and he has BIG HANDS, so he'll probably still be able to throw in a snow storm. What we need is for every game to be played in a snow storm, and his accuracy issues will balance out. Edited April 27, 2018 by MURPHD6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beast Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 50 minutes ago, Chris66 said: Ryan Mallet. Except Mallet actually played top level defenses. Ryan Mallet? You really are special. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoBills808 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 1 minute ago, 26CornerBlitz said: The priced paid to move up isn't what's at issue for most and you shouldn't bring up humility based on how vociferously you make points since you joined this forum that I would describe as anything but humble. I was referring to the fact that nobody here was correct about how the draft played out. Which is totally understandable, considering we don't have as much information as the people involved in the process and we are for the most part guessing. As for humility, meh. I've been plenty wrong before and I'll be wrong again. What I won't be doing is pretending to accurately predict the career of a guy before he's played an NFL down. I like the pick, lots of others don't, and that's fine. But to write it off based on guesswork before he's taken a snap is the height of arrogance imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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