26CornerBlitz Posted April 20, 2018 Share Posted April 20, 2018 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I'm Spartacus Posted April 20, 2018 Share Posted April 20, 2018 4 minutes ago, Bandito said: We need to draft this guy! If he wears lift's in his shoes, I say yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Over 29 years of fanhood Posted April 20, 2018 Share Posted April 20, 2018 5 minutes ago, Bandito said: We need to draft this guy! If he’s there in the fourth it’s worth considering 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
starrymessenger Posted April 20, 2018 Share Posted April 20, 2018 (edited) One issue I have with Baker is that although much of what we've seen from him is good that may be the best that we will ever see - in other words he may have maxed out. What you see is what you get. That's not bad but maybe we can do better. I'm not sure I see a lot of upside there, unlike some of the other QBs in this class. How exactly does he "develop"? Add to that the fact that his best looks may be scheme dependant and I'd think twice before drafting him at or near the top of the first. If I thought that he could learn to execute well from an NFL pocket, specifically patiently working longer developing routes (not just the quick hitters) while still seeing the passing lanes (including therefore going through true progressions rather than just coverage reads) I'd feel a lot better about him. Idk if he can do that. Edited April 20, 2018 by starrymessenger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buffaloboyinATL Posted April 20, 2018 Share Posted April 20, 2018 3 minutes ago, starrymessenger said: One issue I have with Baker is that although much of what we've seen from him is good that may be the best that we will ever see - in other words he may have maxed out. What you see is what you get. That's not bad but maybe we can do better. I'm not sure I see a lot of upside there, unlike some of the other QBs in this class. Interesting point, that's been in the back of my mind lately as well. He is playing to his maximum potential, which is a good thing if he can stay there. His whole life so far it seems that he has over-achieved when it comes to football. Will he continue to have the motivation to do so at the next level? it appears as though he will, and if so he could be great, but if not?... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
starrymessenger Posted April 20, 2018 Share Posted April 20, 2018 (edited) 9 minutes ago, buffaloboyinATL said: Interesting point, that's been in the back of my mind lately as well. He is playing to his maximum potential, which is a good thing if he can stay there. His whole life so far it seems that he has over-achieved when it comes to football. Will he continue to have the motivation to do so at the next level? it appears as though he will, and if so he could be great, but if not?... I dont myself feel that it's a motivational issue. He's a great kid and I love his moxie. I'm worried about his being a scheme baby and therefore maybe so limited at the end of the day that you come away with the feeling that he was just another really good college QB. To be really good at the next level I think he needs to be more like Drew. Drew Brees is not a world class athlete, he's not big and he doesn't have more arm strength than Baker, but no one is more at home in and around an NFL pocket. I just don't know that Mayfield can be more like that guy. Edited April 20, 2018 by starrymessenger 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted April 20, 2018 Share Posted April 20, 2018 My preference is for a player that can step in and play right away if not needing a shorter time on the bench learning the ropes. Lot to like about Mayfield, especially his "compete" to coin a phrase from Ted Nolan, but he's going to need some time before he's ready, imo. Not saying I wouldn't like getting him but I'd be hoping McCarron can be an effective bridge longer than I'd like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted April 20, 2018 Share Posted April 20, 2018 (edited) 2 hours ago, 26CornerBlitz said: Thank you for this! Cosell isn't always correct, but he's very careful and thorough with his film. So if he says things that differ from other analysts, such as Mayfield being primarily a 1-read thrower, or not knowing where to go with the ball against the blitz - it's worthy of careful consideration. 8 minutes ago, K-9 said: My preference is for a player that can step in and play right away if not needing a shorter time on the bench learning the ropes. Lot to like about Mayfield, especially his "compete" to coin a phrase from Ted Nolan, but he's going to need some time before he's ready, imo. Not saying I wouldn't like getting him but I'd be hoping McCarron can be an effective bridge longer than I'd like. I could be wrong, but I think he's a player who could be effective in the NFL right away given a strong running game and an offense initially tailored to what he can do 19 minutes ago, buffaloboyinATL said: Interesting point, that's been in the back of my mind lately as well. He is playing to his maximum potential, which is a good thing if he can stay there. His whole life so far it seems that he has over-achieved when it comes to football. Will he continue to have the motivation to do so at the next level? it appears as though he will, and if so he could be great, but if not?... That's really the "Elephant in the Room" question for all of these guys. People make a deal of saying it about Rosen, but it applies to every single draft prospect - sometimes for different reasons. Edited April 20, 2018 by Hapless Bills Fan 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted April 20, 2018 Share Posted April 20, 2018 1 minute ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Thank you for this! Cosell isn't always correct, but he's very careful and thorough with his film. So if he says things that differ from other analysts, such as Mayfield being primarily a 1-read thrower, or not knowing where to go with the ball against the blitz - it's worthy of careful consideration. I could be wrong, but I think he's a player who could be effective in the NFL right away given a strong running game and an offense initially tailored to what he can do Not saying he isn't going to be effective eventually, but I have concerns about him working from under center initially. He's just never done it. And it takes time to master. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted April 20, 2018 Share Posted April 20, 2018 16 minutes ago, K-9 said: My preference is for a player that can step in and play right away if not needing a shorter time on the bench learning the ropes. Lot to like about Mayfield, especially his "compete" to coin a phrase from Ted Nolan, but he's going to need some time before he's ready, imo. Not saying I wouldn't like getting him but I'd be hoping McCarron can be an effective bridge longer than I'd like. Other than Rosen I see Mayfield as the next most ready qb to play. I'll even go so far to say that I believe that BM will be more quickly ready to play than Darnold. As with each qb, and probably more so with Mayfield, the OC will have to design an offense to the particular skill set of each young qb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
US Egg Posted April 20, 2018 Share Posted April 20, 2018 I was looking at my kids numerous old draft preview magazines written by the "experts" going back to 2010. It's amazing how not even close they are year in and out and yet continue to publish. I said to my kid, these things are like reading fiction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted April 20, 2018 Share Posted April 20, 2018 Just now, JohnC said: Other than Rosen I see Mayfield as the next most ready qb to play. I'll even go so far to say that I believe that BM will be more quickly ready to play than Darnold. As with each qb, and probably more so with Mayfield, the OC will have to design an offense to the particular skill set of each young qb. He probably is the "next most" ready to play. I don't dispute that. But there is only one QB in this draft that is, imo, ready from day one; Rosen. We'll have to hitch the wagon to McCarron until anybody else is ready. I can live with that, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted April 20, 2018 Share Posted April 20, 2018 3 minutes ago, K-9 said: He probably is the "next most" ready to play. I don't dispute that. But there is only one QB in this draft that is, imo, ready from day one; Rosen. We'll have to hitch the wagon to McCarron until anybody else is ready. I can live with that, though. I agree that Rosen is the most ready qb in this draft. He reminds me of Goff with a picturesque throwing motion. I also believe that he is much more advanced as a player coming into the league compared to Goff because he is more capable of reading defenses and going through progressions. As a rookie qb he is not only the most advanced as a player in this year's draft class but more advanced than I have seen in a number of years. With a lesser trade down he would be a tremendous pick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drunken Pygmy Goat Posted April 20, 2018 Share Posted April 20, 2018 (edited) Greg Cosell is one of the few "pundits" whose opinions I actually care for. Very detailed in his film study. I'm not sure just how knowledgeable he is in regards to breaking down QBs, but his ability to "see" and dissect the game is uncanny. I wouldn't mind drafting Baker, but I don't see him coming into the league and lighting it up immediately like Watson did last year. The positives in Cosell's break down outweigh the negatives IMO, but I feel like he'll make some really boneheaded mistakes over the first couple of seasons. Sitting behind AJ for 6-7 games like Trubisky (or more, if AJ doesn't look like Glennon) and being able to focus more on his footwork would serve him well. Edited April 20, 2018 by Drunken Pygmy Goat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted April 20, 2018 Author Share Posted April 20, 2018 4-20: Greg Cosell of NFL Films on the John Murphy Show (21:48) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBuff423 Posted April 20, 2018 Share Posted April 20, 2018 The criticisms of Mayfield’s game are concerning and often willfully ignored by those who are enamored by his positive traits. I totally understand the love for his play and he’s got real potential but what Cosell highlights in terms of detractions are difficult to overcome at the NFL level. JMO 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldTimeAFLGuy Posted April 20, 2018 Share Posted April 20, 2018 ..putting aside personal preferences, what is the hunch as far as McBeane?................. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted April 20, 2018 Share Posted April 20, 2018 15 minutes ago, BigBuff423 said: The criticisms of Mayfield’s game are concerning and often willfully ignored by those who are enamored by his positive traits. I totally understand the love for his play and he’s got real potential but what Cosell highlights in terms of detractions are difficult to overcome at the NFL level. JMO Very true. Which is why I think he's more of a project for a year or two vs. a day one starter. If he goes to a market like New York and is forced to play from the get-go, he's gonna get roasted by the media and fans. It will be worse than Johnny Football's fall from grace in Cleveland in terms of the fans' patience. If he can go there and hold a clipboard while working on his game and learning to become a pro, I think he can flourish there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jr1 Posted April 20, 2018 Share Posted April 20, 2018 mobile with a high completion percentage. Sign me up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wily Dog Posted April 20, 2018 Share Posted April 20, 2018 I am not a Mayfield supporter . I heard a report today and didn't get the guys name , but he said Mayfield's time in the 40 was between 4.8 -4.9. That gives me pause because as a running QB he will be in trouble every time he rolls out as most of the pursuit is made up of people who run far less than 4.8. Even some of the linemen do better than 4.8. What does the Baker supporters say in his defense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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