ColoradoBills Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 Would like to get some input on the Bill's OL. Bill's have not made any OL moves yet in FA and a lot of things have changed in the offseason. It can be argued that having TT as a QB last year may have hidden some of the OL deficiencies. The run game was good but did take a step back. Peterman (pocket type passer) seemed to me to get abused against the Chargers. What will happen to a "Rosen" with this line? Juan Castillo is still the Coach and it generally thought Bill's will change the blocking scheme once again. OL probably will be addressed in the draft but OL players do need time to develop more so than most positions, especially the lower the round the player is picked. With inexperienced QB's playing for the Bill's it seems we need significant additions. The Bill's loss Eric Wood (120 starts), Cordy Glenn (77 starts), Seantrel Henderson (27 starts) so far in 2018. Here is our current OL players with number of starts and some comments I have added. LT- Dion Dawkins (11 starts) - Great rookie start but still inexperienced. Let's hope he doesn't suffer a "Sophomore Slump" when D's get film on him. LG - Ritchie Incognito - (150 starts) Probably Ritchie's last year. All the Bills OL except Incognito has a combined 162 starts! C/G- Groy - (11 starts) Has only a handful of starts at Center 2 years ago. Don't understand why most think he is an automatic starting Center. He has been the Bill's primary depth at C/G on game day the past 2 years. RG - Vladimir Ducasse - (42 starts) Started 12 games and beat out Miller but not a strength on the line. He is 30. RT - Jordan Mills - (66 starts) Started the full season. Has only played RT his whole career. Hard to say that he is average at best. Primary Backup Swing Tackle - No other tackle has started an NFL game. Primary G/C - John Miller (32 starts) - Has only played RG. The rest of the Guards have not started an NFL game The Remainder: T - Connor McDermott (0 starts) - Best of the rest. Is Connor capable of being our Reserve Swing Tackle? T - Josh James (0 starts) T - De'Ondre Wesley (0 starts) G - Adam Redmond (0 starts) Building a cohesive OL takes time and effort. Keeping one is difficult both cap wise and health wise. OL player get hurt, a lot. Getting thru Camp/Preseason without losing someone is not a given. I would think Bill's need a G/C or RT in FA and at least 2 Rookies in the Draft. Maybe only 1 IF he starts Day 1 (high pick). Not much FA $'s left. Who is the Bill's draft targets. Has Beane talked about the OL? If so please link. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColoradoBills Posted March 16, 2018 Author Share Posted March 16, 2018 Here is a link to available FA OL. I was hoping for C Jensen and having Groy as Ritchie future replacement. Groy will need to be re-signed, it's his last year on his contract. http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/free-agents/offensive-line/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PolishDave Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 (edited) Isaiah Wynn - G Frank Ragnow - C Either one could be targets depending on how long they last in the draft. If the Bills don't upgrade the line significantly going into the season, then the offensive line will likely be the weakest link on the team. And that usually ends poorly. Edited March 16, 2018 by PolishDave 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnBonhamRocks Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 Really hoping Miller can return to showing promise. Been advocating signing Hubbard, OT from PIT. Filled in after their RT went down and performed admirably. Otherwise, if Price falls to our 2nd round pick(s) (assuming we still have it/them), then he would be a good get. I also think Corbett, the OL prospect from Nevada, fits the McBeane mold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColoradoBills Posted March 16, 2018 Author Share Posted March 16, 2018 9 minutes ago, PolishDave said: Isaiah Wynn - G Frank Ragnow - C Either one could be targets depending on how long they last in the draft. If the Bills don't upgrade the line significantly going into the season, then the offensive line will likely be the weakest link on the team. And that usually ends poorly. Agree with the "weakest link" term. Wynn is probably high 2nd rounder or so right? This is kind of my point. We will need some high picks but lot's of people have WR, LB and other positions. Getting a shiny QB is great but if he is under duress the whole time...........what's the point? 7 minutes ago, JohnBonhamRocks said: Really hoping Miller can return to showing promise. Been advocating signing Hubbard, OT from PIT. Filled in after their RT went down and performed admirably. Otherwise, if Price falls to our 2nd round pick(s) (assuming we still have it/them), then he would be a good get. I also think Corbett, the OL prospect from Nevada, fits the McBeane mold. Hubbard would of been great! Cleveland is signing him for 7 million a year. Anything about Price and his injury. Will he be ready for camp? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnBonhamRocks Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 (edited) 5 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said: Anything about Price and his injury. Will he be ready for camp? No source, but I remember hearing out 4 months and will be good to go for camp. 5 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said: Hubbard would of been great! Cleveland is signing him for 7 million a year. Dangit! Edited March 16, 2018 by JohnBonhamRocks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maryland-bills-fan Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 that is why we have so many draft picks. offensive linemen are pretty reliable to draft. they don't wind up that much different from where they are projected. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColoradoBills Posted March 16, 2018 Author Share Posted March 16, 2018 13 minutes ago, maryland-bills-fan said: that is why we have so many draft picks. offensive linemen are pretty reliable to draft. they don't wind up that much different from where they are projected. My question concerning the draft would be what picks for what players. I guess most people think the OL is set and we just need a couple of mid to late round depth players. If Beane thinks the same, I'll trust in him and Castillo and hope for a healthy line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 I am expecting the Bills to use both 1sts and one of the picks between 53-65 to move up (plus maybe a 4th next year or something). Let’s call it 56 this year. I expect the Bills picks to be something like this: - 3 - 53 - 65 - 96 - 121 - 166 - 187 The Bills need 2 starting LBs, slot corner, 2 starting OL, WR2 plus the QB. The QB is going 3. Can the Bills fill those spots with the rest of their picks? I was hoping that Preston Brown filled an LB spot but that is gone. Maybe the Bills can still add Leonard Johnson, Pryor, and/or Jensen? That would check a few needs off the list. I suspect that they can add maybe Johnson and 1 of the other 2. QB will be in the top 5. You will be left with 53, 65, 96, 121, 166, 187 needing 2 starting LBs, 2 OL or 1 OL & 1 WR. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColoradoBills Posted March 16, 2018 Author Share Posted March 16, 2018 37 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said: I am expecting the Bills to use both 1sts and one of the picks between 53-65 to move up (plus maybe a 4th next year or something). Let’s call it 56 this year. I expect the Bills picks to be something like this: - 3 - 53 - 65 - 96 - 121 - 166 - 187 The Bills need 2 starting LBs, slot corner, 2 starting OL, WR2 plus the QB. The QB is going 3. Can the Bills fill those spots with the rest of their picks? I was hoping that Preston Brown filled an LB spot but that is gone. Maybe the Bills can still add Leonard Johnson, Pryor, and/or Jensen? That would check a few needs off the list. I suspect that they can add maybe Johnson and 1 of the other 2. QB will be in the top 5. You will be left with 53, 65, 96, 121, 166, 187 needing 2 starting LBs, 2 OL or 1 OL & 1 WR. Pick and needs make sense. Would of liked Jensen too, but he is too expensive for what we got left. Really want to see a reasonably priced C/LG guy to replace Groy if Groy is a lock on full time Center. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, ColoradoBills said: Pick and needs make sense. Would of liked Jensen too, but he is too expensive for what we got left. Really want to see a reasonably priced C/LG guy to replace Groy if Groy is a lock on full time Center. I think Compton may fill a LB spot. I think that the c/og will be filled in the draft. There are a bunch of guys like that. It could be a 3rd or 4th round guy. They need a RT too. Edited March 17, 2018 by Kirby Jackson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColoradoBills Posted March 17, 2018 Author Share Posted March 17, 2018 1 hour ago, Kirby Jackson said: I think Compton may fill an LB spot. I think that the c/of will be filled in the draft. There are a bunch of guys like that. It could be a 3rd or 4th round guy. They need a RT too. It definitely seems the draft is the way Beane is going. I just thought it would be good to get a guy who has played a dozen or so games and actually snapped a ball in the NFL in FA at a minimum. It seems the depth of the OL will be composed of Rookies and UDFA's. Groy and Dawkins each have less than a season of experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted March 17, 2018 Share Posted March 17, 2018 4 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said: It definitely seems the draft is the way Beane is going. I just thought it would be good to get a guy who has played a dozen or so games and actually snapped a ball in the NFL in FA at a minimum. It seems the depth of the OL will be composed of Rookies and UDFA's. Groy and Dawkins each have less than a season of experience. Yep and I can’t see a situation where Groy AND Dawkins have to stay healthy for 16 games. The OL is rough. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColoradoBills Posted March 17, 2018 Author Share Posted March 17, 2018 6 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said: Yep and I can’t see a situation where Groy AND Dawkins have to stay healthy for 16 games. The OL is rough. Thanks for the input Kirby. Hopefully Beane & Company find a few cast-offs with some experience to come to camp and one of them get's resurrected. I've been on TSW for a short while but I have always believed the OL makes the offense. Few of the "fantasy" players will do well without a good one and all will do even better with a great one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted March 17, 2018 Share Posted March 17, 2018 3 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said: Thanks for the input Kirby. Hopefully Beane & Company find a few cast-offs with some experience to come to camp and one of them get's resurrected. I've been on TSW for a short while but I have always believed the OL makes the offense. Few of the "fantasy" players will do well without a good one and all will do even better with a great one. FWIW, you’ve been a great addition. You have interesting opinions and know what you are talking about. I am of the belief that you can win with an okay line. I don’t think that the Bills are there now (they were). They have a lot of work to do. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Misterbluesky Posted March 17, 2018 Share Posted March 17, 2018 22 hours ago, JohnBonhamRocks said: Really hoping Miller can return to showing promise. Been advocating signing Hubbard, OT from PIT. Filled in after their RT went down and performed admirably. Otherwise, if Price falls to our 2nd round pick(s) (assuming we still have it/them), then he would be a good get. I also think Corbett, the OL prospect from Nevada, fits the McBeane mold. The question is..what happened to Miller? If I was a betting man I would say something inside happened because he wasn't injured all year.Ducasse must be replaced... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnBonhamRocks Posted March 17, 2018 Share Posted March 17, 2018 Just now, Misterbluesky said: The question is..what happened to Miller? If I was a betting man I would say something inside happened because he wasn't injured all year.Ducasse must be replaced... I think the common word I heard was he went from good to bad scheme fit when Dennison/Castillo were hired. Can't back that up myself, but again I'm parroting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted March 17, 2018 Share Posted March 17, 2018 I think that Groy is one of those situations where they want to see how he handles the load of maybe half of a season of games before giving him the bigger contract......I really do think he is our C of the now and future Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punching Bag Posted March 17, 2018 Share Posted March 17, 2018 1 hour ago, Misterbluesky said: The question is..what happened to Miller? If I was a betting man I would say something inside happened because he wasn't injured all year.Ducasse must be replaced... He was replaced by Ducasse for they went to a different scheme which he was better in. I know he is the whipping boy of the wall but that is the facts and do not think it is changing since the OL coach was one of first coaches signed and he survived when OC took the fall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Misterbluesky Posted March 17, 2018 Share Posted March 17, 2018 22 minutes ago, John from Riverside said: I think that Groy is one of those situations where they want to see how he handles the load of maybe half of a season of games before giving him the bigger contract......I really do think he is our C of the now and future The good secret about the interior line is the fact that Richie and Groy are tight ..I love those two next to each other...why some are questioning the center spot is beyond me since Wood was his teacher. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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