OldTimeAFLGuy Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 Just now, ShadyBillsFan said: What was the % of deep routes verses quick slants or 5 to 10 yard outs? Should they have played more to his strengths? I do recall a game or 2 where he was rock solid and caught just about everything thrown at him. (yes, there were 2 or 3 of those games) ...wouldn't discount the effects of playing with a torn labrum all year and now having had surgery for it.......... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 52 minutes ago, PolishDave said: PLEASE GOD don't let this devolve into another friggin Tyrod thread. Man Hands and Squeezes!!! Just now, OldTimeAFLGuy said: ...wouldn't discount the effects of playing with a torn labrum all year and now having had surgery for it.......... agreed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCOrange Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 7 minutes ago, ShadyBillsFan said: What was the % of deep routes verses quick slants or 5 to 10 yard outs? Should they have played more to his strengths? I do recall a game or 2 where he was rock solid and caught just about everything thrown at him. (yes, there were 2 or 3 of those games) People keep saying play to TT's strengths ... so it should be the same so Target Depths for respective Bills WRs: Zay: 13.8 yards Benjamin: 11.9 yards Matthews: 6.8 yards Deonte: 15.4 yards Some other guys roughly around the same average target depth as Zay are: AJ Green Tyrell Williams Torrey Smith Deandre Hopkins Mike Wallace I don't have the average target depth for Zay at ECU, but over 64% of his routes were flats, screens, drags, and slants, which are all less than 5 yards, so his average target depth was probably very low in college. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrEpsYtown Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 I think he will be better. I still wish we would have drafted Cooper Kupp, who is a great fit for what I think Daboll is going to try to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoTier Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 9 minutes ago, ShadyBillsFan said: What was the % of deep routes verses quick slants or 5 to 10 yard outs? Should they have played more to his strengths? I do recall a game or 2 where he was rock solid and caught just about everything thrown at him. (yes, there were 2 or 3 of those games) People keep saying play to TT's strengths ... so it should be the same so Dennison seemed determined to force square pegs into round holes with the entire offense. He forced the OL into a blocking scheme that didn't seem to fit their talents from the get-go; the OL could never consistently do a decent job of either run or pass blocking all year. Compare the offense he pushed on Taylor to what the Houston OC did when DeShon Watson got the call (created and implemented plays that fit Watson's skill set). Even in TC, it was obvious that the OL and the QB were struggling with Dennison's system. Letting Goodwin and Woods go and trading Watkins while replacing them with the WRs they did probably doomed Jones' rookie campaign, too. I will give Dennison a pass on not using Jones correctly (ie, slot receiver) because I don't think he had that much input into the total dismantling of the WR corps. IMO, on any team with a NFL caliber WR corps, Jones wouldn't have been a starter except for injury or late in the season. It was too much pressure to put on a rookie from a smaller program, especially when he was forced to play a position that he really didn't "fit". Hopefully, the Bills put Jones in a better position to succeed this season, and that he takes advantage of his second chance. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nedboy7 Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 1 hour ago, Lfod said: I know right it's Peterman and Dennisons fault Tyrod got benched and then put up 3 points in the playoffs huehuehue. Playoffs. Hue hehehhe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickelCity Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 I completely expect Zay to bounce back. I see flashes of real talent, a history of high quality play, and a desire to do well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herb62 Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 Two words Cooper Cup Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Over 29 years of fanhood Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 I hold out some hope his drops are mental. Definitely has the athleticism and physical measurables to be a very good WR... if he puts in the jerry rice or Andre Reed offseason, he can rebound Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloBillsGospel Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 2 hours ago, ScottLaw said: Dude Zay sucked. He was awful and that is independent of Tyrod. Need to find another receiver opposite Benjamin. You know who else dropped a **** ton of passes his rookie season? Jerry Rice, he was terrible to the point he was being booed by fans. It usually takes WR 3 seasons to finally get his game up to speed especially a small school product. A good example, Eric Moulds had 20 rec, 279 yards, 2 TD in his rookie season, 29 rec 294 yards and 0 TD in year 2 , 67 rec, 1,368 and 9 TD year 3. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 34 minutes ago, DCOrange said: Target Depths for respective Bills WRs: Zay: 13.8 yards Benjamin: 11.9 yards Matthews: 6.8 yards Deonte: 15.4 yards Some other guys roughly around the same average target depth as Zay are: AJ Green Tyrell Williams Torrey Smith Deandre Hopkins Mike Wallace I don't have the average target depth for Zay at ECU, but over 64% of his routes were flats, screens, drags, and slants, which are all less than 5 yards, so his average target depth was probably very low in college. Great stuff!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADOLBILZ Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 1 hour ago, ScottLaw said: Not really. Saying he was awful isn't an exaggeration. He was the worst starting WR in the league. Im hopefully he can become a solid slot guy. But they need to add at least one and probably two solid receivers in FA/draft. He was indeed awful. The "catchable drops" isn't even half of the story...........he couldn't get open and couldn't catch a contested pass. Later in the season Tyrod was very in-tune with where Jones was going to be and was putting the ball in great position where only he could catch it and DB's were still in his pocket and easily able to defense the throws. The handling of the WR situation was incredibly bad by McD and Co.. How did they think this guy was going to be able to handle an outside receiver position? They were like 0 for the season on vertical throws to him. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan130 Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 18 minutes ago, BuffaloBillsGospel said: You know who else dropped a **** ton of passes his rookie season? Jerry Rice, he was terrible to the point he was being booed by fans. It usually takes WR 3 seasons to finally get his game up to speed especially a small school product. A good example, Eric Moulds had 20 rec, 279 yards, 2 TD in his rookie season, 29 rec 294 yards and 0 TD in year 2 , 67 rec, 1,368 and 9 TD year 3. What he was saying is correct . He had an awful year. Does that mean he’s a bust and it’s time to write him off? No. But you should not go into the season with him as the number 2 receiver 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 49 minutes ago, billsfan11 said: What he was saying is correct . He had an awful year. Does that mean he’s a bust and it’s time to write him off? No. But you should not go into the season with him as the number 2 receiver This is pretty much my exact stance. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
White Linen Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 3 hours ago, ScottLaw said: Dude Zay sucked. He was awful and that is independent of Tyrod. Need to find another receiver opposite Benjamin. Zay did stink but Tyrod didn't help. There were times when Zay was blatantly open and Tyrod doesn't throw the ball. You'll see a lot of times a QB will go right back to the same receiver that dropped a ball on the next play. It's that type of stuff that Tyrod doesn't help young WR's develop. Receivers don't grow with Tyrod - that's my point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADOLBILZ Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 1 hour ago, DCOrange said: Target Depths for respective Bills WRs: Zay: 13.8 yards Benjamin: 11.9 yards Matthews: 6.8 yards Deonte: 15.4 yards Some other guys roughly around the same average target depth as Zay are: AJ Green Tyrell Williams Torrey Smith Deandre Hopkins Mike Wallace I don't have the average target depth for Zay at ECU, but over 64% of his routes were flats, screens, drags, and slants, which are all less than 5 yards, so his average target depth was probably very low in college. What I don't like about that number is that IMO one of the things that separates high quality receivers from the hacks is that they catch the ball with the same ease downfield as they do upfield. Zay had some really bad looks on those deeper throws last year............the bumbling Carolina play, the ridiculous looking hop-jump-drop on a perfectly thrown nine route by Tyrod in Atlanta......basically every deep throw he looked bad. A highly skilled WR tracks and runs thru a deep ball in stride........it's a Sammy Watkins trait for sure......the "meh" types have to stop or jump because they aren't coordinated enough to track the ball and keep their stride at the same time. Hopefully Zay can improve but he definitely belongs in the slot. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 7 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said: What I don't like about that number is that IMO one of the things that separates high quality receivers from the hacks is that they catch the ball with the same ease downfield as they do upfield. Zay had some really bad looks on those deeper throws last year............the bumbling Carolina play, the ridiculous looking hop-jump-drop on a perfectly thrown nine route by Tyrod in Atlanta......basically every deep throw he looked bad. A highly skilled WR tracks and runs thru a deep ball in stride........it's a Sammy Watkins trait for sure......the "meh" types have to stop or jump because they aren't coordinated enough to track the ball and keep their stride at the same time. Hopefully Zay can improve but he definitely belongs in the slot. Fun question that's not entirely germane to the topic: how many WRs have you seen track a deep ball like that kid? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KW95 - JA17 Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 When you say: BOUNCE BACK, that implies that he was bouncing at one point. Ill accept just BOUNCE! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dopey Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 3 hours ago, ScottLaw said: Dude Zay sucked. He was awful and that is independent of Tyrod. Need to find another receiver opposite Benjamin. Not saying Zay doesn't suck, but I trust our staff and our draft from last season. As for Zay's stats, take a look at a Eric Moulds' stats in his 1st two seasons in the NFL as a Bill: It does take a season or two for most WR's coming in and he was not a 1st rounder. I can wait one more year to see some development. Not saying we don't need another WR, but it's premature to write off Zay. IMO. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 1 minute ago, Dopey said: Not saying Zay doesn't suck, but I trust our staff and our draft from last season. As for Zay's stats, take a look at a Eric Moulds' stats in his 1st two seasons in the NFL as a Bill: It does take a season or two for most WR's coming in and he was not a 1st rounder. I can wait one more year to see some development. Not saying we don't need another WR, but it's premature to write off Zay. IMO. Dopey with an uppercut ( I wanted to use rope-a-dope but oh well) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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