Ron Torbert the head ref in the Titans vs Pats game

[C.Biscuit97]

Or maybe the team with the best head coach-qb combo of all time is just a lot better than a crappy Titans team with a qb who threw more inta than tds this year coached by Mike Mularkey.

 

i hate the pats but this stuff is something crazy people think about. 

[MarkAF43]

Here's my crazy officiating idea. No clue if it would actually work, but here's the basics. Another referee is working in the booth in every stadium. His sole job would be to review penalties without it being challenged. So as the play is being discussed and reset and whatnot they're looking and from the rule book they'll look at the replays in real time and either concur with the call or say no pick up the flag. You can apply a lot of different ways to do this, only pass interference calls only penalties giving a first down or over ten yards etc. but it's not a discussion between the officials. They're job will just be to confirm yes or no. 

[Buffalo_Stampede]

12 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

 

That's like saying "he played better at home".  Well, yeah.

 

He put up career numbers outside of the dome.  Most QBs play better in a dome.

Brees plays at least 10 games a year in a dome or Florida. I didn't think this would be a big debate. His numbers do drop when he isn't in perfect conditions, and he is in perfect conditions most games.

Edited January 14, 2018 by TheTruthHurts

[Mr. WEO]

1 minute ago, TheTruthHurts said:

Brees plays at least 10 games a year in a dome or Florida. I didn't think this would be a big debate.

 

It's not debatable.  You initially said he struggled outside of a dome.  His non  dome yards are superior to those of a dozen SB era  HOF QB's. Those alone would put him in the top 40 QBs of all time--including current QBs.

 

You then changed it to "he's better indoors".   That's true for nearly every QB, so I felt it was not a point worth making.

[Buffalo_Stampede]

1 minute ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

It's not debatable.  You initially said he struggled outside of a dome.  His non  dome yards are superior to those of a dozen SB era  HOF QB's. Those alone would put him in the top 40 QBs of all time--including current QBs.

 

You then changed it to "he's better indoors".   That's true for nearly every QB, so I felt it was not a point worth making.

I said struggled was a poor word. Brees averages 37 TD's per 16 games in a dome, 27 td's per 16 not in a dome. His stats continue to drop if you account for temperature.

 

 

[Fadingpain]

If you want to manipulate the outcome of games, you pay the referee.

 

A few key calls at the right times involving nothing but "judgment" can sway the balance of a close game one way or the other.

 

If this hasn't already hit the NFL, it will some day.  It's hit lots of other pro leagues around the world.

 

 

[stevewin]

1 hour ago, Dr. Who said:

 What is so exasperating is that without cheating and blatant favoritism, the Patriots are legitimately formidable.  

I absolutely hate this argument.  Would Lance Armstrong have been legitimately formidable if he wasn't doping?  Would Mark McGwire have been the HR King?  And I'm convinced the cheating in the Cheaters case is even more insidious - systematic and varied and ingrained in their entire operation, for years.

 

It drives me crazy when people even put Brady and Bellicheat in the GOAT conversation.  They had success BECAUSE they cheated.  Sometimes I feel like I'm in a twilight zone episode where everyone with a pig face is beautiful and admired (yes the Pats** are the pig-faced cheaters in this analogy) - Hellooooo people.  Cheaters!?

[LabattBlue]

Wasn't Kraft in Dallas the day Kennedy was shot?  Also makes me wonder where he was on 9/11?  "Boston" Marathon bombing?

 

[DriveFor1Outta5]

1 hour ago, matter2003 said:

Hmm...maybe that's the most compelling reason we need a new stadium.

 

Pegula can target every company a ref is involved with and sign them up to work on the stadium along with some "under the table" money...

 

 

This is why refs should be full time. Guys who are employed by big time corporations and law firms have too many affiliations. It just gives a bad look, even if there is no real bias occurring.

Edited January 14, 2018 by DriveFor1Outta5

[chris heff]

41 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

Joe Montana never was sacked more than 35 times and only 4 times was sacked more than 30 times.

 

Brady has been sacked 452 times--7 seasons more than 30 sacks.  Brady was hit 84 times this year--far more than Cam Newton, Eli, Big Ben....

 

From 2009-2017, the QB who generated the most roughing the passer penalties was......Ryan Fitzpatrick.  Brady is 9th on that list (behind even CaM Newton, who everyone says is getting murdered out there with no flags thrown).

 

Drew Brees has more roughing calls for him than Brady. 

 

Per 100 pass attempts, Brady is ranked 26th in penalties called.

 

Per game, Brady is 23rd in roughing penalties called. 

 

What's "obvious to" you isn't backed up with stats. 

 

 

 

 

 

I don’t understand your point, are you saying that Brady is just a genetically superior human being? And that is the reason for his longevity? Not that NFL rules have changed? I think Unitas could be hit in the head and below the waist. Do your stats take into consideration that Fitzpatrick would take off and run and not always slide? It is obvious to anyone who has ever watched any NFL games that Boady gets call other QBs do not and furthermore it has become obvious that calls and non-calls help them more than other teams, 29 scoring drives extended by penalties most in the league. 

[frostbitmic]

This coming Wednesday I want to see the NFL go into the locker rooms of the 4 remaining teams and take a blood and urine sample from every player. If any player fails or refuses the test than they are banned from the AFC and NFC title games as well as the Super Bowl.

[Cmdjr85]

I bet your one that believes the titans should have won the game even though they couldnt move the ball. They where one of two terrible afc teams to make the playoffs. 

Nothing tennessee did gave them a chance to win. 

Awe someone is salty. Sorry this team you love is just trash. 3 points in a playoff game. 

[MattM]

18 minutes ago, Cmdjr85 said:

I bet your one that believes the titans should have won the game even though they couldnt move the ball. They where one of two terrible afc teams to make the playoffs. 

Nothing tennessee did gave them a chance to win. 

Awe someone is salty. Sorry this team you love is just trash. 3 points in a playoff game. 

If you paid anything at all for the “education” that you got, you might want to get a refund....

On the Brady vs Brees point, a couple of thoughts:

 

1.  Brees is a year and a half younger than Brady—let’s see if he’s in the MVP discussion in the 2019 season; and 

2.  Last I checked, unlike Brady,  Brees doesn’t have as a best friend a supposed “health guru” with a degree from “Fly-By-Night University” who claims to do what no one else in modern science can (and, oh, yeah, was hit by the FDA for lying about the effects of stuff he was selling, to wit, claiming his product cured certain types of cancer).  Wow, I bet that guy’s legit.....

[3rdand12]

1 hour ago, stevewin said:

I absolutely hate this argument.  Would Lance Armstrong have been legitimately formidable if he wasn't doping?  Would Mark McGwire have been the HR King?  And I'm convinced the cheating in the Cheaters case is even more insidious - systematic and varied and ingrained in their entire operation, for years.

 

It drives me crazy when people even put Brady and Bellicheat in the GOAT conversation.  They had success BECAUSE they cheated.  Sometimes I feel like I'm in a twilight zone episode where everyone with a pig face is beautiful and admired (yes the Pats** are the pig-faced cheaters in this analogy) - Hellooooo people.  Cheaters!?

i recall that episode. good ole  Days of Black and White TV contrasting nicely. Mr Serling was outstanding

1 hour ago, LabattBlue said:

Wasn't Kraft in Dallas the day Kennedy was shot?  Also makes me wonder where he was on 9/11?  "Boston" Marathon bombing?

 

when did the Pats begin winning champion chips? What year?

52 minutes ago, frostbitmic said:

This coming Wednesday I want to see the NFL go into the locker rooms of the 4 remaining teams and take a blood and urine sample from every player. If any player fails or refuses the test than they are banned from the AFC and NFC title games as well as the Super Bowl.

 and Coach !

[JerseyBills]

I remember you bringing this up some time ago but great find. Cheaters gonna cheat! 

4 hours ago, chris heff said:

 

The phantom offensive pass interference and the reversal of the call on fourth down are what happens in every Patriots game.

Pat's getting tons of help from the zebras? Shocking.

In other news-Water is wet 

 

[Mr. WEO]

2 hours ago, TheTruthHurts said:

I said struggled was a poor word. Brees averages 37 TD's per 16 games in a dome, 27 td's per 16 not in a dome. His stats continue to drop if you account for temperature.

 

 

 

27 TD's per 16 games over a career is astounding in itself.  

 

If you want to say he is insanely good in a dome and he drops slightly to 1st ballot HOFer outside of a dome, then I'm with you, because that's what the stats show.

1 hour ago, MattM said:

If you paid anything at all for the “education” that you got, you might want to get a refund....

On the Brady vs Brees point, a couple of thoughts:

 

1.  Brees is a year and a half younger than Brady—let’s see if he’s in the MVP discussion in the 2019 season; and 

2.  Last I checked, unlike Brady,  Brees doesn’t have as a best friend a supposed “health guru” with a degree from “Fly-By-Night University” who claims to do what no one else in modern science can (and, oh, yeah, was hit by the FDA for lying about the effects of stuff he was selling, to wit, claiming his product cured certain types of cancer).  Wow, I bet that guy’s legit.....

 

Brees is 39 tomorrow.  Why no scrutiny for his performance at this advanced age? 

 

Regardless of his personal trainer's credentials, why treat Brady as a the suspicious anomaly when there's been another guy in the same league doing the same thing all along for nearly as long?  The suspicious aspect is how can a 40 year old be performing like this at this age.  So at age 39, no suspicion is warranted?

[Mr. WEO]

2 hours ago, chris heff said:

I don’t understand your point, are you saying that Brady is just a genetically superior human being? And that is the reason for his longevity? Not that NFL rules have changed? I think Unitas could be hit in the head and below the waist. Do your stats take into consideration that Fitzpatrick would take off and run and not always slide? It is obvious to anyone who has ever watched any NFL games that Boady gets call other QBs do not and furthermore it has become obvious that calls and non-calls help them more than other teams, 29 scoring drives extended by penalties most in the league. 

 

My point is obvious.  You're claim about drawing penalties for roughing the passer are clearly wrong, as is your claim that Brady never get's touched.

 

No Brady isn't genetically superior.  But Joe Montana wasn't very athletic and was pretty scrawny. You can;t claim he took more brutal hits than a modern day QB and was therefore simply "tougher".

 

These aren't my stats.  They are easily found with a quick google search.  Sure Fitz would take off now and then, but when he got hit, he was far more likely to have a penalty drawn for roughing than Brady.  What's the hard part to understand?

[chris heff]

4 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

My point is obvious.  You're claim about drawing penalties for roughing the passer are clearly wrong, as is your claim that Brady never get's touched.

 

No Brady isn't genetically superior.  But Joe Montana wasn't very athletic and was pretty scrawny. You can;t claim he took more brutal hits than a modern day QB and was therefore simply "tougher".

 

These aren't my stats.  They are easily found with a quick google search.  Sure Fitz would take off now and then, but when he got hit, he was far more likely to have a penalty drawn for roughing than Brady.  What's the hard part to understand?

Brady’s longevity is due to what? There isn’t that many choices, performance enhancing drugs, rules protect today’s QBs thus prolonging career or generically superior unaffected by age. Is there other options I’m missing? Or are you going to try and contribute it to kale cocktails and clean living?

[Mr. WEO]

2 minutes ago, chris heff said:

Brady’s longevity is due to what? There isn’t that many choices, performance enhancing drugs, rules protect today’s QBs thus prolonging career or generically superior unaffected by age. Is there other options I’m missing? Or are you going to try and contribute it to kale cocktails and clean living?

 

Players are better athletes at QB now.  They are of the few player groups that likely spend much of the offseason staying in shape.  The best ones do anyway.

 

It's not just Brady.  Trees, same thing.  Big Ben, both Mannings playing/played forever at high levels. 

 

They have to be in better shape--the guys hittiing them are better and stronger than in Montana's day.  They are getting hammered more often nowadays.  Look how many QBs went out this year due to injury.  You rarely saw that in Montana's day--1/4 of the starters out at a time.

[MattM]

1 hour ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

27 TD's per 16 games over a career is astounding in itself.  

 

If you want to say he is insanely good in a dome and he drops slightly to 1st ballot HOFer outside of a dome, then I'm with you, because that's what the stats show.

 

Brees is 39 tomorrow.  Why no scrutiny for his performance at this advanced age? 

 

Regardless of his personal trainer's credentials, why treat Brady as a the suspicious anomaly when there's been another guy in the same league doing the same thing all along for nearly as long?  The suspicious aspect is how can a 40 year old be performing like this at this age.  So at age 39, no suspicion is warranted?

Maybe he deserves scrutiny, too.  Never said he didn’t, only that he’s a full year and a half younger than Brady.

 

He also doesn’t play for a franchise that used to be the favorite destination for aging players who seemed to miraculously regain a step when they arrived there, and at least one of whom (who, somehow, miraculously considering this, is now a network NFL coverage guy—kind of as if Barry Bonds got hired to be a MLB analyst) got caught using HGH only by being dumb enough to use his own name in ordering it, and which at one point a few years back had 3 RB’s over age 32 (I struggled that year to find 3 others in the rest of the League combined).  See Seau, Junior, Morris, Sammy, Taylor, Fred and Faulk, Kevin, among others.

 

PS. I’m sure that Dennard suspension is coming any day now.....