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Air it out Fitzy

Uncatchable pass %. Dennison's fault too ?

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3 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Exactly.  Lets examine Dennison train of thought here.  Its 4th and goal at the 1 yard line on a must score a TD drive.  

 

Hmmmm...I have one of the shiftiest and best RB's in the NFL on a teams whose strength is running. I also have a big TE in a guy like Clay who is a great Redzone target.  But wait... I also have a 5th round rookie QB with a bad comp %, terrible under pressure, and lots of interceptions who could throw a fade to a fellow rookie WR who isn't very big that  both struggles running routes and catching passes that is matched up against a pretty darn good DB, not to mention is a former Bill with a chip on his shoulder playing on a Belichick coached defense.

 

Gee...I think I will go with this crap low percentage play with 2 struggling rookies.  Congrats Dennison, you are an idiot.

The opening drive was worse. They marched right down the field then called a pass play on 1st down from the 6 yard line. I think they averaged 7 YPC for the game but Dennison decided to outsmart himself and turn it over to Taylor inside the 10 yard line.

 

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5 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Exactly.  Lets examine Dennison train of thought here.  Its 4th and goal at the 1 yard line on a must score a TD drive.  

 

Hmmmm...I have one of the shiftiest and best RB's in the NFL on a teams whose strength is running. I also have a big TE in a guy like Clay who is a great Redzone target.  But wait... I also have a 5th round rookie QB with a bad comp %, terrible under pressure, and lots of interceptions who could throw a fade to a fellow rookie WR who isn't very big that  both struggles running routes and catching passes that is matched up against a pretty darn good DB, not to mention is a former Bill with a chip on his shoulder playing on a Belichick coached defense.

 

Gee...I think I will go with this crap low percentage play with 2 struggling rookies.  Congrats Dennison, you are an idiot.

Very good post......rather simple i think.....dont understand how some just cant see this?

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6 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Exactly.  Lets examine Dennison train of thought here.  Its 4th and goal at the 1 yard line on a must score a TD drive.  

 

Hmmmm...I have one of the shiftiest and best RB's in the NFL on a teams whose strength is running. I also have a big TE in a guy like Clay who is a great Redzone target.  But wait... I also have a 5th round rookie QB with a bad comp %, terrible under pressure, and lots of interceptions who could throw a fade to a fellow rookie WR who isn't very big that  both struggles running routes and catching passes that is matched up against a pretty darn good DB, not to mention is a former Bill with a chip on his shoulder playing on a Belichick coached defense.

 

Gee...I think I will go with this crap low percentage play with 2 struggling rookies.  Congrats Dennison, you are an idiot.

:lol: it's like in his mind he really thought Zay was having his way with Gilmore all game (I think that's who defended that pass).

 

You call that play when you have like, Plaxico Burress playoff edition, showing you he's can't be stopped for 3 full quarters.

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5 minutes ago, Commonsense said:

The opening drive was worse. They marched right down the field then called a pass play on 1st down from the 6 yard line. I think they averaged 7 YPC for the game but Dennison decided to outsmart himself and turn it over to Taylor inside the 10 yard line.

 

 

I missed the first quarter, so glad I didn't see that.  Dennison is the only OC that gets me as mad on game day as Hackett did.

2 minutes ago, PetermanThrew5Picks said:

:lol: it's like in his mind he really thought Zay was having his way with Gilmore all game (I think that's who defended that pass).

 

You call that play when you have like, Plaxico Burress playoff edition, showing you he's can't be stopped for 3 full quarters.

 

Yeah, not when your struggling rookie has 2 catches for 22 yards. lmao

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Uncatchable passes include passed that are thrown away or in the area of a receiver but away from a defender. Dennison is still at fault 

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8 minutes ago, Commonsense said:

The opening drive was worse. They marched right down the field then called a pass play on 1st down from the 6 yard line. I think they averaged 7 YPC for the game but Dennison decided to outsmart himself and turn it over to Taylor inside the 10 yard line.

 

I missed that as well. The interception from the highlight looked really out of character from Tyrod.. it was a really bizarre throw, he was bumped as he released.

 

Also I kept hearing he supposedly got hurt on that first drive, never saw the play. When I started watching I saw Tyrod limited and was immediately pissed. He plays so bad hurt, just take yourself out of the game dude. Coach, take him out. I remember that dumb **** happening in games late last year too. I guess it's really up to Tyrod to admit his backup is better than him playing hurt.

8 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

I missed the first quarter, so glad I didn't see that.  Dennison is the only OC that gets me as mad on game day as Hackett did.

 

Yeah, not when your struggling rookie has 2 catches for 22 yards. lmao

lowkey still love Plax. Give him and that D-line the lion's share credit in stopping the most evil of Patriot teams.

 

I still remember Brady jinxing himself when he laughed at the low scoring pregame prediction.

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If you make a foundary assumption that Tyrod is a limited QB, but has been able to win games and does some things very very well and there are others things he doesn’t.... yes the OC has failed to build an offense that uses those strengths to get some scoring. I can not think of a worse starting point for the type of passer we know he is than a West Coast offense QB mostly under center. 

 

Geeze even Peyton’s already diminished physique was further compromised by this OC- He forced him to take too many snaps from under center.

 

Manning eventually obtained compromise... but whose gonna sustain an arguement with Peyton about how to QB ? 

 

Tyrod is the best QB on the roster. Since they moved ahead with that roster, yes the OC is responsible for the results. 

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1 hour ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Exactly.  Lets examine Dennison train of thought here.  Its 4th and goal at the 1 yard line on a must score a TD drive.  

 

Hmmmm...I have one of the shiftiest and best RB's in the NFL on a teams whose strength is running. I also have a big TE in a guy like Clay who is a great Redzone target.  But wait... I also have a 5th round rookie QB with a bad comp %, terrible under pressure, and lots of interceptions who could throw a fade to a fellow rookie WR who isn't very big that  both struggles running routes and catching passes that is matched up against a pretty darn good DB, not to mention is a former Bill with a chip on his shoulder playing on a Belichick coached defense.

 

Gee...I think I will go with this crap low percentage play with 2 struggling rookies.  Congrats Dennison, you are an idiot.

I think Dennison is terrible, but I think you might be misinterpreting this. The game was without question OVER (i.e., down by 3 TDs with less than 9 minutes to go against the best team in league history), for one. Secondly, they know McCoy is capable of scoring. But they don't know if a) the QB can make that throw in a live-game situation with accuracy (a throw that decent QBs have to occasionally make) and b) if their highly drafted receiver can make contested EZ catches on a bread-and-butter fade route against a good DB (a catch that decent WRs have to occasionally make). 

I'm fine with that series at the goal line. Again, though, I viewed it as a preseason-like series, and I don't like Dennison at all.

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1 hour ago, transplantbillsfan said:

 

Are you having reading comprehension problems again, Shady?

 

"No one believes that.

 

No one's believed that for weeks, probably."  

 

really don't understand that?  There's no "which is that" in there because my statement doesn't contradict itself.

 

Or are you just gleefully trying to dig up all the No one's believed that for weeks, probably."   have labelled as being in a cult so that you can insult them for their opinions?

 

 

Transplant .....  Read what you posted my good man. 

Quote

What a stupidly veiled premise here. You're holding onto the notion that you need to prove to anyone that believes Taylor is a Franchise (1) QB or even that he'll be in a Bills uniform much longer that he's not and that he won't.

 

"No one believes that.

No one's believed that for weeks, probably."      That means that at some time a number of people did believe he was a Franchise guy. Ergo a contradiction.  

 

Just trying to clear that up for you.  

 

Paranoia will destroy you.    

 

1 hour ago, transplantbillsfan said:

 

First of all, what are those boxes at the top?  Whether it's a browser thing or an inside joke I'm not getting, they just look like boxes.

 

Second of all, you don't call posts of mine or really anyone who's ever said anything positive about Taylor stupid or several other negative things?  Seriously?  That's what you're going with?  So now on top of proving you have no integrity because you can't adhere to a bet YOU make yourself and then LOSE, you also prove to be a liar?

 

Third of all, why are you so obsessed with Taylor that you feel you have to talk about him so much?  :flirt:

Certain Mobile devices have their own set of emoji's .  These emoji's  do not translate well when viewed on a PC.  

 

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13 minutes ago, ShadyBillsFan said:

Transplant .....  Read what you posted my good man. 

 

"No one believes that.

No one's believed that for weeks, probably."      That means that at some time a number of people did believe he was a Franchise guy. Ergo a contradiction.  

 

Just trying to clear that up for you.  

 

Paranoia will destroy you.     

 

 

It's a contradiction to say that no one believes that Taylor's a Franchise QB despite acknowledging people may have believed it in the past?

 

Why would it be any kind of contradiction whatsoever?

 

Saying "no one believes the world is flat, no one's believed that since the mid 1400s" isn't a contradiction, is it?

 

 

My point was simply that anyone who ever had the notion that Taylor was our franchise QB or even could be our franchise QB no longer exist, so this thread seems to be pointing fingers at people who have moved on.  Seems like a pretty pointless exercise.

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1 minute ago, transplantbillsfan said:

My point was simply that anyone who ever had the notion that Taylor was our franchise QB or even could be our franchise QB no longer exist,

My misunderstanding.  

Apologies.  

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1 hour ago, dave mcbride said:

I think Dennison is terrible, but I think you might be misinterpreting this. The game was without question OVER (i.e., down by 3 TDs with less than 9 minutes to go against the best team in league history), for one. Secondly, they know McCoy is capable of scoring. But they don't know if a) the QB can make that throw in a live-game situation with accuracy (a throw that decent QBs have to occasionally make) and b) if their highly drafted receiver can make contested EZ catches on a bread-and-butter fade route against a good DB (a catch that decent WRs have to occasionally make). 

I'm fine with that series at the goal line. Again, though, I viewed it as a preseason-like series, and I don't like Dennison at all.

 

Fair enough, I still hate the play call there.  Fades to ZJ are not things I expect to see much of, he's not that kind of WR IMO.  I like ZJ, but can't see that being in his arsenal as a go to play when you got one chance to score.

 

Plus this obsession that OC's have to "out smart" everyone by going away from their strength is just unnecessary some times.  Sea might be back to back SB champs had they not gone away from their strength on the goal line and Cheatriots would have one more loss and one less trophy.  

 

When you need a play at all costs, use your best players.  NP and ZJ are not close to our best players on offense right now.  

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2 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Fair enough, I still hate the play call there.  Fades to ZJ are not things I expect to see much of, he's not that kind of WR IMO.  I like ZJ, but can't see that being in his arsenal as a go to play when you got one chance to score.

 

Plus this obsession that OC's have to "out smart" everyone by going away from their strength is just unnecessary some times.  Sea might be back to back SB champs had they not gone away from their strength on the goal line and Cheatriots would have one more loss and one less trophy.  

 

When you need a play at all costs, use your best players.  NP and ZJ are not close to our best players on offense right now.  

Sadly, at that point of the game Jones was their best receiver by far out there. And he does have height. Did you see that pathetic drop by Matthews on an easy throw-and-catch at around the Bills' 25 yard line?

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2 hours ago, dave mcbride said:

Sadly, at that point of the game Jones was their best receiver by far out there. And he does have height. Did you see that pathetic drop by Matthews on an easy throw-and-catch at around the Bills' 25 yard line?

 

Yeah, that drop by Matthews was a joke.  Inexcusable...we need help at WR IMO next year.  

 

I like Zay still, but he isnt there yet obviously.  I like we traded for Kelvin, but I am concerned about relying on him.  I do find it ironic that most the people who hated Sammy because of his injury issues were so happy we got Kelvin who isn't as good as Sammy and is way more of an injury risk.  And his injuries are way more serious than Sammys too.  Jordan I don't think will be on this team next year IMO.  

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2 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Yeah, that drop by Matthews was a joke.  Inexcusable...we need help at WR IMO next year.  

 

I like Zay still, but he isnt there yet obviously.  I like we traded for Kelvin, but I am concerned about relying on him.  I do find it ironic that most the people who hated Sammy because of his injury issues were so happy we got Kelvin who isn't as good as Sammy and is way more of an injury risk.  And his injuries are way more serious than Sammys too.  Jordan I don't think will be on this team next year IMO.  

 

I think Zay would've looked 10x better if we kept Sammy.           

 

💩💩 trade. 

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5 hours ago, transplantbillsfan said:

 

It's a contradiction to say that no one believes that Taylor's a Franchise QB despite acknowledging people may have believed it in the past?

 

Why would it be any kind of contradiction whatsoever?

 

Saying "no one believes the world is flat, no one's believed that since the mid 1400s" isn't a contradiction, is it?

 

 

My point was simply that anyone who ever had the notion that Taylor was our franchise QB or even could be our franchise QB no longer exist, so this thread seems to be pointing fingers at people who have moved on.  Seems like a pretty pointless exercise.

My dude, you're a game or two from being right back on that train. Please stop it.

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In sports and politics always beware a stat that so neatly fits a narrative. 

 

Why are we looking at only Zay Jones? How do the rest of our RB's/WR's/TE's look for this stat? Looking at the stat for just 1 WR would also include Nathan Peterman targets to Zay Jones.

 

This stat just means that TT has a lot of intentional throw aways in Zay jones general direction (in addition to a number of missed throws - chemistry perhaps?). 

 

Despite the popular narrative, TT is NOT an inaccurate passer. Look at his completion % for the season and his career. He's fairly average. I think a lot of people on this board underestimate how bad the "average" NFL QB is. 

 

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13 hours ago, dneveu said:

I mean... i can blame it on him a little bit when we have a QB who is clearly more comfortable in shotgun... taking snaps under center.  A QB who likes to buy time, and you have him throwing rhythm passes.  Or a team that clearly runs power and traps very well... running outside zones for 1 YPC and leaving us in constant 3rd and longs.

 

I think TT has been terrible for the last 5 weeks, and generally just serviceable.  But this OC has killed any chance the O had of succeeding.

 

It seemed so obvious, and the resistance to the reality helped make this a tough board to read in the offseason. 

 

1) Tyrod is not a bum but he is a limited player. A system qb if you will (normally used for heady but weak armed guys but just as easy to apply to a gifted athlete that has troubles with reads and decision making)

 

2) Dennison runs a system that plays to his weaknesses and avoids his strengths

 

how anyone thought it was a great pairing beyond “well, I hope one of them surprises us” I am not sure. Both have a spot in the league, but they shouldn’t be together. 

 

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8 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

LMAO at all this nonsense where it has to be one or the other...its possible they both aren't good, you understand that right?  TT is TT...we don't need to dive into that, besides you clearly already have your thoughts about him.

 

But who cares if you hate TT, the bottom line is that Dennison has been terrible.  I don't blame Dennison when TT makes a bad pass or takes a bad sack.  I blame Dennison when he takes a FRESH McCoy OFF the field all the time and on critical drives and plays to put in guys like Tolbert and Cadet.  I blame Dennison when he makes HIGHLY predictable and head scratching play calls like his LOVE affair with calling a draw play on any Down and Long.  I blame Dennison for dismantling the leagues top rushing attack and making it mediocre.  I blame Dennison for calling plays like we are protecting a lead but are really down and need to urgently score.  I could keep going, but you should get the point.

 

Dennison sucks.  Cant wait for this idiot to hit the pavement.  Don't want him running the show for the new shiny QB we are going to draft.  

So right and because it's so on point expect the Bills to bring him back for another year. 👍🏻 Bills will be Billsy.

3 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Yeah, that drop by Matthews was a joke.  Inexcusable...we need help at WR IMO next year.  

 

I like Zay still, but he isnt there yet obviously.  I like we traded for Kelvin, but I am concerned about relying on him.  I do find it ironic that most the people who hated Sammy because of his injury issues were so happy we got Kelvin who isn't as good as Sammy and is way more of an injury risk.  And his injuries are way more serious than Sammys too.  Jordan I don't think will be on this team next year IMO.  

Really? 

 

The new regime traded Sammy.... so Bills fans had to find a quick excuse for the new regime as to why it was a good trade.

 

Its what they do every time a good talent is sent packing. "He didn't buy in". "He's a kitty, Matthews stays on the field!" 

 

Matthews to IR. 6 games missed this year. Kittyyyyyy.😂

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13 hours ago, joesixpack said:

 

Problem with your theory:

 

2016 we had the 30th ranked pass offense.

2015 we had the 28th.

 

This is with two other OCs, and a full complement of the WR that people have been complaining about us not having.

 

So it's always been the coaches' fault?


Taylor's a nice guy, and a great wildcat QB. But he's a lousy QB otherwise.

 

 

 

I think you're mixing two things, Jsp. 

 

First, Passing yards don't win ball games.  Points win ball games.  Where were we ranked in 2015/2016 for points?

 

Second, he's not saying good OCs magically make Taylor into a pocket passer or improve him from what he is.  He's saying our preceding OCs looked at Taylor's skillset and tailored an offense to fit it (and no, "wildcat" specifically is not what he's good much less great at).

 

This is something Dennison seems pretty set on NOT doing. 

 

 

 

 

13 hours ago, BillsFan1 said:

Switch Coaching staffs.  Put Bellicheat and company in charge of the Bills current roster and Mcd and company in charge of the Pats current roster.  Who wins more games?  McD and company and it isn't close.  Talent wins and the Bills don't have enough of it.  Don't blame the coordinators or the waterboy because the team lacks talent.  Blame Whaley and Brandon...not Dennison and Frazier.

 

Since that's not going to happen, it's kind of a goofy scenario to base any discussion on.

 

I will say this.  If you plugged McDermott, Frazier, and Dennison into the Pats in the offseason and looked at their play the next season, they wouldn't look anything like the same Pats when they played.  Especially after McBeane got done shipping any talented players he chose to ship out of town.

OTOH, the Pats system takes time to learn, so one off season with our current roster wouldn't look too good.  But if they started with the roster we had at the end of last season and worked from there, the results might surprise you.

1 hour ago, NoSaint said:

 

It seemed so obvious, and the resistance to the reality helped make this a tough board to read in the offseason. 

 

1) Tyrod is not a bum but he is a limited player. A system qb if you will (normally used for heady but weak armed guys but just as easy to apply to a gifted athlete that has troubles with reads and decision making)

 

2) Dennison runs a system that plays to his weaknesses and avoids his strengths

 

how anyone thought it was a great pairing beyond “well, I hope one of them surprises us” I am not sure. Both have a spot in the league, but they shouldn’t be together. 

 

 

NoSaint gets it.

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9 hours ago, dave mcbride said:

I think Dennison is terrible, but I think you might be misinterpreting this. The game was without question OVER (i.e., down by 3 TDs with less than 9 minutes to go against the best team in league history), for one. Secondly, they know McCoy is capable of scoring. But they don't know if a) the QB can make that throw in a live-game situation with accuracy (a throw that decent QBs have to occasionally make) and b) if their highly drafted receiver can make contested EZ catches on a bread-and-butter fade route against a good DB (a catch that decent WRs have to occasionally make). 

I'm fine with that series at the goal line. Again, though, I viewed it as a preseason-like series, and I don't like Dennison at all.

Oh come on if he was really just running a "test" with the offense 9 minutes to go on the goal line then I absolutely want him to GTFO. That's even worse than him actually believing he was running the best play available.

 

Complete losers mentality, nobody on that roster thought that game had defaulted to preseason "hey let's see what sticks when we call dog **** plays" mode.

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2 hours ago, NoSaint said:

 

It seemed so obvious, and the resistance to the reality helped make this a tough board to read in the offseason. 

 

1) Tyrod is not a bum but he is a limited player. A system qb if you will (normally used for heady but weak armed guys but just as easy to apply to a gifted athlete that has troubles with reads and decision making)

 

2) Dennison runs a system that plays to his weaknesses and avoids his strengths

 

how anyone thought it was a great pairing beyond “well, I hope one of them surprises us” I am not sure. Both have a spot in the league, but they shouldn’t be together. 

 

I'm struggling to find an example of Dennison's system ever being wildly successful to the point where he doesn't adapt to personnel. I just see the classic ego of a coach that prefers to win in spite of the type of talent handed to him.

 

Maybe he coached a good season out of Schaub?? he doesn't have the resume to insist on a system. This is a guy that pushed his system on a player like Manning. There are offensive coordinators that exist that aren't so darn inflexible. It feels like Dennison got something to work in Houston and has lived by that since. Get something to work here! Clue: this isn't the 2011 Texans, it's the 2017 Bills.

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