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Trading down in the draft?


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1 hour ago, joesixpack said:

 

Your idea is career suicide for McBeane.

 

The thing is, they might not have a choice.  Look at the QB needy teams at the top of the draft this year.  Cleveland, the Giants, Denver, Arizona is ahead of us, the Jets are ahead...who knows is we even have a chance at a QB.  We can all sit here and say let's trade up let's trade up but if the QBs aren't there by the time we can trade...what do you do?  That's what I proposed in this.  If the Giants stay at number 2 in the draft, Darnold and Rosen could be off the board with the top two picks.  Then, would you really want to give up mulitple picks for Mayfield or Allen at this point?  That's up to you.  I say, restock the draft picks for next year if they don't get into that top two conversation and fill out the rest of the roster as best they can.  Maybe they could bring in a guy like Case Keenum or Bradford to bridge the gap.  

 

The QBs have to be available too.  

 

BTW. I'm all for trading up if that option is available.  However, I'm not trading multiple picks for Mayfield or Allen.  Not worth it to me

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2 minutes ago, Buffalo30 said:

The thing is, they might not have a choice.  Look at the QB needy teams at the top of the draft this year.  Cleveland, the Giants, Denver, Arizona is ahead of us, the Jets are ahead...who knows is we even have a chance at a QB.  We can all sit here and say let's trade up let's trade up but if the QBs aren't there by the time we can trade...what do you do?  That's what I proposed in this.  If the Giants stay at number 2 in the draft, Darnold and Rosen could be off the board with the top two picks.  Then, would you really want to give up mulitple picks for Mayfield or Allen at this point?  That's up to you.  I say, restock the draft picks for next year if they don't get into that top two conversation and fill out the rest of the roster as best they can.  Maybe they could bring in a guy like Case Keenum or Bradford to bridge the gap.  

 

The QBs have to be available too.  

 

BTW. I'm all for trading up if that option is available.  However, I'm not trading multiple picks for Mayfield or Allen.  Not worth it to me

 

And in the meantime we're doomed to another year of tryhard.

 

I think I'd rather chew on a red-hot piece of steel.

 

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3 hours ago, Da webster guy said:

Draft talk during the season is bad luck.   This is what led to wide right, homerun throwback, Robert Woods departure, Dennison getting hired, and Gronk committing a felony after the whistle.   

At this point just keep rooting against KC, who might actually be giving us a higher draft pick than our own this spring.

Honestly, I couldn't give a crap if it's bad luck.  I'd rather do my due diligence then believe in some superstition

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1 minute ago, joesixpack said:

 

And in the meantime we're doomed to another year of tryhard.

 

I think I'd rather chew on a red-hot piece of steel.

 

We will see how the dominoes fall though.  If San Fran jumps back up into the 2nd pick...we are in business.  I think they'd want to look to get as many picks as possible to surround Jimmy g with talent.  Seeing that there isn't a lot of top wide receivers or offensive lineman in the class...they should be the target.  Just need the Giants to win

1 minute ago, Canadian Bills Fan said:

I think we need to select the BPA of need at each of our selection spots.

 

The more you trade down, the more you risk on losing more talented players

We ended up with Tre White after we traded down last year...and this year, it's not like the top talent in the class is really really special.  By the time we pick in the teens, it'll be around the same type of player we could get later in the first.  

 

The trade partner must be there though

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2 hours ago, dollars 2 donuts said:

I've responded previously in this thread, but not necessarily to the OT.

 

That said, in my opinion and respectfully, enough is enough.  The start must be with a new QB and you must do whatever it possibly takes to get the best QB that you think is the long term future of this team.  Doesn't mean that QB will be the long term future, but that is what you must have to start with after most 18 years of futility at the position.

 

They had hopes for EJ, but I believe those were simply hopes, even if you ask them about it.  They just needed somebody at that point.

 

Our last winning season Kyle Orton's stats projected over 16 games (and I am not saying he was great by any stretch) would have been 4,000 yards passing, 24 TDs and 14 picks.  Man, we need at least that production regardless of any back and forth we do on these boards.  

 

I always liked Tyrod.  However, I need 3,500 yards and 24 or so TDs from him and if the ONLY WAY I get that from him is having the best options at receiver/TE and one of the best OLines in football, then I just don't think he's that guy.

 

We need a change and it should probably come from the best possible option in the draft.

If you can't select one of the top QBs, do you just select one out of desperation?  That doesn't sound too great.  I 100% agree we need to draft a QB.  But let's take one we love, not one we are ehh about.  

5 minutes ago, Bakin said:

Why are people talking about Bradford or Bridgewater?  Why??  These guys are broken. 

 

Keenum is probably going to be the starter in Minn - he's earned it. 

Because those guys aren't long term starters...they are guys that can bridge the gap as an okay starter for maybe a year.  

 

The entire part of the post that people seem to be missing is we may not have a chance at the top QBs in this draft.  This is an option if that happens. 

If Sam Darnold and Josh Rosen are gone, who here would be willing to trade multiple first round picks and probably other picks for Josh Allen or Baker Mayfield?  Is that something you really want to do?  If I'm giving up a ton of picks, I want one of the top tier guys and that's Darnold or Rosen at this point

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It's been since 1995 since we had a franchise QB. Who in there right mind would want to screw around in this draft with so many QB options and the Bills sitting on two number ones. Do you idiots really want to see the same crap next year and draft Offensive linemen. Please look at the the decade as evidence that is F#@king stupid. Cousins, Bradford and Keenum have been passed around like a joint at a Dead concert. If they were "IT" the teams they were on would keep them. ****HELLO!!****

Edited by Tatonka68
typo
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10 minutes ago, Tatonka68 said:

It's been since 1995 since we had a franchise QB. Who in there mind would like screw around in this draft with so many QB options and the Bills sitting on two number ones. Do you idiots really want to see the same crap next year and draft Offensive linemen. Please look at the the decade as evidence that is F#@king stupid.

If you read, I state that the top QBs could be out of reach if the QB needy teams at the top decide to draft them.  There are more QB needy teams at the top than there are QBs that warrant that those draft spots.  They could be gone and we may not have any say in the matter even with all of our picks.  

 

I am in the camp of trading up for a QB but sometimes it doesn't work out.

 

I poised the idea if that scenario were to happen.  But let's throw around insults.  Can't even have a conversation anymore...

 

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1 minute ago, Tatonka68 said:

It's been since 1995 since we had a franchise QB. Who in there mind would like screw around in this draft with so many QB options and the Bills sitting on two number ones. Do you idiots really want to see the same crap next year and draft Offensive linemen. Please look at the the decade as evidence that is F#@king stupid.

 

 

Tatonka68, just to be sure you are in the "we need a QB now" camp, right?

 

:lol:  Just kidding, my friend.

 

Honestly, it has to stop.  It has stop.  I want one in the first round, too, and the best one we can get.  However, other stupidity (i know, previous regimes, but still) has to stop, as well.  

 

The hell with hindsight as I liked him in the third round then, but nobody on this board...No.  Body.  would have traded up in the third round to get TJ Graham instead of Russell Wilson.

 

No, he would not have been THE Russell Wilson, but he could have sat behind Fitzy for a year, unless he just plain beat him out in his rookie season.  They ended up getting rid of Fitzy anyways and I doubt they were considering him a sacred cow even after they signed him.

 

 

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39 minutes ago, Tatonka68 said:

For those you forgot or were not around this is what a franchise changing QB looks like. Not Cousins, Keenum, Bradford or some other hand me down QB. Without one of these the Bills will be a joke.

6401004p-super-bowl-xxv.jpg

 

 

You up-vote w***e!  :lol:

 

Throw in a picture of Kelly and you'll always get an up-tick from me.

 

 

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41 minutes ago, Tatonka68 said:

For those you forgot or were not around this is what a franchise changing QB looks like. Not Cousins, Keenum, Bradford or some other hand me down QB. Without one of these the Bills will be a joke.

6401004p-super-bowl-xxv.jpg

Well, the options have to be there too.  That was the entire point of the post.  If the top QBs go ahead of us even if we try to trade up...what do we do?  I said try to trade down and restock your picks for next year to give yourself the same position we had this year.  We could fill in the holes and go into next year with only QB on our mind.  Who knows if Allen or Darnold even come out.  Do we really just want to take a QB just to take one in the draft instead of grabbing the guy you love?  I think Tyrod is gone and they will be looking for another veteran to take his place until we draft our guy at QB.  If we don't get our guy, I could see this regime passing and not settling for a 5th QB in the class.  If they get the lucky chance to trade up for Darnold or Rosen, hallelujah.  If not...this may be the best option

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1 hour ago, Buffalo30 said:

Well, the options have to be there too.  That was the entire point of the post.  If the top QBs go ahead of us even if we try to trade up...what do we do?  I said try to trade down and restock your picks for next year to give yourself the same position we had this year.  We could fill in the holes and go into next year with only QB on our mind.  Who knows if Allen or Darnold even come out.  Do we really just want to take a QB just to take one in the draft instead of grabbing the guy you love?  I think Tyrod is gone and they will be looking for another veteran to take his place until we draft our guy at QB.  If we don't get our guy, I could see this regime passing and not settling for a 5th QB in the class.  If they get the lucky chance to trade up for Darnold or Rosen, hallelujah.  If not...this may be the best option

Failure is NOT an option and there will be a trade partner. Bringing in another teams trash to lead the Bills to another 7-9 season is not the "best option". It is the Doug Whaley option. I would resign EJ Manuel, run on every play and play prevent defense the whole game. THus go 0-16 then draft a QB.

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10 minutes ago, Tatonka68 said:

Failure is NOT an option and there will be a trade partner. Bringing in another teams trash to lead the Bills to another 7-9 season is not the "best option". It is the Doug Whaley option. I would resign EJ Manuel, run on every play and play prevent defense the whole game. THus go 0-16 then draft a QB.

 

Agree with you, with the caveat that a 7-9 record next year will not be a failure if we draft the kid we NEED at QB and he throws for 25 tds and almost 4,000 yards, but didn't have the tools because we traded up to get him.

 

I am fine with that season and getting him the tools going forward.

 

...I am also fine with paying what would likely be our best quarterback in 20 years, and hopefully a potential or near star in the league right off the bat, only 5 million per for 4 seasons, giving us the ability to play around with money and get him help.

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Just stay where you are and make your picks. Forget moving up and down like a yoyo. They could have had Watson last year without moving around. There are always guys available no matter when you pick. You just have to select the right ones.

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18 hours ago, SoCal Deek said:

Or...just maybe...they could spend less time on the phones trying to convince other teams to trade up and down, and instead spend more time on actually scouting the true potential of the players that they'll eventually select!  No, wait a minute.  These are the Buffalo Bills and we all that they're WAY smarter than the other 31 Teams.

 

Yea, it's impossible to do both. Especially when they put the scouts on the phone to do the trading.

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I think Mayfield could be this years Deshaun Watson. They will rip him apart but the dudes a winner. They will find out that he is more talented than thought in the combine and continue to harp on his flaws. Height, arm strength, accuracy and his attitude.

Deshaun Watson was a lion from the start and the book is still yet to be written on him could always become an RG3 clone.

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4 hours ago, Buffalo30 said:

If you can't select one of the top QBs, do you just select one out of desperation?  That doesn't sound too great.  I 100% agree we need to draft a QB.  But let's take one we love, not one we are ehh about.  

Because those guys aren't long term starters...they are guys that can bridge the gap as an okay starter for maybe a year.  

 

The entire part of the post that people seem to be missing is we may not have a chance at the top QBs in this draft.  This is an option if that happens. 

If Sam Darnold and Josh Rosen are gone, who here would be willing to trade multiple first round picks and probably other picks for Josh Allen or Baker Mayfield?  Is that something you really want to do?  If I'm giving up a ton of picks, I want one of the top tier guys and that's Darnold or Rosen at this point

We don't need a stop gap. 

We need a guy who can come in on day 1 and run the team. 

If Bridgewater or Bradford are the guys, then so is Tyrod. 

 

I would like to see a QB picked with our first rounder - not sure who yet. And see if he can beat out Tyrod. 

 

Im not interested in a stop gap.

Draft a rookie...and if confident in him, let him start. 

Even Deshawn Watsom didn't start opening day for the Texans. Imagine if Savage just middled it and didn't suck so bad that they HAD to put Watson in?  We'd never know who Watson was....

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The Bills will go after a qb this year and will spend the necessary fortune to get him if need be. They can't not do this.

3 hours ago, Buffalo30 said:

Well, the options have to be there too.  That was the entire point of the post.  If the top QBs go ahead of us even if we try to trade up...what do we do?  I said try to trade down and restock your picks for next year to give yourself the same position we had this year.  We could fill in the holes and go into next year with only QB on our mind.  Who knows if Allen or Darnold even come out.  Do we really just want to take a QB just to take one in the draft instead of grabbing the guy you love?  I think Tyrod is gone and they will be looking for another veteran to take his place until we draft our guy at QB.  If we don't get our guy, I could see this regime passing and not settling for a 5th QB in the class.  If they get the lucky chance to trade up for Darnold or Rosen, hallelujah.  If not...this may be the best option

This is a GREAT qb draft. No one is perfect, of course, but it's the best QB draft in a while. 

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