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Trading down in the draft?


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2 minutes ago, dollars 2 donuts said:

 

 

IF we do what you suggest, BFM, some early mock draft (a couple of weeks ago, can't remember which) had us taking that DLineman from Ohio State, I believe at 18.  Again, I stress if we don't move up, I would be fine with a QB (pick 12-15?) /DL first round.

 

Still, my druthers would still be to end up with one of those picks in the top 10.  I know some here (including me) have talked about tank mode in the first round, but I have no problems with KC finishing 6-10!

I just think we need too much at other positions to spend picks to move up. People are arguing whether Darnold, Rosen, Jackson, Allen or other are the top QBs. I'd be fine with any of them but prefer Darnold and Allen. There is still good talent to be had when we pick again. No need to move up. I think Giants take Rosen. We'll see.

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32 minutes ago, Bills Fan of Maryland said:

I just think we need too much at other positions to spend picks to move up. People are arguing whether Darnold, Rosen, Jackson, Allen or other are the top QBs. I'd be fine with any of them but prefer Darnold and Allen. There is still good talent to be had when we pick again. No need to move up. I think Giants take Rosen. We'll see.

 

 

I'll tell you though, BFM, I have this feeling that we may even be looking at the 5th or 6th QB if we don't move.  I used to like him a lot, but right now I am really not interested in taking Jackson.

 

...as I've stated before I would have loved Watson last year, even reaching at 10...which obviously now would have been fortuitous.

Edited by dollars 2 donuts
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24 minutes ago, dollars 2 donuts said:

 

 

I'll tell you though, BFM, I have this feeling that we may even be looking at the 5th or 6th QB if we don't move.  I used to like him a lot, but right now I am really interested in taking Jackson.

 

...as I've stated before I would have loved Watson last year, even reaching at 10...which obviously now would have been fortuitous.

 

If Dennison is going to be stuck in his ways I don't want Jackson.  If he's going to be flexible like the Texans coach then I'd be fine with Jackson.

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Go get your QB this year. I don't want another short term journeyman. We could still have two first round picks this year and trade next years first to move up.  SF, Chicago, Texans, Colts, and Bucs are potential trade partners depending how everything plays out. Right now we are starring down the barrel at 7-9.

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9 hours ago, Buffalo30 said:

As I stated, in this scenario they didn't find the right trade partner to move up.  I suggested they find a guy like Bradford or Keenum to play as the bridge QB for next year.  I'm with ya, I want the QB too but sometimes there's just too many QB needy teams that pick ahead of us.  RIght now, the Browns, Giants and Broncos look like they all might draft a QB and they draft 1, 2 and 4 respectively.  The QB thing might not happen this year.  So I say trade down again if they can find a trade partner and try to fill in the majority of the holes.  

They have a nice chunk of change to play with in the offseason as well especially if they ditch Tryod's contract.  They did a nice job of adding Poyer and Hyde who have been pretty darn good in the secondary. I expect we go after a few more free agents this year as they will be letting most of the past regime's players walk in free agency and get their own hand picked players in the building.  This will be a totally different team next year if they can do this offseason well. 

 

Your idea is career suicide for McBeane.

 

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I've responded previously in this thread, but not necessarily to the OT.

 

That said, in my opinion and respectfully, enough is enough.  The start must be with a new QB and you must do whatever it possibly takes to get the best QB that you think is the long term future of this team.  Doesn't mean that QB will be the long term future, but that is what you must have to start with after most 18 years of futility at the position.

 

They had hopes for EJ, but I believe those were simply hopes, even if you ask them about it.  They just needed somebody at that point.

 

Our last winning season Kyle Orton's stats projected over 16 games (and I am not saying he was great by any stretch) would have been 4,000 yards passing, 24 TDs and 14 picks.  Man, we need at least that production regardless of any back and forth we do on these boards.  

 

I always liked Tyrod.  However, I need 3,500 yards and 24 or so TDs from him and if the ONLY WAY I get that from him is having the best options at receiver/TE and one of the best OLines in football, then I just don't think he's that guy.

 

We need a change and it should probably come from the best possible option in the draft.

Edited by dollars 2 donuts
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I think the only way the Bills dont draft a QB in the first round is if they can sign Garoppolo in the offseason. He is young enough to sign long term. I think they also need to sign an experienced #1/2 WR in free agency. Then use the draft to add talent and depth. 

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3 minutes ago, BillsfanAZ said:

I think the only way the Bills dont draft a QB in the first round is if they can sign Garoppolo in the offseason. He is young enough to sign long term. I think they also need to sign an experienced #1/2 WR in free agency. Then use the draft to add talent and depth. 

 

 

If they decide not to keep Tyrod as insurance I believe that frees up another 10-12 million in caps space.

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9 minutes ago, dollars 2 donuts said:

 

 

If they decide not to keep Tyrod as insurance I believe that frees up another 10-12 million in caps space.

It is up to the Bills since he is under contract next season but that is a lot of money to be tied up in QB that will most likely not be starting. I think they cut Taylor to free up cap space and give them more options. 

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11 hours ago, billsfan714 said:

I could see it.    I havent seen any first round mock draft with Baker Mayfield in it.   There is talent past the first round at quarterback.   With the holes on this team, and especially the lines and lbs, I see McBean using all these picks and definetly looking to acquire more.   At G you have Ritchie on his last year and Vlad, who knows where Millier is on this staff but it isnt good.   Cordy and his anke and high salary.....Beane is going to look at that.    DT you may be seeing the end of KW in a Bills uni and you have what Washington.    Big need there.....Lorax is near the end.   Brown is a UFA.     5 picks in 3 rds......yeah were going to need them all and maybe more.

 

 

 

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2747404-2018-nfl-mock-draft-post-week-13-breakdown

http://draftwire.usatoday.com/2017/11/29/2018-nfl-mock-draft-updated-4-round-projections-after-week-12/3/

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/news/2018-nfl-mock-draft-cowboys-falcons-add-wr-speed-with-ridley-burnett/

 

Three mocks with Mayfield in the first round, all among the first few mocks on a google search for "2018 mock draft". 

 

Mayfield's in plenty of first round mocks.

 

And I know what's coming next from some people on here:  "That guy's an idiot and that guy's never right and the third guy has him in the mid-twenties and he could easily fall." All justifications,  no good arguments. He might easily make the first. Might not but it could easily happen.

 

 

McShay thinks Mayfield will go in the first. Kiper is not sure, says he's on the fringe.

http://www.espn.com/nfl/draft2018/story/_/id/21665021/2018-nfl-draft-primer-mel-kiper-todd-mcshay-answer-25-questions-prospects-rankings-mock-draft

Edited by Thurman#1
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10 minutes ago, BillsfanAZ said:

It is up to the Bills since he is under contract next season but that is a lot of money to be tied up in QB that will most likely not be starting. I think they cut Taylor to free up cap space and give them more options. 

I'd like to keep Tyrod as insurance, also, but your post makes sense and why he will probably not be here next season.  I'd look for someone like Bradford or Bridgewater to come in and next year.

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1 hour ago, joesixpack said:

 

Your idea is career suicide for McBeane.

 

 

 

Yep, we have tried the trade down, ignore the QB position, build the roster up approach.  Do whatever it takes to get the QB you want.  If that means giving up 3 number one picks(the two this year & another one next year) so be it.  I am not even sure if that will be enough but until you have a QB nothing else matters. 

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Well we're movin on up, in the draft.
To find us a QB who's a tough guy.
Movin on up in this draft.
We finally gonna get that piece of the pie

 

TT wont be here so quit bitchin;
Peterman may turn out ot be a thrilll.
Took a whole lotta years just to get up that hill.


Now we're finally gonna be in the big leagues
Getits the Patsies turn to be beat.
As long as we live, it's Bills for me baby
There ain't nothin wrong with that.



I'm a little bored .. weak attempt but not to shaby improvements are encourgaed

Edited by ddaryl
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29 minutes ago, dollars 2 donuts said:

 

 

If they decide not to keep Tyrod as insurance I believe that frees up another 10-12 million in caps space.

 

 

$15 million. 

 

Last year they paid him $14.5 mill (base salary plus signing bonus) and $15.5 mill was guaranteed. So $1 mill is guaranteed this year, from his roster bonus. In 2018, his base is $10 mill and roster bonus is $6 mill. So he would cost $16 mill, of which $1 mill is guaranteed.

 

This is from Spotrac and I believe I've interpreted it all correctly, but if I haven't, please somebody correct me.

 

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/buffalo-bills/tyrod-taylor-7899/

 

It looked all along like it would be very easy to cut him this offseason - if they want to - once he signed the new deal last offseason. That's a lot of cash to save.

Edited by Thurman#1
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Just now, Thurman#1 said:

$15 million. 

 

Last year they paid him $14.5 mill (base salary plus signing bonus) and $15.5 mill was guaranteed. So $1 mill is guaranteed this year, from his roster bonus. Base is $10 mill and roster bonus is $6 mill. So he would cost $16 mill, of which $1 mill is guaranteed.

 

This is from Spotrac and I believe I've intepreted it all correctly, but if I haven't, please somebody correct me.

 

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/buffalo-bills/tyrod-taylor-7899/

 

It looked all along like it would be very easy to cut him this offseason - if they want to - once he signed the new deal last offseason. That's a lot of cash to save.

If you use spotrac's roster manager for 2018 and cut Tyrod it says the savings is $9.45M

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7 minutes ago, BuffaloHokie13 said:

If you use spotrac's roster manager for 2018 and cut Tyrod it says the savings is $9.45M

 

 

From what I can tell just looking quickly, that's real time. In other words if you cut Tyrod TODAY that's what you'd save on the 2018 cap.

 

Nobody wants to cut him today. If you do, a bunch of his 2017 guaranteed money hits the cap next year.

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3 minutes ago, BuffaloHokie13 said:

If you use spotrac's roster manager for 2018 and cut Tyrod it says the savings is $9.45M

 

Can get you 3/4 of the way to a quality receiver or resigning Benjamin, depending upon what you see in possible last 4 games for him.

 

Not to hijack this thread, just a tangent; right now i'm thinking that with our first five picks, considering that we should expect them to contribute, QB, DL, WR, OL, LB in no particular order, other than QB being first.

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New GMs inheriting a bad to mediocre team prioritize taking a QB because it's typically the main reason a team isn't successful. But not in Buffalo, where GMs found every reason not to take one for years.

 

McBeane know this team is nowhere right now at QB.  TT, albeit without knowing his top 2 wideouts, has proven he's not the guy. And if the HC and GM want to be around for any length of time, they'll get their guy this year.

 

The fastest way to being a solid team is acquiring the QB and refusing to take one or taking one out of sheer need isn't the way to do it.

 

 

 

 

 

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13 minutes ago, Thurman#1 said:

From what I can tell just looking quickly, that's real time. In other words if you cut Tyrod TODAY that's what you'd save on the 2018 cap.

Nobody wants to cut him today. If you do, a bunch of his 2017 guaranteed money hits the cap next year.

No, cutting him now is what happens when you manage the 2017 roster instead of the 2018 roster, which is a -$1M savings.

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