Bing Bong Posted November 28, 2017 Share Posted November 28, 2017 Honestly I don't know much about Shaq's game so far. Loved him in the Panthers game, but I'll concede. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloRush Posted November 28, 2017 Share Posted November 28, 2017 1 minute ago, PetermanThrew5Picks said: Honestly I don't know much about Shaq's game so far. Loved him in the Panthers game, but I'll concede. That was his best game of the season. IMO I think that 1st round picks have to be very good players and solid contributors on your defense. You said if Shaq was a "serviceable starter" you think Whaley did good? I hold 1st round picks to a higher standard. Of course, the draft is a crap shoot but you have to hit your high draft picks and Whaley did not do this. You can find serviceable starters in the mid-round of the draft or in free agency. But if your 1st round picks aren't going to be better than serviceable, you're likely a 6-10 team which is what the Bills have been 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bing Bong Posted November 28, 2017 Share Posted November 28, 2017 3 minutes ago, BuffaloRush said: #WhaleyApologist Lol sure I am a Whaley apologist, I already said I like him. Who cares. My point is if a new GM comes in next year and trades Tre White and the entire draft class for lower round picks, does that mean McBeane is a bad GM? By your logic it does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogblitz Posted November 28, 2017 Share Posted November 28, 2017 4 minutes ago, BuffaloRush said: That was his best game of the season. IMO I think that 1st round picks have to be very good players and solid contributors on your defense. You said if Shaq was a "serviceable starter" you think Whaley did good? I hold 1st round picks to a higher standard. Of course, the draft is a crap shoot but you have to hit your high draft picks and Whaley did not do this. You can find serviceable starters in the mid-round of the draft or in free agency. But if your 1st round picks aren't going to be better than serviceable, you're likely a 6-10 team which is what the Bills have been Bills haven't been 6-10 since 2013. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreggTX Posted November 28, 2017 Share Posted November 28, 2017 There's no question that Shaq's performance is a major disappointment, but we have so many other needs that I don't see an upgrade at LDE coming this offseason. Other than Hughes, our front 7 is a wreck. There are other needs as well as franchise QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerseyBills Posted November 28, 2017 Share Posted November 28, 2017 6 hours ago, Kingston Bills Fan said: Shaq has been disappointing all year now he was benched for who knows what reason (probably performance) we let Ragland go but maybe it was Shaq we should have let go. Our Dline is needs a lot of help in the draft! Either way DT isn’t our only need on the D-line. https://www.buffalorumblings.com/2017/11/27/16705854/shaw-lawson-didnt-start-vs-kansas-city-chiefs-for-unknown-punishment-sean-mcdermott He had a solid game. Was out there with Hughes and Thorton on final 2 plays. Bills were in 3-3-5 Alexander blitzed last play , sending four. He's still getting plenty of playing time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fadingpain Posted November 28, 2017 Share Posted November 28, 2017 3 hours ago, reddogblitz said: He was a Rex guy. I'm surprised he's still on the team. He was definitely a Rex guy; so far it is fair to say he has been a disappointment. When the new regime are done molding the team in their image and have had a few drafts/years to modify personnel (they've already done a ton of changing) I think Shaq will not be retained in the mix. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ganesh Posted November 28, 2017 Share Posted November 28, 2017 9 hours ago, Houston's #1 Bills Fan said: From another article, it sounds like a discipline issue with McBeane. Coach gets to decide on discipline Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8-8 Forever? Posted November 28, 2017 Share Posted November 28, 2017 (edited) 9 hours ago, Kirby Jackson said: He was benched for disciplinary reasons. McDermott said as much today. He’s been good against the run. Teams have run right up the middle. With that being said, he has certainly been disappointing as a first round pick. He lacks explosiveness as a pass rusher. Shaq is a plugger. He was drafted into Rex's scheme- disguised blitz defense . he wasn't drafted to be a mano a mano sack artist, as Rex's defense doesn't pressure the QB that way. In Rex's scheme, the sacker is usually disguised as a dropper -- could be anyone . Just like Ragland was drafted as a 3-4 inside LB thumper (another Rex defense idea). This years defense bears zero resemblence to last years so none of Rex's picks fit it. McD plays zone, Rex wanted man cover guys. totally different. Really sucks when they blow it all up. this is what you get -- all kinds of misfit parts. but on balance, going back to straight up front 4 pressure/traditional extra man blitzes , etc., with zone behind it works better in todays NFL -- not much to look at , but it works better. Edited November 28, 2017 by 8-8 Forever? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted November 28, 2017 Share Posted November 28, 2017 28 minutes ago, 8-8 Forever? said: He was drafted into Rex's scheme- disguised blitz defense . he wasn't drafted to be a mano a mano sack artist, as Rex's defense doesn't pressure the QB that way. In Rex's scheme, the sacker is usually disguised as a dropper -- could be anyone . Just like Ragland was drafted as a 3-4 inside LB thumper (another Rex defense idea). This years defense bears zero resemblence to last years so none of Rex's picks fit it. McD plays zone, Rex wanted man cover guys. totally different. Really sucks when they blow it all up. this is what you get -- all kinds of misfit parts. but on balance, going back to straight up front 4 pressure/traditional extra man blitzes , etc., with zone behind it works better in todays NFL -- not much to look at , but it works better. As a prospect though Shaq was a traditional 4-3 DE. He was diverse enough to play in Rex’s scheme but this scheme was thought to be a better fit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted November 28, 2017 Share Posted November 28, 2017 McD and Dareus had a talk and a few weeks later..... McD and Shaq had a talk and a few weeks later..... (time will tell) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Best Player Available Posted November 28, 2017 Share Posted November 28, 2017 7 hours ago, reddogblitz said: He was a Rex guy. I'm surprised he's still on the team. Maybe he can seal the edge. So can some of the other less hearlded DE's. I just don't see a long career in Buffalo for him. Unless he can develop some better pass rushing skills. He is more of a Rex guy than Whaley. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hemma Posted November 28, 2017 Share Posted November 28, 2017 His quick twitch reminds me a little bit of Kyle Orton. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleeding Bills Blue Posted November 28, 2017 Share Posted November 28, 2017 He seems to be around the ball a lot, and always finishing plays. I have no problem with the player - i don't think he's like... a dominant first round pick. But he seems to care and play hard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted November 28, 2017 Share Posted November 28, 2017 12 hours ago, Kirby Jackson said: He was benched for disciplinary reasons. McDermott said as much today. He’s been good against the run. Teams have run right up the middle. With that being said, he has certainly been disappointing as a first round pick. He lacks explosiveness as a pass rusher. Shaq is a plugger. The Whaley imprint is steadily vanishing. I'm not saying that Lawson is a bust but as a first round pick he certainly has been a disappointment (as you noted}. The one thing that McDermott has brought to the team is accountability. It doesn't matter if you are a top tier player such as Dareus or a secondary type player. Players are being held accountable. Mario Williams quit on the Bills while Rex silently stood by. That type of sabotaging behavior would not be tolerated by the wrestling coach. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted November 28, 2017 Share Posted November 28, 2017 Just now, JohnC said: The Whaley imprint is steadily vanishing. I'm not saying that Lawson is a bust but as a first round pick he certainly has been a disappointment (as you noted}. The one thing that McDermott has brought to the team is accountability. It doesn't matter if you are a top tier player such as Dareus or a secondary type player. Players are being held accountable. Mario Williams quit on the Bills while Rex silently stood by. That type of sabotaging behavior would not be tolerated by the wrestling coach. If we kept more of the Whaley guys, we'd be easily in the playoffs. And I think Shaq was more of a Rex guy. but here is the problem with letting productive vets go and using draft picks replace them. There is no guarantee a Draft pick will live up to the vet's play. I give Tre White a ton of credit for replacing Gilmore but that is the only recent example I can think of (and I'd still rather have Watson ). 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted November 28, 2017 Share Posted November 28, 2017 3 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said: If we kept more of the Whaley guys, we'd be easily in the playoffs. And I think Shaq was more of a Rex guy. but here is the problem with letting productive vets go and using draft picks replace them. There is no guarantee a Draft pick will live up to the vet's play. I give Tre White a ton of credit for replacing Gilmore but that is the only recent example I can think of (and I'd still rather have Watson ). I respectfully but strenuously disagree with your view that the Whaley "team" was a playoff caliber team. In my view Whaley had a habit of over-valuing his talent. He made expedient moves to get over the proverbial hump that ended up mortgaging the future. He had a bad habit of gratuitously giving up picks for selections that weren't the cost. Many people point out that giving up Watkins for a second round pick and a starting CB was a big mistake. Yet, with our current qb situation having a talented Watkins would have been a waste. There were also considerations of cost and whether he wanted to be here. You are right that there are no guarantees with draft picks. There are also no guarantees that more costly free agent acquisitions are going to work out either. Whether you agree or not Beane has clearly and forcefully stated that the Bills are going to rebuild mostly through the draft. I agree with that approach. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benderbender Posted November 28, 2017 Share Posted November 28, 2017 (edited) Let’s trade him to Jacksonville for a 7th and complete their defense for some more chump change and another cap hit Edited November 28, 2017 by benderbender Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McBean Posted November 28, 2017 Share Posted November 28, 2017 Yes. For being a first round pick he should be more impactful than he is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lfod Posted November 28, 2017 Share Posted November 28, 2017 Well I always want the best outcome in every situation. The team is going through a lot of change. You have to do what you can to establish your place as Head Coach of a team. I can only trust the process. I have no other choice. I think what is clear to me is the new coach and general manager have a direction with the team. They sacrificed for the future and focused on defense. They just kept pieces on offense to keep it entertaining. At 5-2 he looks golden so they spend picks to get a wide receiver for Tyrod and make a push. The defense implodes and Tyrod doesn't use new wide receiver and is benched. Then he goes with Nate and he uses him once and injury happens. I looks to me like a long term planning and win now direction. I give them credit for all the moves and still ending up looking good. I didn't like the defensive collapse but they were basically winning all the games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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