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Rubes

Here's our problem: Draft Rounds 1-3

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2009    1    Aaron Maybin – GONE
2009    1    Eric Wood – Starter
2009    2    Jairus Byrd – GONE
2009    2    Andy Levitre – GONE

 

2010    1    C.J. Spiller – GONE
2010    2    Torell Troup – GONE
2010    3    Alex Carrington – GONE

 

2011    1    Marcell Dareus – GONE
2011    2    Aaron Williams – GONE
2011    3    Kelvin Sheppard – GONE

 

2012    1    Stephon Gilmore – GONE
2012    2    Cordy Glenn – Starter
2012    3    T.J. Graham – GONE

 

2013    1    EJ Manuel – GONE
2013    2    Robert Woods – GONE
2013    2    Kiko Alonso – GONE
2013    3    Marquise Goodwin – GONE

 

2014    1    Sammy Watkins – GONE
2014    2    Cyrus Kouandjio – GONE
2014    3    Preston Brown – Starter

 

2015    1    NONE
2015    2    Ronald Darby – GONE
2015    3    John Miller – NOT EVEN ACTIVE

 

2016    1    Shaq Lawson – Starter
2016    2    Reggie Ragland – GONE
2016    3    Adolphus Washington – Starter

 

Gotta build your team around the first three rounds. So few of them left.

 

Edited by Rubes
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19 minutes ago, JaCrispy said:

....so you’re sayin’ there’s a chance.

 

There is, but it's going to take a long time...

 

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Certainly a problem, but the facts are, we are moving forward. You can’t just point to “gone” without mentioning what we got in return. The math ain’t right. 

 

This is waaaaay too simple of an approach to be negative. Include contract concerns, what we got in return, how they performed with the new team, etc. Then, maybe, it puts things into context. 

Edited by Augie
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Just now, BillsEnthusiast said:

Man. Goes to show why firing coaches every two years doesn't work at all.

 

I'm all for continuity but the Bills problem isn't that they fire coaches too soon it's that they can't seem to identify a good coach. 

 

I'm not sold on McD to be honest. 

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They have a chance this year to make a nice dent in patching up the holes on this roster.  If they have a really nice draft, this ship could really turn around

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10 minutes ago, Augie said:

Certainly a problem, but the facts are, we are moving forward. You can’t just point to “gone” without mentioning what we got in return. The math ain’t right. 

But more right than wrong. There's the obvious moves that worked out great - Kelvin Sheppard for Jerry Hughes.  But the ones that bother me are the dump jobs. Ragland: I didn't like the pick. But trading the 41st overall pick as he begins his 2nd year, before he's even had a chance to reestablish his health? That's why you get something like the 100th or lower overall pick back from KC. I know people will scream "scheme" and "3-4" over and over again, but if he's a good football player when healthy - and pretty much everyone thought he was - then losing 3 years of team control for the 100th overall pick was just a McDermott "he's not MY guy" power play. As many have said, sometimes you gotta find a way to make the system fit the player too.  And then you have a couple too many flat-out busts like Kouandjio and EJ ...

EDIT: I don't put Darby or Watkins in the same category as Ragland. Those moves were justifiable from a football/competition cycle perspective. Setting aside Gaines/Matthews coming back, we still go what (at the time) projected as probably a pick in the 100ish range in exchange for 2 years of Darby. We got back what (at the time) projected as probably a pick in the 40s overall for one year of team control of Watkins. Ragland wasn't defensible like those two.

Edited by The Frankish Reich

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I have been here for all of these drafts and their disappointments and the coaching changes. i think we should let Mc Dermott go more than  three years before calling for his head. The same with Beane. We may be surprised. I also think  that the Peterman experiment was justified because of Tyrod's lack of downfield success. The first three of Peterman's interceptions were not his fault. ,One to a back who didn't catch, and two to an unblocked defensive end who disrupted Peterman's arm. I suppose the QB could have taken the sack on the two. and maybe he should have but how many times have we seen that. Peterman may be our QB of the future and he may not. Half a game is in no was a litmus test.

sorry about the typo. , no way a litmus test

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1 minute ago, PromoTheRobot said:

So are you saying the problem is poor drafting or too many regime changes?

Mostly regime changes and those new regimes wanting to change everything and not build off of what the previous regime did well. A constant cycle of ****.

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1 hour ago, Rubes said:

2009    1    Aaron Maybin – GONE
2009    1    Eric Wood – Starter
2009    2    Jairus Byrd – GONE
2009    2    Andy Levitre – GONE

 

2010    1    C.J. Spiller – GONE
2010    2    Torell Troup – GONE
2010    3    Alex Carrington – GONE

 

2011    1    Marcell Dareus – GONE
2011    2    Aaron Williams – GONE
2011    3    Kelvin Sheppard – GONE

 

2012    1    Stephon Gilmore – GONE
2012    2    Cordy Glenn – Starter
2012    3    T.J. Graham – GONE

 

2013    1    EJ Manuel – GONE
2013    2    Robert Woods – GONE
2013    2    Kiko Alonso – GONE
2013    3    Marquise Goodwin – GONE

 

2014    1    Sammy Watkins – GONE
2014    2    Cyrus Kouandjio – GONE
2014    3    Preston Brown – Starter

 

2015    1    NONE
2015    2    Ronald Darby – GONE
2015    3    John Miller – NOT EVEN ACTIVE

 

2016    1    Shaq Lawson – Starter
2016    2    Reggie Ragland – GONE
2016    3    Adolphus Washington – Starter

 

Gotta build your team around the first three rounds. So few of them left.

 

If you went back all the way back to the 2000 draft you would also see a similar pattern of ineptness. We have drafted absolutely terribly and missed the playoffs at the same time. coincidence?  some of the picks listed here were at least decent for a while. If you go back before this there are a ton of flat out busts, Erik Flowers, Mike Wiliiams, JP Losman, Tim Anderson, McCargo were all garbage and all #1 or #2 round picks. A complete waste. 

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10 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

Mostly regime changes and those new regimes wanting to change everything and not build off of what the previous regime did well. A constant cycle of ****.

 

There is truth in that.  The constant churn of players because they don't buy-in/fit the "new" system continually pushes the chance for success into the future. 

Edited by keepthefaith

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24 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

So are you saying the problem is poor drafting or too many regime changes?

 

My two cents ... regime changes.

 

Gotta stick with McBeane for at least 5 years, IMO.

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52 minutes ago, Wily Dog said:

I have been here for all of these drafts and their disappointments and the coaching changes. i think we should let Mc Dermott go more than  three years before calling for his head. The same with Beane. We may be surprised. I also think  that the Peterman experiment was justified because of Tyrod's lack of downfield success. The first three of Peterman's interceptions were not his fault. ,One to a back who didn't catch, and two to an unblocked defensive end who disrupted Peterman's arm. I suppose the QB could have taken the sack on the two. and maybe he should have but how many times have we seen that. Peterman may be our QB of the future and he may not. Half a game is in no was a litmus test.

sorry about the typo. , no way a litmus test

 

McD will get another year but he should be on a short leash. His decision making skills are a huge question mark right now and his vision of what he wants the team to be as far as roster construction is kind of alarming. 

 

A head coach lives and dies with his choices for assistant coaches and McD thinking that Rick Dennison was a good idea for his OC is mind boggling. A guy who has never called his own plays and now has been proven to be predictable. If the Bills offense is in shotgun, we pass at an 82% rate. If we're under center we run the ball 72% of the time. That's completely predictable. If the Bills are in shotgun - they're passing. If the QB is under center - they're running. Horrible. The Oline has regressed in both the running game and in pass pro. He changed the scheme completely from taking a power and gap scheme offensive line with players better suited for that scheme and changing it to an unfamiliar zone scheme was an incredibly dumb decision and it shows in the regression of the offense. Dennison was a very poor hire by McD. He needs to make the change next season and hire a young and innovative offensive mind or risk getting fired because of his poor decision. 

 

As far as the Peterman decision that was a call that he NEVER should have made. His team was 5-4 and the current 6 seed. Benching your starting QB after 2 losses and 2 defensive implosions (now 3) made it seem like he didn't know what he was doing or that he was making Taylor the scapegoat for the catastrophe that is his own defense. That Peterman had the literal worst first half, first start performance in the history of football, just made the narrative that McD has no idea what he is doing all the more glaring. That kid just isn't good. It is what it is. He may be better with a few years on the bench learning but he is not ready and nowhere near the quarterback that Taylor is. 

 

Let's talk about the Peterman interception to Dimarco just to reiterate how bad Dennison is. Why are you throwing the ball to DiMarco in the first place. He runs a 4.9 40 yard dash and is a full back. That's as dumb as giving anything but goal line and 3rd/4th and short carries to Mike Tolbert. Dennison is awful. 

Edited by Theshallowcross

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1 hour ago, Augie said:

Certainly a problem, but the facts are, we are moving forward. You can’t just point to “gone” without mentioning what we got in return. The math ain’t right. 

 

This is waaaaay too simple of an approach to be negative. Include contract concerns, what we got in return, how they performed with the new team, etc. Then, maybe, it puts things into context. 

 

Not to mention that they’re gone, but even if ALL of them were here, how many are actually good?

 

Buddy and Doug, Super Geniuses! 😜

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1 minute ago, Gugny said:

 

My two cents ... regime changes.

 

Gotta stick with McBeane for at least 5 years, IMO.

And if he goes 6-10, 7-9, 6-10 we just keep the status quo so he can get his 5 years? What if this team doesn’t actually improve under his tutelage? I see no issue in wanting to give a staff time to turn things around but blindly giving him 5 years without actually seeing how this team performs seems wrong.  

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1 minute ago, Bangarang said:

And if he goes 6-10, 7-9, 6-10 we just keep the status quo so he can get his 5 years? What if this team doesn’t actually improve under his tutelage? I see no issue in wanting to give a staff time to turn things around but blindly giving him 5 years without actually seeing how this team performs seems wrong.  

 

It depends on a lot of things.  We're gonna have a losing record this year.  Likely next year, too.  If Beane builds the O and D lines and ... for the love of Christ, gets a QB ... then the expectation should be playoffs.  But this team is stripped right now.  The only good players they have are old.  It's gonna take a while and I think some consistency with the coaching staff will help.

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12 minutes ago, Gugny said:

 

My two cents ... regime changes.

 

Gotta stick with McBeane for at least 5 years, IMO.

 

We are out on the bleeding edge with this gug. Fight the good fight.

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In all fairness there are guys who aren’t even in the league anymore. Going back to 2009 is a LONG time for football players.

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One bright spot, there has been a lot of turnover in the scouting department.   Which was badly needed.   We will see what the  GM does in his first draft and what the scouting staff gets us in the next 2 years.

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Thank god we have all those picks though. Eventhough we never draft the right guys. If I was running the bills I would have taken the Chiefs 1st and Tyrod and sent it to Washington for Cousins. Then you immediately extend him. That way you have your own 1st left and a bunch of other picks. And you have your qb of the present and future. I don’t want these guys to draft their own qb. I don’t trust them to identify the right one and I certainly don’t expect them to develop one. I don’t know why people are so afraid to trade our picks for proven guys. We never pick the right guys anyway. Use the picks on guys that competent teams already identified and developed. 

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