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billspro

Future of the QB position

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This is probably the most worrisome thing for me following the three losses. I don't think there is anyway we can go back to Tyrod after benching him. I was hoping that he would be a stop gap until we found someone better. 

 

I was hoping for a lot more out of Peterman, I am not sure he is even a serviceable back up at this point. 

 

Looking ahead to the draft, Cleveland will certainly be taking a QB with the first overall pick. The Giants, Broncos, Colts, Cards, and Jets are all in the Qb market as well. 

 

What do the Bills do? Do they trade all our picks to move up to number 2 and take Darnold or Rosen? Should they stay put and take a chance on a guy like Allen or Mayfield in the second? Should they hope a guy like Lamar Jackson fall to them in round 1 (you better find a creative OC)?

 

If they don't hit on this position this year we are going to be talking about the same thing five years from now. 

The worst thing would be to have Peterman play okay and they decide to go with him and not address the position.

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If you do an honest analysis of this team, the absolute top needs are not at QB. Yes, they need a good one. But they have to massively upgrade the O line and maybe 80% of the overall D immediately this off season. It makes no sense to package a bunch of picks to move up for a top QB who will be wrecked behind the O line. Get the O line right in '18, use '19 to get the QB and get the D started in the right direction, use '20 to fill it out. In 4 or 5 years, they should be ready to make a run at post season play.

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I agree with the above. Posted elsewhere that we have neglected the lines for too long.  

 

But, if they think a guy like Rosen is can't miss then go get him and trust your scouts and pro personnel folks to find some guys that can play up front through lower round  picks or free agency.

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8 minutes ago, yungmack said:

If you do an honest analysis of this team, the absolute top needs are not at QB. Yes, they need a good one. But they have to massively upgrade the O line and maybe 80% of the overall D immediately this off season. It makes no sense to package a bunch of picks to move up for a top QB who will be wrecked behind the O line. Get the O line right in '18, use '19 to get the QB and get the D started in the right direction, use '20 to fill it out. In 4 or 5 years, they should be ready to make a run at post season play.

You are right that they are light years away but I would still get a QB in the first round next year if they like someone

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12 minutes ago, yungmack said:

If you do an honest analysis of this team, the absolute top needs are not at QB. Yes, they need a good one. But they have to massively upgrade the O line and maybe 80% of the overall D immediately this off season. It makes no sense to package a bunch of picks to move up for a top QB who will be wrecked behind the O line. Get the O line right in '18, use '19 to get the QB and get the D started in the right direction, use '20 to fill it out. In 4 or 5 years, they should be ready to make a run at post season play.

They need to draft a QB in the first two rounds. This team has a lot of holes, but without a QB you have no chance and they take several years to develop so they need to get one ASAP.

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I don't think the focus should be on getting a first round QB.  The focus should be on getting someone you think is the guy that is that can't miss guy.  Sometimes it's easy to tell, like a Payton.  But many times not.

 

Beane has put together a solid front office with some well respected personnel people.  Let them figure out who they think is the best guy, and if you have to move up do so.  But if not stay out and get him when your turn comes around, whether lower first or second round.

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20 minutes ago, yungmack said:

If you do an honest analysis of this team, the absolute top needs are not at QB. Yes, they need a good one. But they have to massively upgrade the O line and maybe 80% of the overall D immediately this off season. It makes no sense to package a bunch of picks to move up for a top QB who will be wrecked behind the O line. Get the O line right in '18, use '19 to get the QB and get the D started in the right direction, use '20 to fill it out. In 4 or 5 years, they should be ready to make a run at post season play.

I disagree...we could use the extra picks to get the QB- let him sit for a year...we will likely have a top 5 pick in 2019 due to not being able to fill holes in 2018...we then trade that top 5 pick for a kings ransom to help build the rest of the team- similar to what SF will be doing this year

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Im not going to be popular here at all for this but Nathan is not the player we saw Sunday. He played horrible. Dont sell him down the river yet. Your points on taking the steps and getting this team built for the long haul are spot on. Build the team. It is too old and slow. Give McD time and we will eventually  be good.

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1 hour ago, billspro said:

This is probably the most worrisome thing for me following the three losses. I don't think there is anyway we can go back to Tyrod after benching him. I was hoping that he would be a stop gap until we found someone better. 

 

 

I keep seeing this but don't really know what it means.  They go back to him by saying, "you're starting this Sunday".  Simple as that.

 

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I believe a good QB can hide so many other flaws.  A good, young QB is a ticket to perennial playoff contention.    The Bills are going to finish 5-11 or 6-10.  The D will not improve the rest of the way.  This puts them drafting in the top 10--around number 8. 

 

Bills have several options drafting this high. 

 

1) Package the Chiefs #1 (around 25) and our number one and our number 2 should net us a top 3 pick.  Assume that Darnold stays in school.  You are looking at Rosen, Allen, Mayfield, Rudolph.  If the Bills can get Allen or Rosen -- I would go for it.

 

2) Stay put at 8- Look at a QB like Clayton Thorson (NW), Luke Falk (Washington State), Jarret Stidham (Auburn)--at 8 you can put this expensive scouting staff to work and find the gem in what others consider the second tier.  Honestly, depending on who declares, the second tier this year is quite good.  Its a buyers market.  If the Bills do this, they may also look at hedging their bets with a veteran who has starting experience.  I believe any of these three QBs is better than the two QBs the Bills have spent mid-first rounders on recently.  If Allen and Rosen are off the board and the Bills could not trade up -- I would stay put and take what others consider to be a second tier or grab Rudolph or Mayfield if they drop past the QB needy teams for some reason.  If its Mayfield -- I could see him doing a table drop tailgate shot at some point.

 

We'll hear all the bull **** this spring-- they reached, blah, blah, blah.  There is no such thing as a reach for a QB.  You scout like hell and then pick the best of the lot at your pick.  Its not a reach...its a bet.  

 

If you go with option 2 -- Focus on the lines in the Draft (Except go hard after Star Lotulelei)  and the skill positions in FA.  The last couple of years there are always skill position players who end up on the scrap heap in the offseason (See Jeremy Maclin) -- take advantage of this.

 

 

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28 minutes ago, KD in CA said:

 

I keep seeing this but don't really know what it means.  They go back to him by saying, "you're starting this Sunday".  Simple as that.

 

 

I meant I don't see them going with him as the starter next year. He does not appear to be a part of the process.

1 hour ago, yungmack said:

If you do an honest analysis of this team, the absolute top needs are not at QB. Yes, they need a good one. But they have to massively upgrade the O line and maybe 80% of the overall D immediately this off season. It makes no sense to package a bunch of picks to move up for a top QB who will be wrecked behind the O line. Get the O line right in '18, use '19 to get the QB and get the D started in the right direction, use '20 to fill it out. In 4 or 5 years, they should be ready to make a run at post season play.

 

You are probably right, its sucks to be 2-3 years out again.

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35 minutes ago, fansince88 said:

Im not going to be popular here at all for this but Nathan is not the player we saw Sunday. He played horrible. Dont sell him down the river yet. Your points on taking the steps and getting this team built for the long haul are spot on. Build the team. It is too old and slow. Give McD time and we will eventually  be good.

Right there with ya, fan

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36 minutes ago, fansince88 said:

Im not going to be popular here at all for this but Nathan is not the player we saw Sunday. He played horrible. Dont sell him down the river yet. Your points on taking the steps and getting this team built for the long haul are spot on. Build the team. It is too old and slow. Give McD time and we will eventually  be good.

 

Even if he played great down the stretch I would like them to draft a young qb for competition. I don't want to put all our eggs in one basket.

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33 minutes ago, KD in CA said:

 

I keep seeing this but don't really know what it means.  They go back to him by saying, "you're starting this Sunday".  Simple as that.

 

Agree. It would take swallowing pride and slowing down the "building my my team" rush that caused the disaster that was Sunday in the first place. I think the credibilty in the locker room goes up with admitting a bad judgement thing vs, "no regrets". If there is any NFL player that has shown the class and leadership to shake off a BS benching to come back and help the team it's TT in all 3 seasons he's been here. Pure class.

 

Everyone on this board that's convinced TT should go should read this - to the end - from before the game Sunday:

 

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2744427-by-benching-tyrod-taylor-bills-are-committing-the-cardinal-sin-of-coaching

 

If I was this writer I would do a part 2 "told u so" piece and add that TT actually won the second half.

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I'm not counting Peterman out completly...the man got no help. O line is awful, recievers are injured and the ones playing never went up and fight for the ball...and the defense is a mess. The game got out of hand so fast that it forced them to run more pass plays instead of ground and pound. They put they kid in during a few week span where we are historically one of the worst teams in NFL history   

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32 minutes ago, billspro said:

 

I meant I don't see them going with him as the starter next year. He does not appear to be a part of the process.

 

 

 

Oh yeah, no question there.  He's been the caretaker for 3 years.  Time to either finally find the real QB or at least a different caretaker (which is usually what the Bills do).

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This draft is loaded with good QB talent.  You absolutely trade up for a top flight guy.  Have him sit behind a vet if needed to get a draft to build up the lines.  QB is the most important position.  It fixes other positions in the field.  If they don't get a QB this year I'm just about done.  

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1 hour ago, fansince88 said:

Im not going to be popular here at all for this but Nathan is not the player we saw Sunday. He played horrible. Dont sell him down the river yet. Your points on taking the steps and getting this team built for the long haul are spot on. Build the team. It is too old and slow. Give McD time and we will eventually  be good.

It all depends on the mental strength of Peterman,it's going to be very difficult to overcome the sunday

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Maybe Tyrod steps up his game a little?  The fact that he got benched might actually be a good thing in the long run.  It could be good motivation for him and he won't checkdown as much.  

 

Not saying he's the long term answer but I'm interesting in seeing how he plays out the rest of the year

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1 hour ago, BILLriant said:

I'm not counting Peterman out completly...the man got no help. O line is awful, recievers are injured and the ones playing never went up and fight for the ball...and the defense is a mess. The game got out of hand so fast that it forced them to run more pass plays instead of ground and pound. They put they kid in during a few week span where we are historically one of the worst teams in NFL history   

 

Have to be honest, I’d like to see Peterman start again - that game did get away super fast (and it all happened right in front of where we were sitting 😢).

 

After KB got hurt, the tipped pick, then a couple poor passes picked while getting smacked in the face (can’t do that, obvi) and we were done.  It was crazy to watch.

 

While everyone wants to blame it all on NP, or TT for that matter, the its never that simple - it’s a team sport and ours ain’t that good right now...

 

At least get Nate some action so we know if we have a serviceable back up next year.  Drought be dammned.

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2 hours ago, fansince88 said:

Im not going to be popular here at all for this but Nathan is not the player we saw Sunday. He played horrible. Dont sell him down the river yet. Your points on taking the steps and getting this team built for the long haul are spot on. Build the team. It is too old and slow. Give McD time and we will eventually  be good.

Imo, some sense... when it doesn't seem to be all that common at the moment.

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2 hours ago, JoeF said:

I believe a good QB can hide so many other flaws.  A good, young QB is a ticket to perennial playoff contention.    The Bills are going to finish 5-11 or 6-10.  The D will not improve the rest of the way.  This puts them drafting in the top 10--around number 8. 

 

Bills have several options drafting this high. 

 

1) Package the Chiefs #1 (around 25) and our number one and our number 2 should net us a top 3 pick.  Assume that Darnold stays in school.  You are looking at Rosen, Allen, Mayfield, Rudolph.  If the Bills can get Allen or Rosen -- I would go for it.

 

2) Stay put at 8- Look at a QB like Clayton Thorson (NW), Luke Falk (Washington State), Jarret Stidham (Auburn)--at 8 you can put this expensive scouting staff to work and find the gem in what others consider the second tier.  Honestly, depending on who declares, the second tier this year is quite good.  Its a buyers market.  If the Bills do this, they may also look at hedging their bets with a veteran who has starting experience.  I believe any of these three QBs is better than the two QBs the Bills have spent mid-first rounders on recently.  If Allen and Rosen are off the board and the Bills could not trade up -- I would stay put and take what others consider to be a second tier or grab Rudolph or Mayfield if they drop past the QB needy teams for some reason.  If its Mayfield -- I could see him doing a table drop tailgate shot at some point.

 

We'll hear all the bull **** this spring-- they reached, blah, blah, blah.  There is no such thing as a reach for a QB.  You scout like hell and then pick the best of the lot at your pick.  Its not a reach...its a bet.  

 

If you go with option 2 -- Focus on the lines in the Draft (Except go hard after Star Lotulelei)  and the skill positions in FA.  The last couple of years there are always skill position players who end up on the scrap heap in the offseason (See Jeremy Maclin) -- take advantage of this.

 

 

Whatever we do, it better not involve trading up for Josh Allen. That dude sucks.

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I'm all in on using Peterman the rest of the year, tanking, and being in a better draft position to get a Franchise QB.

 

In 2006 there were 2 or 3 blue chip prospects.

Jared Goff, and Carson Wentz

 

Last year, there were maybe 2 or 3 blue chip QB choices;

Patrick Mahomes, Deshaun Watson, maybe Mitchell Trubinski

 

This year, there's going to be 5 or 6 blue chip choices

Sam Darnold, Josh Rosen, Baker Mayfield, Lamar Jackson, Josh Allen

 

We could take any one of these guys and it's a huge improvement.

 

Just pray we go 6-10

 

 

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