Jump to content

Downtown stadium update...


LabattBlue

Recommended Posts

This lot is right next to the casino down there and not far from FNC.

 

Also, one corner or the stadium is on....

 

MIAMI STREET.

 

Bad karma man

 

Looking at the satellite view it doesn't look like a residential property is anywhere near there.

It's all commercially zoned large buildings, or so it appears from the satellite.

I was just down there at Xmas time; it's like an abandoned ghost town in that area...

 

I don't know, man, I kind of like it -- as in, we own Miami Street.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 70
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

 

I was just down there at Xmas time; it's like an abandoned ghost town in that area...

Come down in the summer. Buffalo River Fest Park is there now. And while it's small, it's very nice:

 

http://thevalleycenter.com/buffalo-river-fest-park/

 

https://www.google.com/search?q=buffalo+river+fest+park&espv=2&biw=1280&bih=909&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0CAcQ_AUoAmoVChMI-e2PooeOyAIVCJeICh0Q3AyN

Edited by Lurker
Link to comment
Share on other sites

What is left on this portion of the lease? 4 or 5 years? That is when I suspect the new stadium will open.

 

I can't tell on the map (and I have the world's worst sense of direction) but is Chef's in there? I was told that Chef's would be relocated to build the new stadium and would be given property (rent free for a while) across from the new stadium. This is a bit of a 2nd hand source so take it fwiw.

I guarantee you that you don't have the worst sense of direction because I do. I have figured out how to compensate for my lack of sensing direction. When I want to go north I head in what I believe to be the southern direction. When I want to go south I head in what I believe to be the northern direction. I follow the same procedure for heading east and west. I refuse to ask directions. Looking at a map confuses me even more. So with great humility I declare myself the person with the worst sense of direction. I will allow you to be runner up but the championship trophy for direction ineptitude is solely mine.

 

Because of my irritating personality I'm often told to get lost. That's what I do well! :wallbash:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The site in the law firm's letter is right across the Buffalo River from the new Riverworks complex which is becoming a really neat addition to the waterfront...

 

riverworks1.jpg

 

 

https://www.google.com/search?q=buffalo+riverworks+development+bar+hockey&espv=2&biw=1280&bih=909&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0CAYQ_AUoAWoVChMIseWqwoSOyAIVSJqICh2JMgFA

well it's a mile away from there. that was kind of my point, i thought it could be closer. but looking at how far away things are from the Ralph I guess that's not that far so my mistake. maybe things will get built up around there to make it more of a destination

Link to comment
Share on other sites

As you describe the site it would seem to fit in very well with the Pegulaville investments. There would be a an excellent mesh and coherency to what he has already done. With Pegula he seems to have a vision and a plan and systematically and professionally acts on his plans.

Actually it appears his wife is the planner, he appears to be the idea man.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

well it's a mile away from there. that was kind of my point, i thought it could be closer. but looking at how far away things are from the Ralph I guess that's not that far so my mistake. maybe things will get built up around there to make it more of a destination

Huh? How about 300 feet. All you have to do is get across the river, as the stadium shown in that law firm's mailing would be on the opposite bank of the river from this photo. There would be all kinds of water taxis, etc to shuttle people back and fourth..

Edited by Lurker
Link to comment
Share on other sites

This lot is right next to the casino down there and not far from FNC.

 

Also, one corner or the stadium is on....

 

MIAMI STREET.

 

Bad karma man

 

Looking at the satellite view it doesn't look like a residential property is anywhere near there.

It's all commercially zoned large buildings, or so it appears from the satellite.

I was just down there at Xmas time; it's like an abandoned ghost town in that area...

 

 

How much worse could the Karma get? 15 years, no playoffs?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Actually it appears his wife is the planner, he appears to be the idea man.

From what I read when Terry Pegula had the idea that he wanted to add rinks near the arena it was his wife Kim who expanded on that idea and came up with a more comprehensive plan that included a hotel, shops and eating establishments at canalside.

 

It just seems that they do things right and get things done. Most often having a plan is the easy part. Executing the plan is the challenge. They have demonstrated that they are up to major challenges. If and when they decide to get involved in a stadium project I'm sure that it will get done. Compare that to the Bass Pro tease and fiasco!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

This looks to me like a sleezy law firm trying to get out in front of a future transaction.

 

First of all, what makes the firm "sleazy" -- every organization, law firm or otherwise, has to look for business. This is the way eminent domain works. Most people don't know anything about it and just accept the check the government offers to take their property, even if they're being screwed.

 

Did you know that eminent domain lawyers don't take any fee off the money the government already offered? Their fee is only based upon the delta between what the government originally offered and the final settlement amount.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Chasing a new stadium appears to me like chasing the latest iPhone...the current one works, but gotta' have the latest version. The hype of the new one obscures the fact that the old one still works realy well.

Edited by Keukasmallies
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Chasing a new stadium appears to me like chasing the latest iPhone...the current one works, but gotta' have the latest version. The hype of the new one obscures the fact that the old one still works realy well.

Not really though, the Bills were recently valued as the least valuable franchise in the NFL. A new stadium presents a clean slate with numerous new revenue streams (not just talking about increased ticket prices) to close the gap between the Bills and the rest of the league.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I presume parking encircles the stafium from that sketch. If so, that's very limited. I realize there's plans for commuter transit, but it kills tailgating. -UNLESS, you get eight weekends at the Pegulaville downtown suites and tailgate in YOUR parking lot..

 

I'm guessing that a new tailgate cottage industry will pop up in satellite locations and across the Buffalo River. I'm thinking of a game day carnival and party by the grain elevators. It will definitely be different than the Ralph experience, but in some respects better.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Not really though, the Bills were recently valued as the least valuable franchise in the NFL. A new stadium presents a clean slate with numerous new revenue streams (not just talking about increased ticket prices) to close the gap between the Bills and the rest of the league.

Why do they NEED to c\lose the gap? The value of the team is relative to their market size, which helps most teams to utilize the stadiums which they control for non-NFL events they can profit from. As Forbes states in its story, "The bigger your domain, the greater the opportunity to cash in on the fantasy and reality of the NFL." Also, winning seems to matter, for those that care. The Colts, are a top 10 revenue team in a small market despite not hosting many non-NFL events (like would happen with a new Bills stadium)... why? They win. Been in the playoffs 16 of 20 years. Same with Green Bay. Win, the seats and suites fill, money rolls in.

 

I guess I don't care about rankings like some do. Somehow, people equate the ranking with some personal valuation. The reality is, the Pegulas are diversifying their domain without the need to diversify revenue streams just for the Bills. That's the beauty of what they're doing. Guys like Skeletor Jones pours all their money into the team and stadium. Pegulas have taken a different and smarter approach. They own tow teams, they built a hotel/bar/rink complex on the edge of a public park at the end of a rail line. They're are into beer now. They sell OneBuffalo merch. They aren't done downtown from what recent stories said. Sure, a new stadium may help, but does incurring millions in debt in a small declining market return the same annually as not owning a stadium that the county keeps improving?

 

Everyone here speculates on what a new stadium means because they want to extrapolate the Cowboys and Patriot model out, which assumes continually regional growth in terms of per capita income, population, and corporate headquarters that will buy higher priced tickets.... none of which are happening. Take a look at regional data. Economies aren't created by building new buildings subsidized on the backs of taxpayers.

 

So someone, sometime provide a rational model of how this purported new stadium improves the profit for the owner, including the assumption about ticket, suite prices, and expected new streams of revenues?

 

I suspect from talking my friends with seasons, many of us would opt out of a new stadium downtown because a) tickets would jump substantially, b) tailgating would decrease or disappear and/or they wouldn't want to sit inside a domed stadium. So in a region with stagnating population and economic growth, they aren't going to just add to the existing season ticket and suite holder base, they will actually need to replace a good number of them before they can increase these numbers.

 

And many will say "Great, higher paying customers will get the riff-raff out." Surely, and then you'll have a Sabres game full of corporate ticket owners and wealthy fans more interested in being seen than attending a game. And that crowd the players and fans love turns into a Miami crowd. And anyone who has gone to a game there knows what I'm talking about.

 

To me, the most sense if a new stadium is built is to do it like Pittsburgh did. Keep it on the small side and do it as cheaply as possible. Make it soccer-ready too and as the MLS grows, the Pegulas have a stadium to buy themselves a soccer team (fingers crossed!).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Why do they NEED to c\lose the gap? The value of the team is relative to their market size, which helps most teams to utilize the stadiums which they control for non-NFL events they can profit from. As Forbes states in its story, "The bigger your domain, the greater the opportunity to cash in on the fantasy and reality of the NFL." Also, winning seems to matter, for those that care. The Colts, are a top 10 revenue team in a small market despite not hosting many non-NFL events (like would happen with a new Bills stadium)... why? They win. Been in the playoffs 16 of 20 years. Same with Green Bay. Win, the seats and suites fill, money rolls in.

 

I guess I don't care about rankings like some do. Somehow, people equate the ranking with some personal valuation. The reality is, the Pegulas are diversifying their domain without the need to diversify revenue streams just for the Bills. That's the beauty of what they're doing. Guys like Skeletor Jones pours all their money into the team and stadium. Pegulas have taken a different and smarter approach. They own tow teams, they built a hotel/bar/rink complex on the edge of a public park at the end of a rail line. They're are into beer now. They sell OneBuffalo merch. They aren't done downtown from what recent stories said. Sure, a new stadium may help, but does incurring millions in debt in a small declining market return the same annually as not owning a stadium that the county keeps improving?

 

Everyone here speculates on what a new stadium means because they want to extrapolate the Cowboys and Patriot model out, which assumes continually regional growth in terms of per capita income, population, and corporate headquarters that will buy higher priced tickets.... none of which are happening. Take a look at regional data. Economies aren't created by building new buildings subsidized on the backs of taxpayers.

 

So someone, sometime provide a rational model of how this purported new stadium improves the profit for the owner, including the assumption about ticket, suite prices, and expected new streams of revenues?

 

I suspect from talking my friends with seasons, many of us would opt out of a new stadium downtown because a) tickets would jump substantially, b) tailgating would decrease or disappear and/or they wouldn't want to sit inside a domed stadium. So in a region with stagnating population and economic growth, they aren't going to just add to the existing season ticket and suite holder base, they will actually need to replace a good number of them before they can increase these numbers.

 

And many will say "Great, higher paying customers will get the riff-raff out." Surely, and then you'll have a Sabres game full of corporate ticket owners and wealthy fans more interested in being seen than attending a game. And that crowd the players and fans love turns into a Miami crowd. And anyone who has gone to a game there knows what I'm talking about.

 

To me, the most sense if a new stadium is built is to do it like Pittsburgh did. Keep it on the small side and do it as cheaply as possible. Make it soccer-ready too and as the MLS grows, the Pegulas have a stadium to buy themselves a soccer team (fingers crossed!).

 

While you bring up a lot of valid points, I cannot imagine Pegula paying $1.4 billion for the franchise and not have an eye to move the Bills downtown to be the final bookend to his Harborside ambitions.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

×
×
  • Create New...