SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 Has the ice age arrived? With all this cold and frozen water mains in DC I predict infrastructure jobs this spring Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
row_33 Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 In the 1970s the same type of con artists were warning about a coming ice age Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Dude Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 I’m not a science man. I’m an educated man, though. What my education taught me was that the overwhelming majority of scientists state that global warming is manmade and bad. Now, if the experts are overwhelmingly convinced of something I’m gonna follow their lead and take the issue seriously. I really wish pollution wasn’t so politicized in America. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azalin Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 1 hour ago, The_Dude said: . I really wish pollution wasn’t so politicized in America. I really wish science wasn't so politicized in America. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 1 hour ago, The_Dude said: I’m not a science man. I’m an educated man, though. What my education taught me was that the overwhelming majority of scientists state that global warming is manmade and bad. Now, if the experts are overwhelmingly convinced of something I’m gonna follow their lead and take the issue seriously. I really wish pollution wasn’t so politicized in America. I'm an educated man, and a "science man," and know of plenty of examples where "the overwhelming majority of scientists" were not only dead wrong, but ignored the evidence they were dead wrong "because there's consensus." 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Dude Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 29 minutes ago, DC Tom said: I'm an educated man, and a "science man," and know of plenty of examples where "the overwhelming majority of scientists" were not only dead wrong, but ignored the evidence they were dead wrong "because there's consensus." I can prove that climate change is natural and has always been a thing. Ancient Mesopotamian settlements prove this. North Africa proves this. But ya know what I do understand when it comes to science? Simple things like the greenhouse effect. We don't freeze at night when the sun goes down because of the greenhouse effect, right? Again, I'm not a science man. So, if that's true and greenhouse gasses act as an insulator, how then will we not increase the temperature of the earth when we add to the greenhouse gasses? Again, I'm not a science man. But it seems simple to me. What am I missing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
row_33 Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 They cannot properly measure the weather of the past, they are grossly wrong in short term predictions and it’s impossible to predict the future under any acceptable form of definition of science unless you just plow ahead and make it up and refuse to admit how precarious it all is Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
row_33 Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 (edited) Predicting weather is worse than predicting stock prices, they both have systems that rely on a Jenga tower of assumptions. Of course they are never wrong because they told you about an assumption that didn’t pan out. It’s not pure science. Edited January 5, 2018 by row_33 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 54 minutes ago, The_Dude said: I can prove that climate change is natural and has always been a thing. Ancient Mesopotamian settlements prove this. North Africa proves this. But ya know what I do understand when it comes to science? Simple things like the greenhouse effect. We don't freeze at night when the sun goes down because of the greenhouse effect, right? Again, I'm not a science man. So, if that's true and greenhouse gasses act as an insulator, how then will we not increase the temperature of the earth when we add to the greenhouse gasses? Again, I'm not a science man. But it seems simple to me. What am I missing? What you're missing is that the quality of your theory is only as good as the accuracy of your tests of the theory...and the accuracy of the tests of global warming is questionable, because of issues with historical measurement, data management, and baselines. Science isn'y hypothesis, or consensus. It's measurement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Dude Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 2 minutes ago, DC Tom said: What you're missing is that the quality of your theory is only as good as the accuracy of your tests of the theory...and the accuracy of the tests of global warming is questionable, because of issues with historical measurement, data management, and baselines. Science isn'y hypothesis, or consensus. It's measurement. Well, I'll say that I don't know enough to disagree with the overwhelming majority of scientists and so I side with them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 Just now, The_Dude said: Well, I'll say that I don't know enough to disagree with the overwhelming majority of scientists and so I side with them. That's fair. For that matter, I disagree with them on issues of process. The broad strokes of the science are relatively sound...but an honest look raises serious questions about the accuracy of it, and the scientific method is badly warped by people conflating it with public policy (simplest example of that being that the IPCC is not a scientific body, but is a political body with the explicit mandate of being biased - it's in their charter.) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
row_33 Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 Anything that Al Gore says beyond “you should look both ways before crossing the street” is malignantly pigheadedly wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unbillievable Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 8 minutes ago, The_Dude said: Well, I'll say that I don't know enough to disagree with the overwhelming majority of scientists and so I side with them. It's fair to say that the general population (and scientists) don't know enough about the climate to make concrete conclusions. It's okay to think that we need more, and better, data to study the problem. However, what makes the whole thing idiotic is creating laws based on predictive models that have repeatedly been proven wrong. It's like some dingbat said the sky was falling, ten people agreed with him, and now we're passing laws requiring everyone to carry umbrellas at all times or pay a fine; because it's a scientific fact that it rains. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
row_33 Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 It’s a politically driven situation and funding is given when you find the “right conclusions” since being wrong is never punished then why not say whatever the $$ supply is leaning on you to find not to say that recycling and thinking about reducing energy waste in your life isn’t a good thing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Dude Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 15 minutes ago, unbillievable said: It's fair to say that the general population (and scientists) don't know enough about the climate to make concrete conclusions. It's okay to think that we need more, and better, data to study the problem. However, what makes the whole thing idiotic is creating laws based on predictive models that have repeatedly been proven wrong. It's like some dingbat said the sky was falling, ten people agreed with him, and now we're passing laws requiring everyone to carry umbrellas at all times or pay a fine; because it's a scientific fact that it rains. So, I can nod my head to that. But here's my issue, I hear people use this to justify pollution. I hate pollution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azalin Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 4 minutes ago, The_Dude said: So, I can nod my head to that. But here's my issue, I hear people use this to justify pollution. I hate pollution. Is your implication that there are people who like pollution? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
row_33 Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 Binding your county to punishment for not meeting standards imposed by Algore people is stupid, especially when nobody else is going to even 1 percent bother to uphold them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Dude Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 5 minutes ago, Azalin said: Is your implication that there are people who like pollution? When it benefits them financially, yeah. Look at fracking for example -- that's awful but it generates money so it's tolerated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdnlng Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 9 minutes ago, The_Dude said: So, I can nod my head to that. But here's my issue, I hear people use this to justify pollution. I hate pollution. Where the hell is this happening? I don't know anyone who favors pollution. The attention given global warming has taken attention away from fighting pollution. Clean water and air is something we all should get behind. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azalin Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 1 minute ago, The_Dude said: When it benefits them financially, yeah. Look at fracking for example -- that's awful but it generates money so it's tolerated. That's not what I asked. Tolerate and like are two completely different things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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